Loading Auto shotgun ?????

Dfariswheel · September 22, 2002, 04:01 PM

I had a young, new to shooting relative stop by this morning to ask my advice on which auto shotgun to buy.
He asked one of those questions that makes you stop and think, but I couldn't come up with a good answer. It's something you just don't consider, even after a life time of working around and on guns.

Why can you reload a pump shot gun, by just stuffing shells into the magazine, but on auto guns, you have to press some type of release before the carrier will allow the mag to be loaded?.

I explained about bolt releases, but he asked why that would have any effect on loading, and why you couldn't load like a pump.

I started to explain about safety features and magazine feed systems, but stopped and realised that when you think of it, WHY CAN'T you load it like a pump?

For the life of me, I can't come up with a good reason why a shotgun needs a lock on the loading system, or why a shotgun couldn't be built that would allow pump-like loading without fumbling with a button of some sort. but still have a bolt lock system.

I'm no amateur around guns, but am I missing something?

rugerfreak · September 22, 2002, 04:50 PM

Depends on the autoloader----Remingtons can be loaded like a pump--------while the Italian ones can't---------think there is some law in Italy that mandates a magazine cut off.

Dfariswheel · September 22, 2002, 08:08 PM

Actually, no you can't load a Remington 1100 or 1187 like a pump. You still have to depress the lock button on the bottom of the lifter.

I've delt with auto's from Browning, Remington, High Standard, Winchester, and other American makers, and all of them require a button to be depressed to unlock the lifter.

I just can't think of a valid reason why this is necessary, "safety" issues aside.

rugerfreak · September 22, 2002, 09:19 PM

Its been 10 years since I owned an 11-87-------but I remember it being a heck of a lot easier to load and unload than my Beretta I currently own-------which is a major pain in the rear----lol.

beagle1 · September 23, 2002, 06:58 AM

The Browning A5 can be loaded via the magazine [speed loading]you need not push any buttons.
I think that the reason for having to unload the 391 via the magazine may be a percieved safety feature ,since the shell does not process through the chamber less chance of an accidental discharge.Ive never had an accidental discharge while ejecting the A5 in 40 someodd years.
Best
Charlie

Jim Crews · September 27, 2002, 11:42 PM

On the Remington, the Carrier Release button is the equivalent of a slide stop on a self loading handgun. The action locks to the rear when the shotgun is empty. Pressing the carrier release button closes the action and if there is a shell on the carrier, it will load into the chamber.

There are a minimum of 5 methods to unload the 870, there are a minimun of 3 methods to unload the 1100/11-87.

The 1100/11-87 can be fitted with an 870 trigger assembly, but you sacrifice the bolt lock feature. Then you could load the 1100/11-87 in the same manner as the 870.

You cannot load an 11-87 with the hammer down. In order to load the 11-87, the hammer must be cocked. To do so, you have to open the action, which if it is unloaded will lock open, which means you will have to depress the carrier release button to close the bolt, allowing the shell carrier to rise far enough to be able to insert a shell into the magazine.

The Benneli does not require you to depress a loading gate release or shell carrier release to load the magazine, but the operating system is different.

The answer to his question lies in reading the manufacturers owners manual before operating the equipement as each type of shotgun is slighly different.

Jim

Westicle · September 28, 2002, 12:21 PM

I have a beretta 1200FP riot gun and here is the run dry reload procedure I use,

- Last shot locks bolt open
- put one round in reciever
- push button to close action
- top up magazine

with the beretta the shell lifter is locked down if the bolt is locked back or the gun is uncocked, you can only add rounds IF slide is forward and the gun is cocked.

so as long as the gun is cocked with the slide forward you can top off the magazine no problem.

where people are running into problems is by keeping thier guns "cruiser ready" ie: magazine full and the hammer down on closed bolt. with the italian guns the best and safest way to have it "cruiser ready" is to load the magazine, fire the gun on an empty chamber which should then put a round onto the lifter.

leave it like that, cycle the bolt and the round goes in the chamber.......

