gun world trashes the Sig P225

[leej]

This months Gun World Magazine has an article written by Duane Thomas. This is what Duane Said about the new Sig P239 being a better gun than the Sig P225.

Duane Thomas said that the magazines of the P225 were not well constructed. Duane Thomas said that the feed lips often wore prematurely or often spread apart causing malfunctions.

My question is this. Is the construction of the newer model P229 any different. I have obeserved on my P220 and my P226 that the magazine is of a cross hatch pattern that is spot welded together on the spine of the magazine as opposed to the traditional continuous welded seam of the traditional type of magazine construction. Does the new P229 have the cross hatch pattern or the tradtional continuous welded seam? I have read that the cross hatch spot welded magazine sometimes come apart under hard usage. So far this had not happened to either one of my guns.

Duane Thomas also stated that the new Sig P229 has a solid stainless steel slide that is slimer and stronger than the Sig P225 that had a wider slide because of its stamped sheet metal construciton that had to be large enough to hold the solid steel breach block that is inserted into it.

Duane Thomas also seemed to hint that the P229 is not as reliable in .357 Sig caliber and 40 S&W caliber due to excess slide velocity.

Any one out there had any problems with his Sig P229 in .357 or 40 S&W in regards to reliability? Just Curious because I have often thought of buying a P229 in Sig. 357 caliber.

I am surprised to see such an article in "Gun World" magazine that is truthful about the performance of the weapon. Perhaps the Sig P225 has been discontinued so Gun World was therefore able to publish an honest report on this weapon.

By the way on the continuous welded seam magazine, you will not be able to see the seam on the spine of the magazine because on a well constructed magazine they grind down the weld flush with the spine of the magazine and then they blue it. The weld therfore disappears and the spine of the magazine looks smooth with no trace of the weld visible.

On some magazines they do leave a trace of the weld and you will be able to see a verticle weld line running top to bottom on the spine of the magazine.

On a cross hatch pattern magazine you will see a small spot weld on each or every other of the cross hatchs on the spine of the magazine.

[jaysouth]

If memory serves me, Duane Thomas wrote an article about a year ago extolling the virtues of the Sig 225. After reading the article, I wondered if Thomas was on the Sig payroll. According to the article, it was the ne plus ultra choice for IDPA. The article was accompanied by photos of Thomas(all his articles are accompanied by a lot of photos of him) in shooting stances and drawing from the Del Fatti holster that he assured us readers was made "just for him".

I have one that I bought used and have fired several thousand rounds through it. So far, so good. I really like the way it feels in my hands and how it points, so much for a scientific assessment.

Regarding the durability of a stamped Sig slide VS. a milled stainless Sig slide......If I could afford to buy enough ammo to wear out a Sig with a stamped slide (220-225-226-228) I would not worry about the expense of replacing with another one.

The 225 and 228 remain in production despite the legends that you hear from gun show and forum commandos.

However, if you want a small single stack 9MM, you would do well to look at the 239. It is a fine weapon.

[AndABeer]

Never heard of Mr. Thomas but the 225 is my favorite SIG. Mine has thousands of rounds through it with no malfunctions and is perhaps the most accurate 9mm I have ever shot.

YMMV
OALA

[Handy]

Could you please go back and re-edit your post with new numbers or clarification? It sounds like you're comparing the similar 225 and 239 models, but 229 keeps getting slipped in there and I don't follow which model is having problems.

As far as mag wear goes, worn or spread feed lips shouldn't have much to do with the welds on the back of the mag.

The criticism about slide construction is true, but pointless. Stamped slides with seperate breechblocks are strong enough and don't break or wear out faster in guns designed for their use.

[MedicatedOne]

Duane Thomas is a fool. I have read lots of his garbage.

Dave Thomas makes great burgers and chili. I have eaten lots of his food.

Laters,
MO :cool:

[Ala Dan]

"Real men knoweth what they speak of"; Duane Thomas
apparently knows next to nothing about Sig's.:D All his
articles need to be compiled and submitted to the nearest
garbage container.:) "Fools and idiot's speak from their
inexperience's"; undoubtedly Mr. Thomas is at the top
of the heep.:cool:

Regards,
Ala Dan, Life Member N.R.A.

[Walt Sherrill]

I quit subscribing to Handguns magazine, to a large extent because so much of Duane Thomas' articles were printed there.

Libourel, the editor, moved to Gun World, and has apparently taken Duane with him, as that magazine is now infested with more of Duane Thomas.

He considers himself God's model pistolero, and makes that point in every article he writes. If he is half as good as he thinks he is, he is very good indeed.

I may have to let my subscription to Gun World run out, too...

(Sigh)

And I like Jan Libourel...

[Marko Kloos]

I'd take that with a grain of salt. The P225 has served as the issue police sidearm in several German states for decades with distinction. My two P225s have been flawless performers as well, like all my SIG Sauers. I've never even seen a jammed or broken P-series SIG, and I've carried and shot the P225 most. Never had a single problem or malfunction in 13 years of P225 ownership.

