Glock Model Differences

[ThomasT]

I have been kicking around the idea of getting a Glock in 9mm. The 9mm is what I have on hand and I am set up to reload for it with lots of supplies. After reading the article below it almost sounds like Glock is not to be trusted unless its a range or gamer gun.

I have a S&W 9VE that I really like and have read it is basically a copy of the Glock 19. I like its size and weight. Would a Glock be better? I haven't shot the 9VE a whole lot but it has never bobbled or shown the slightest hint of a stoppage. Plus with its conventional rifling I can shoot cast bullets from it. Not so much with the Glock.

I know there are tons of Glock fans so I would like to hear your experience with your Glocks. I have shot one. My buddy has what I am sure is a generation one model 17 and it has been flawless. He even accidently loaded it with .380s and it shot and cycled those too.

http://reducerecoil.com/2015/03/difference-between-glock-gen1-glock-gen2-glock-gen3-glock-gen4/

This article makes it sound like the only Glock to own is the generation 4. Or at least a generation 3.

[reddog81]

Glocks are fine. Smith and Wessons are also good guns. Whoever wrote that article sure likes to hear the self talk. Blah blah blah was about all I got out of reading the first half of that article. The switch from gen 1 to gen 2 happened decades ago. You would have to go out of your way to even find a gen 2. You would have to search high and low to find a gen 1.

[jabba21]

I didn't read the article but if it stated or even implied that Glocks should not be trusted or are only good for range guns, then the author is ignorant.

I've owned probably a dozen or more different Glocks over the years and have shot even more than that. Out of the all, I've only had one I had an issue with and that was a Gen 3 Glock 17L.

I've owned Gen 4, 3, 2 and I even had a Gen 1 Glock 17 in the old school Tupperware container with Gen 1 non-metal lined magazines. Like I said, every one has functioned flawlessly aside from the 17L.

Glocks are not perfect and can have breakages or stoppages the same as any other gun. But they do have a pretty solid track record no matter what Gen.


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[SpareMag]

Gen 3 Glocks has the infamous BTF issue (Brass To Face). Upon ejection, Gen3s were noted for tossing hot brass into the face of the user. As with most such issues, there were vocal complaints by a few and silence from many. I fired a range Gen 3 that had a BTF extractor, or so was claimed to be the issue.

Gen 2 and 4s are free of this irk.

I have several Glocks and find them uniformly troublefree. My carry weapon is a Glock 23, bedside is a Glock 19.

I personally don't like the grip, to me it feels like I am sighting a 2x4.

But I certainly trust the Glock to go bang when needed, and NOT go bang when it shouldn't.

[jabba21]

I've never had brass hit me in the face with any of my Glocks.


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[TailGator]

That article had more blather than fact. Some people like Glocks, some don't. The author plainly doesn't.

I saw a lot more reports about early generation 4 Glocks in 9 mm throwing brass at people's faces than generation 3.

I own only one Glock, a generation 3 G26. It is my EDC and has been completely reliable. It shoots accurately and comfortably for me. Glocks in general are very utilitarian but work very well. If you try them out and like them, no reason not to buy one for yourself.

[jmr40]

Despite the critics Glocks have a proven track record of withstanding hard use, neglect, and abuse better than anything ever made. Not saying some other gun isn't just as durable, but so far none have proven it. There are several examples with 300,000 rounds through them with only minor small parts replaced and then several tests like this.

http://www.survival-spot.com/survival-blog/glock-21-torture-test/

Durability and reliability aren't the same. Most any decent quality modern gun will be just as reliable as a Glock. They might require a little more attention and be kept cleaner, but for most people that isn't really much of an issue. I understand that for the average person stuff like this isn't really relevant. Most will not shoot 3,000 rounds through a single gun in a lifetime let alone 300,000 and most won't abuse a gun that way.

But from a military or even LE perspective stuff like that is a real possibility. It wouldn't be unusual at all for a soldier to pick up a gun out of the mud and hope it still works even though the person originally carrying it was just blown to bits from a mortar shell or died in a plane crash.

I like Glocks, but they aren't perfect for every use. I wouldn't have one with a loaded chamber unless it were in a quality holster and on my person. If used in that way I don't see them as anymore dangerous than anything else. If you want to use it any other way there are better options.

But if someone is looking for a plastic framed, striker fired weapon with no traditional safety I still think they are the best option. If that type of gun isn't for you they make many different styles.

[marine6680]

The article was full of "inaccuracies".

The AD the article talks about... knowing how the Glock fire control works, I don't believe it one bit.

The article also suggested that the slides would pop off the rear rails and release the striker... even if the slide did pop off, I doubt there would be a problem.