September 22, 2002, 04:01 PM	#1
Dfariswheel Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2001 Posts: 7,478	Loading Auto shotgun ????? I had a young, new to shooting relative stop by this morning to ask my advice on which auto shotgun to buy. He asked one of those questions that makes you stop and think, but I couldn't come up with a good answer. It's something you just don't consider, even after a life time of working around and on guns. Why can you reload a pump shot gun, by just stuffing shells into the magazine, but on auto guns, you have to press some type of release before the carrier will allow the mag to be loaded?. I explained about bolt releases, but he asked why that would have any effect on loading, and why you couldn't load like a pump. I started to explain about safety features and magazine feed systems, but stopped and realised that when you think of it, WHY CAN'T you load it like a pump? For the life of me, I can't come up with a good reason why a shotgun needs a lock on the loading system, or why a shotgun couldn't be built that would allow pump-like loading without fumbling with a button of some sort. but still have a bolt lock system. I'm no amateur around guns, but am I missing something?

September 27, 2002, 11:42 PM	#6
Jim Crews Member Join Date: December 4, 1998 Location: Stevensville, Montana Posts: 84	Loading and unloading On the Remington, the Carrier Release button is the equivalent of a slide stop on a self loading handgun. The action locks to the rear when the shotgun is empty. Pressing the carrier release button closes the action and if there is a shell on the carrier, it will load into the chamber. There are a minimum of 5 methods to unload the 870, there are a minimun of 3 methods to unload the 1100/11-87. The 1100/11-87 can be fitted with an 870 trigger assembly, but you sacrifice the bolt lock feature. Then you could load the 1100/11-87 in the same manner as the 870. You cannot load an 11-87 with the hammer down. In order to load the 11-87, the hammer must be cocked. To do so, you have to open the action, which if it is unloaded will lock open, which means you will have to depress the carrier release button to close the bolt, allowing the shell carrier to rise far enough to be able to insert a shell into the magazine. The Benneli does not require you to depress a loading gate release or shell carrier release to load the magazine, but the operating system is different. The answer to his question lies in reading the manufacturers owners manual before operating the equipement as each type of shotgun is slighly different. Jim __________________ Jim Crews PO Box 556 Stevensville, Montana 59870 406-777-3557 Cell 602-549-7389 http://www.marksmans.com

September 28, 2002, 12:21 PM	#7
Westicle Senior Member Join Date: June 14, 2000 Location: Fort St. John / BC / CANADA Posts: 174	I have a beretta 1200FP riot gun and here is the run dry reload procedure I use, - Last shot locks bolt open - put one round in reciever - push button to close action - top up magazine with the beretta the shell lifter is locked down if the bolt is locked back or the gun is uncocked, you can only add rounds IF slide is forward and the gun is cocked. so as long as the gun is cocked with the slide forward you can top off the magazine no problem. where people are running into problems is by keeping thier guns "cruiser ready" ie: magazine full and the hammer down on closed bolt. with the italian guns the best and safest way to have it "cruiser ready" is to load the magazine, fire the gun on an empty chamber which should then put a round onto the lifter. leave it like that, cycle the bolt and the round goes in the chamber....... __________________ *PROUD TO BE CANADIAN*

September 22, 2002, 04:50 PM	#2
rugerfreak Senior Member Join Date: March 26, 2001 Posts: 819	Depends on the autoloader----Remingtons can be loaded like a pump--------while the Italian ones can't---------think there is some law in Italy that mandates a magazine cut off.

September 22, 2002, 08:08 PM	#3
Dfariswheel Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2001 Posts: 7,478	Actually, no you can't load a Remington 1100 or 1187 like a pump. You still have to depress the lock button on the bottom of the lifter. I've delt with auto's from Browning, Remington, High Standard, Winchester, and other American makers, and all of them require a button to be depressed to unlock the lifter. I just can't think of a valid reason why this is necessary, "safety" issues aside.

September 22, 2002, 09:19 PM	#4
rugerfreak Senior Member Join Date: March 26, 2001 Posts: 819	Its been 10 years since I owned an 11-87-------but I remember it being a heck of a lot easier to load and unload than my Beretta I currently own-------which is a major pain in the rear----lol.

September 23, 2002, 06:58 AM	#5
beagle1 Member Join Date: December 23, 2001 Location: Maine Posts: 17	The Browning A5 can be loaded via the magazine [speed loading]you need not push any buttons. I think that the reason for having to unload the 391 via the magazine may be a percieved safety feature ,since the shell does not process through the chamber less chance of an accidental discharge.Ive never had an accidental discharge while ejecting the A5 in 40 someodd years. Best Charlie