[JRiggs]

That's a crock. No other way to put it.

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello all. With all due respect to Duane Thomas, what's so different about the feed lips of the P225 vs P220 vs P226 vs BHP vs CZ75/85 vs 1911 vs SIG P210.

Perhaps the newer model SIG-Sauer pistols have "improved" feed lip construction; perhaps this is just something to write about?

I have not heard of frequent catastrophic "lip failures" from the above-listed handguns.

If you like the P225; buy it. Shoot it and enjoy it.

It's a non-issue.

Best.

[J. Parker]

I agree with Walt. I've always liked Jan Libourel. Had a P-225 a few years back that was a real sweet pistol. Don't remember a malfunction of anykind. Traded it for a hi-cap some-thing-or-other.

[Shake]

??

Poor magazine construction or firearm construction?

229. . . 239??

I'm lost. . .

Shake

[Jeff OTMG]

At Handguns Duane was the gober pushing S&W. He even ran two editorials telling us how great S&W was along with a bunch of articles on S&W products. This was about one year ago.

There is nothing wrong with the P225. He is also either a liar or an idiot. The P229 is extremely reliable in .357 SIG regardless of slide velocity. The Texas DPS, when transitioning from the .45 ACP P220 to the .357 SIG P229 and P226, fired over 300,000 rounds with no malfunctions. It doesn't get any more reliable than that.

It almost sounds like SIG asked him to bad mouth the P225 to steer customers to the more recent models.

[stans]

I used to subscribe to Handguns magazine, but the writings of Duane Thomas finally made me drop my subscription. I also grew tired of Libourel's articles. For a while, it seemed that every gun reviewed was great, even when the shooting public knew better. Just my two cents, perhaps I am wrong, wouldn't be the first time.

[WESHOOT2]

No better or worse than other quality brands, regardless of mystique.

[juliet charley]

I am surprised to see such an article in "Gun World" magazine that is truthful about the performance of the weapon.
Which Gun World have you been reading? --Surely, not the Gun World edited by Jan Libourel. Jan Libourel is a good magazine editor--his job is to ensure sales not accuracy. --And like all good editors, he knows controversey sells so he prints authors like Duane Thomas and Ed Sanow--the one regular contributor who is actually worse (less accurate, more full of humus). than Duane Thomas.

Enjoy reading Gun Wordl occassionally, but just remember if the byline reads Duane Thomas or Corporal Ed Sanow (or Evan Marshall) read it only for enjoyment (or to get your blood pressure) and not for accuracy--then file it under humus. These articles are published to sell magazines and are not to be taken seriously.

[CastleBravo]

Getting useful information from your typical gun rag is like getting military advice from Belize -- consider the source. :D

[1911A1 fan]

Duane Thomas was the same guy that said 10 years ago that the .45 acp would be on it's way out in 10 years :p

[Will Beararms]

Gun world is owned by Larry Flint. Consider the source ---- a sick puke bent on filling our society with his sewage.

[Will Beararms]

Gun world is owned by the sick puke Larry Flint. Consider the source.

[Will Beararms]

Gun world is owned by the sick puke Larry Flint. Consider the source. A good editor is there to assure sales versus accuracy? Exactly why those of us with one sixteenth of a brain left don't even thumb a gun rag at the grocery store much less buy one.

[Erich]

Don't hold back, Will! :)

[RH Factor]

I love my Sig 239 40cal...and if I had the money and a Sig 225 would be available..I'd get it in a heartbeat...he's a butthead.
But that's just my opinion:D

[lonegunman]

Does Larry Flynt really own GunWorld Magazine?

[DAVID NANCARROW]

IMO, the only problem with lips is that Mr. Thomas has a set that won't stop moving. I got really fed up with his monthly "this is the best gun in the universe" articles, where you could be assured that whatever he was hawking that month was his latest free toy. Wouldn't surprise me one bit if Jennings sent him a .25 how great they would suddenly become.
Between him and Libourel trying to tell folks that a Colt SAA is just not a very accurate pistol-well, maybe not in his hands, but I've shot a few and never met one I couldn't hit with. Only thing stopping me from buying one is that I don't want to take out a bank loan to get it!
Don't get me wrong-a bit of controversy is a healthy thing, such as O'Connor and Mr. "Hell, I was there". Both of them were right at times, but even Col. Cooper was caught slamming the 45 back in the sixties, what with its "death trap" grip safety and whatnot. He's now the "expert" on the 1911.
Used to be a liberal was someone you may not have agreed with, but you could understand their position. All I do now is give them the cock-eyed dog look, trying to figure if they ever did say anything! The latest generation of gunwriters really gives me the raging case of the hershey squirts. The last one I really liked is gone, and we are less fortunate for not having Bob Milek around.

[dsk]

I quit subscribing to Handguns magazine, to a large extent because so much of Duane Thomas' articles were printed there.