The striker is partial tension, and should not have the energy required to ignite a primer from its rest position.

Even if the striker did have the energy, the striker block prevents actual contact with the primer.

When your job involves firearms, and an ND can cause you to loose that job, you start making excuses real quick.


I'm not a Glock fan, I hated them until the gen 4 update made them feel less like a 2x4... and more like a 2x3... So now I can tolerate them.


The S&W SD line of pistols are reliable and well made, but the trigger leaves much to be desired. The Glock trigger is adequate and better than the Smith.

Glocks are generally accurate and reliable, if you want one get one.

[TunnelRat]

Gen 3 Glocks has the infamous BTF issue (Brass To Face). Upon ejection, Gen3s were noted for tossing hot brass into the face of the user. As with most such issues, there were vocal complaints by a few and silence from many. I fired a range Gen 3 that had a BTF extractor, or so was claimed to be the issue.

Gen 2 and 4s are free of this irk.

In owning a dozen or so Glocks over the last few years my experience was that it was more to do with a certain production run for a few years than anything specific to one generation. I've got two Gen 3s that run like Swiss watches, one 2005 the other 2006. I have a newer 2012 that required a swap of the ejector to the 30274 version to not bean me in the forehead. The ones I've owned in the last two years from either Gen 3 or Gen 4 have been fine. I just prefer Gen 3.

[ThomasT]

Well your answers were more in line with what I thought about Glocks and not what I read in the article I posted. Thanks JMR40 for the link you posted. I have read that before but had forgotten it.

I am much more of a revolver guy but mainly because I hate losing my brass. But I have several thousand pieces of brass plus its easy to find and also pick up at the range free of charge.

Now I have something to look for at the next gunshow. Like I stated I really like my S&W Sigma. I have the only one I have ever seen that is black on black. I do not like the two tone look. I bought this gun for $325 with a $50 rebate AND two free factory mags so I got a great deal on it. But I think I would like to have a real Glock.

[JohnKSa]

I saw a lot more reports about early generation 4 Glocks in 9 mm throwing brass at people's faces than generation 3.Likewise. Glock introduced new recoil assemblies for the 9mm Gen 4 Glocks specifically to deal with the issue.

[ThomasT]

I just went to Academy Sports and handled a Glock 19. I have to have one. No two ways about it. And in my first post I stated the S&W 9VE I have is a copy of the Glock 19. It is not. As much as I like the S&W the little Glock felt smaller and more solid. It pointed nicely too. I didn't really like the sights but those can be changed I believe.

The Dallas Big Town gunshow is on June 18-19. I will be there with cash in hand. The Academy price was $569. I think I can do better than that if I am patient.

[Spats McGee]

My search for a polymer 9mm started here (https://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=493094) and ended here with a Gen 4 G19 (https://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=535907).

[9x45]

My oldest 2 pin Gen 3 Glock just turned over 200,000 rounds, and never once, ever, had brass to the face. And that goes for the total of 400,000 rounds I have run thru various Glock models since 1992. One time a guy had a chipped extractor from dropping rounds in instead of loading from that magazine to top off to 11 in an IDPA match. The chipped extractor will throw cases at you. The reference article is junk, the Gen 1-3's were the best guns, especially the long railed rears. We have a Gen 1 range gun at the academy that is over 1,000,000 rounds. My G19 Gen 3 is around 70,000 rounds with no issues, and about 20K of that was Win SXT +P+ 127s. Most guys who get Gen 4's change out the stupid double recoil spring, get a nose ring adapter from Lone Wolf, and run them that way. I shoot USPSA matches every weekend, sometimes 6 times a month, and see dozens of other guys running Glocks, but never having brass to the face, unless they change their grip, that can also cause it. Hold you gun like this.

http://californiavtxriders.com/phpBB3/gallery/image37026.jpg

http://californiavtxriders.com/phpBB3/gallery/image37140.jpg

[Dan-O]

I didn't get the memo that Glocks aren't reliable.

[dogtown tom]

ratshooter....The Dallas Big Town gunshow is on June 18-19. I will be there with cash in hand.
Why wait for Bigtown? The Dallas Market Hall show is the 11th & 12th and 3-4times larger.





The Academy price was $569. I think I can do better than that if I am patient.
MAP on a G19gen4 is $539+tax.......there will be several vendors at Market Hall selling them that low.

[ThomasT]

9x45 thanks for the tip on the guide rod replacement. A $30 fix.

Spats I am glad you came to like your glock. I like wood and blue steel same as everyone but else but I am also gregarious. Any gun can play as long as it works and shoots decently well. I have only shot one glock but thought it was a fine shooter. Matter of fact it is accurate as all get out.

