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View Full Version : PMC or African 223 Good? Bad? Anybody Know?


AR Man
February 22, 1999, 04:10 PM
Local gun shop has new PMC 55gr FMJ on sale for $3.28 for 20. Seems like a good deal but How does PMC rate? Good for plinking? Self defense? Long term storage (Y2K)? Aslo have heard just a little regarding African .223 any info on that and above would be greatly appreciated.

.
February 22, 1999, 07:59 PM
I've had good luck with all of PMC ammo, and would assess it roughly on par with the Q-series ammo produced by Winchester. Their .22lr ammo is routinely used for match ammo by many cost conscious competitors, with good to excellent results.

I have had problems with the South African surplus 5.56 ammo in AR type rifles, but not in AK types (e.g. VALMET, Galil, Norinco, Polytech & etc.). I've not yet researched this in detail, but hypothesize that the SA ammo has thicker primer cup material than most other commercial and military "type" ammo. I further suspect the AR series have a lighter firing pin strike than the AK variants, hence the different success with the ammo. Keep in mind that the SA ammo was mfgd for use in the R4, a knock-off of the Israeli Galil, which in turn is basically a VALMET with a Colt barrel. I don't KNOW that this is the case, and won't until I get the time (maybe this summer?) to conduct adequate testing.

If anyone has additional info to substantiate or repudiate this hypothesis, please join in!

[This message has been edited by Mykl (edited February 22, 1999).]

4V50 Gary
February 22, 1999, 08:05 PM
I've shot the PMC match ammo (at least it said Match on the box) with excellant results in my Remington 700 Varminter. 1/2" 5 shot groups at 100 yards. The same ammo shot through my Colt AR gave me 1" groups.

Mexican Aguila (Eagle) is good for spray & pray but not for any serious shooting. Got 4" plus groups with it through the Colt.

chink
February 22, 1999, 08:44 PM
I run some PMC through my AR it worked great.

Ringo
February 22, 1999, 10:26 PM
IME with one lot of ammo, PMC 223 produces more flash in 16" barrels than other brands. Function and accuracy were good, though. YMMV.

Bruce from West Oz
February 26, 1999, 07:50 AM
Early PMC ammo was absolute cr*p. The latest test results I've read (from authoritative sources) indicate it's as good as any of the non-specialised ammo. I'd "bite the bullet" so to speak, and give it a whirl. At that price, what have you got to lose?? (Try buying ammo here -- 22 Hornet >$1 a round!!)

Hiker
February 26, 1999, 08:29 AM
I've shot several hundred rounds of PMC out of my AR15 with no problems, reasonably accurate and clean. My worst muzzle flash/loudest has been experienced while using UMC (Rem "white box") I believe it is loaded a bit hotter.
Hiker

vince weng
February 26, 1999, 09:01 AM
PMC fouls your barrel a lot. I don't consider this is a good ammo to use. Look! you already spent $600+ dollars to your lovely firearm, why you'd like to save few dollars for ammo. To my experience, IMI is both inexpensive and high quality ammo.

Hiker
February 26, 1999, 11:37 AM
AR Man,
Check out www.ar-15.com (http://www.ar-15.com) and read reviews of PMC ammo on the forums page, it is fine for plinking. There are many AR owners who consider this good plinking/training ammo.

Old .223 PMC is a bit dirty, the new PMC stuff is on par with most white box ammo and is much cleaner than some of the older surplus military ammo. IMI, Hawksview($150 per 1000rds.)and Georgia-Arms($150 per 1000rds) are excelent choices also but must be mail ordered with copy of drivers licence.

My AR15 rifle cost MUCH more than $600, at least twice that and I have no problem shooting PMC ammo. No matter what ammo you shoot you should clean your weapon thouroughly after each outing. I notice no signifigant difference when I shoot PMC ammo during cleaning.

As long as it isn't corrosive I'm not too concerned with plinking ammo that is a little dirty if it is readily available, cheap and I don't have to mail order it (Uncle Sam may be tracking ammo usage).

Hiker
February 26, 1999, 11:37 AM
sorry for the double mouse click!

[This message has been edited by Hiker (edited February 26, 1999).]

chink
February 26, 1999, 06:50 PM
I put 360 rounds of PMC through my AR wasn't to dirty. I just ordered some ammo for Hawkview cheap and I've heard good stuff about it. If Uncle Sam is tracking my ammo buying habits, then he'll know that I'm well stocked and not to bother me.

Rob Pincus
February 27, 1999, 01:41 AM
I'll put in another vote of support for the PMC.

Bulldog
February 27, 1999, 01:46 AM
Check that last AR-15 url. I think it's www.ar15.com (http://www.ar15.com) .

Chuck
March 17, 1999, 08:55 PM
The South African shot great in my Colt 16". I could group around an inch with iron sights with it. Didn't have one malfunction in about 600 rounds.

spleenandideal
March 17, 1999, 10:24 PM
Just purchased 2 cases of the new '98 manufactured South African stuff with the gazelle on the box. After blowing through about 200 rounds through various ARs and a mini-14, I'll have to give it a big thumbs up. Shiny brass, tight groups, not very dirty, consistent loads. No failures. Pretty boxes. I cannot really tell if there is a big muzzleblast, due to sunny conditions, but if this is a concern, steer clear of the Guatemalan stuff. Now, the older battle-packed SA .223 I heard is berdan-primed but clean shooting too. Try both the PMC and the new SA ammo--either way you won't be disappointed. I'd give an edge in accuracy and easier clean-up to the SA.

Destructo6
March 20, 1999, 04:11 AM
I've not had any problems with PMC ammo. Israeli, yes, but not PMC.
If you have the proper barrel twist, Classic Arms (800)383-8011 has Russian .223 with a 62 grain bullet for $129.95/1000 that works out to $2.60/20. I don't know your feelings on Russian steel case ammo, but I have not had any trouble with it and the price is right.

Bushwhacker
March 20, 1999, 07:29 AM
I have shot PMC in my Mini-14 with no problem,don't have a AR-14 yet :) so can't tell you on that one, have heard somewhere to stay away from using steel case in AR-15,but have not used steel case ammo myself so can't say.

------------------
Justice for one,Justice for all.

busted1200
June 23, 2008, 06:30 PM
oh yes, the good ole days when you could get .223 for 3.28 a box, actually I remember back in the mid 90's when I could get it for 2.99 a box.

billindenver
June 23, 2008, 07:23 PM
The only PMC advice I will throw out there is it doesn't appear to be reloadable. There is some sort of strange lining or insert in the primer area, either that or the primers break apart when you extract them.....either way, I throw that brass away now.

lt dan
June 24, 2008, 03:02 AM
i dont know the pmc ammo refered to, but i did have extensive training on the south-african ammo and the R4-see the thread of staffmemeber on 03/99.

i am no expert on ammo or the ar variant but we experienced no problems with our ammo in the R4. however the hypothesis of the staffmember that the problem can be with the firing pin in the ar series sounds fair.

in the same thread spleenandideal talks about "the sa stuff with the gazelle on the box" please note that this is the comercial variant of the sa mill surplus ammo. both produced by a company named PMP. the pmp ammo are vary popular amongst overseas hunters when they hunt over here.

i know that when the international service shoots take place over here the us soldiers bring along their own ammo, which differ from the sa ammo.

jakeswensonmt
June 24, 2008, 11:08 AM
I've had good results with PMC. You're not going to see that price again anytime soon...