Libourel, the editor, moved to Gun World, and has apparently taken Duane with him, as that magazine is now infested with more of Duane Thomas.

He considers himself God's model pistolero, and makes that point in every article he writes. If he is half as good as he thinks he is, he is very good indeed.

I may have to let my subscription to Gun World run out, too...

(Sigh)

And I like Jan Libourel...

I agree with all the above. When I first read an article by Duane, he was claiming that a heavily customized 1911 was the creme de la creme. A few months later, anybody who didn't leave his 1911 bone stock was a fool. A few months after that, the SIG P228 was tops and the 1911 on its way out. And then a little while after that, the SIG was too bulky, and the Glock 19 was now tops. He even went so far as to write an article completely trashing the 1911. In fact, he wrote several about how antiquated and unreliable they are, and that anybody who believes in the .45's stopping power over a 9mm must also believe in fairies (his words!).

I actually met him once at a local range. To be honest I've met individuals who were a LOT more rude, but he asked to quickly borrow my binoculars and I let him. Pretty soon he was using them for himself and I had to get them back!

He is very good at aquiring knowledge and CAN write good articles, but unfortunately he's also a bit egotistic and it shows.

[WESHOOT2]

We still have some good ones, but we have some serious hacks, too.

I get AH (and Front Sight, and whatever they call the NRA mag today). I used to get them all.....

I like Wiley Clapp, and Taffin, and Lawson and Hamilton and Ayoob and James and Petty and some others.......but I miss Ross Seyfried and Elmer Keith and Nonte and the old days when velocity and accuracy (not the 10-15 yd kind) were tested with each gun.

[OF]

Two words: SWAT Magazine. 100% DT Free.

- Gabe

[blades67]

I'm going to write a letter to Thomas and have him send me that poor POS P225 so that it won't bother him any more.:rolleyes:

[signalzed]

I too dropped Handguns magazine because of the incessant drivel from this writer/hack.

He exemplifies the definition of prostitute, sucking up to whoever is giving him cool stuff to play with for his articles. If he doesn't say it's the greatest thing, they won't send him more.

However, there are other writers who have had much more experience sucking up, playing flavor of the month, and are actually worse than Mr. Thomas.

[Shawn Dodson]

Two words: SWAT Magazine. 100% DT Free. That may not be the case. If you don't like DT, you better voice your feelings to Denny and Rich.

[OTISZ]

Duane Thomas is a flake!! As was said above, he is like the wind. He chages direction everytime he puts pen to paper. I will not read his articles and find it very refreshing that he is no longer writng for Handguns Magazine, which I still hold a subscription. Anyone who quotes this guy as an expert, or even knowledgable needs to do some research. He is a ZERO!!!!:barf:

[mec]

Actually Flint published "Modern Gun" a rag that swirled down the porceline vortex years ago. GunWorld was owned by Jack Lewis who sold it and the current people have Japanese sounding names. The story about being owned by Larry Flint is sometimes applied to American Handgunner too.- generally by a competitor. AH was never owned by Flint. It's publisher did employ Hugh Hefner for a while. told him his cockeyed idea for a mens magazine would never get off the ground.

If Dwaine Thomas is even a little bit polite, he's light years ahead of some of the gws. Actually, I kind of enjoy his enthusiasm. He started out pure 1911 -probably because he's been to all the big name shooting schools around the country. He then seemed to gravitate toward Glocks. He can right a good article.

Several years ago, the SIG 220, 225 and 226 were all the rage. Part of this was because they were made in Germany and cost a lot of money. When the 229 came out, with its domestaic made monolythic slide, the prices started to drop and some of the Conspicuous Consumption glitter went away.
I never read a negative thing about the SIGS in any magazine review until very recently. A DPS instructor when asked why the department issued SIG 220s ( Now they have a .357 sig) his response was " Because its the best money can buy." I asked him if they ever had problems with the 220s and he said that occasionaly, the pins that heald the recoil plate in the stamped slide would break allowing the hardened part to fall out.

Later, after SIG pretty much swithed over to one piece forged slides we started hearing about the above problem in gun publications. When they reconfigured the magazines, we began reading about magazine failures in the earlier guns.

Often when you pick up a gun magazine and see the line. " The best, most reliable, strongest most accurate handgunn in history!!" , it was stuck in there by the editorial crew rather than the cringing and embarrassed writer.

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello, Weshoot2! I figured I was the only one here old enough to remember George C. Nonte, Jr, Keith, et al. Nice to see another old guy! (Bhahahahahahahha) Happy New Year to all.

By the way, in my humble opinion, there's more to be learned from some folks on these boards than the magazines.

Best.

[Jeff OTMG]

Let us not forget Col Askins, Skeeter Skelton, and if you are a rifle shooter Jack O'Connor. I have all the Gun Digests published back to the first edition in 1944, all the Shooters Bibles back to 1943, and a set of Gun's and Ammo mags from 1960 to 1968 and they are filled with the writings of classic gun writers.