I am pretty pumped about the gun right now. I like to think about it a while before I buy but this isn't something that requires a lot of thought. I have just got to decide if I want to spend the money. I found a few cheaper on GB but by the time you add shipping and transfer when it gets here they are really no cheaper than just going and buying one from the store.

The next day or two will tell the tale if I am committed or not.

[krunchnik]

I have owned 6 Glocks in total and can say without a doubt they are very reliable.The only reason I no longer have a Glock is due to the fact I can not shoot them well-but I do like them.Working on them is relatively simple and require few tools.Sights change out very easily with the right tools also.If your going to reload for the Glock I would suggest using Berrys Plated-I don't think the Berrys would present a leading problem-I also think running hard cast bullets at a lower velocity probably would also work.

[ThomasT]

Hey Dogtown I have been to the market hall GS before and from what I remember the parking was a pain in the rear. Are they charging for parking like a lot of GS are doing?

I bet I can find a better price than $539. But you gotta figure in gas and time and parking fee if any and the $30 less than Academy doesn't sound like much of a savings.

I have bid on three IIRC on GB including a couple of gen 3 guns but I am under the sellers reserve on every one of them. I wish sellers would just list the gun for the lowest amount they could live with and stop that silly reserve guessing game.

[JDBerg]

...Like I stated I really like my S&W Sigma. I have the only one I have ever seen that is black on black. I do not like the two tone look. I bought this gun for $325 with a $50 rebate AND two free factory mags so I got a great deal on it. But I think I would like to have a real Glock.

The current Sigma SD9 VE does seem to have a better trigger than the earlier models, I'm pretty sure S&W improved the triggers on the newer ones. I think the new Sigmas are nice guns at a good price point. I have 2 Glocks that are keepers, but if what you already have is working for you, I'm not sure what a Glock would buy you, unless you have another intended purpose for a new Glock that you're not mentioning.

[ThomasT]

JD I have no hidden agenda. I just like a new gun ever once in a while. Some guns just catch my attention and I like to buy them to experiment with. But I admit I don't get to play with them and shoot them as much as I once did. Thats one of the hazards of getting older and why I do not recommend it. Frankly it sucks.:(

But at least I know that whatever I buy will not go down in value. I can always get my money back and some times a little extra. And other times a lot extra. Thats why my wife doesn't harp on me about buying guns. She saw me buy an AK-47 Mak 90 for $250 and a week later sell it for $750. None of the Beanie Babies she bought with the idea of selling for a profit ever panned out like that.

Plus I have never owned a Glock. I would like to see what all the hype is about. This might replace the Sigma as my truck gun. I like basic duty type guns. Guns you aren't afraid to skin up a little.

[ThomasT]

Here is a really good vid on the S&W SD9VE, the newest version. There is nothing wrong with the Smith & Wesson autos. They are lower priced and still work very well. And it kind of points out that a very good gun can be made for much less than what we are being charged. I believe there is a huge markup on the autos we are buying. Revolvers too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1cleMs8xmqc

[9miller]

I just got dumber.

[NavyVet1959]

I own a couple of Glocks, but not in 9mm. For a 9mm firearm, they would not be on my list. I have some for 10mm and a G21 that I converted into a .460 Rowland equivalent loading that I call ".45 SUPER +P+".

For 9mm, I prefer my CZ-75 Compact. I'm just not a fan of plastic guns.

Another nice 9mm is a RIA mid-size .22TCM/9mm with the double stack mags. Even better is that with very little effort, you can convert it to .38 SUPER or (as I'm currently in the process of doing), to .38 SuperComp.

For the .38 SuperComp, you take a .38 SUPER barrel, make your brass out of .223 brass cut down to 0.900", and then load to 9x23 pressure. You also need a slightly heavier recoil spring.

Using the .223 brass Jeff Cooper was able to safely get a 124gr bullet to 1700 fps.

http://www.burnscustom.com/9x23/9x23WhereAreWe.php3

795 ft lbs from a 9mm-class handgun?

Not bad at all...

[Will Beararms]

Full size Gen. 4Glocks have an unusual trait. If you are reasonably fit, they can be concealed fairly well. I can conceal my G4 22 in a kydex IWB holster under a loose,'dark colored T shirt.

The Gen. 4 shines in the .40 Smith and Wesson. All of the updates make it shoot very well. I've owned a Gen. 2 Glock 22, a Gen. 3 Glock 23 and now the Gen. 4 22. Without any back straps, it fits my medium size hand perfectly. Of the three, it is the most accurate and out of any Glock, I've shot it is the most accurate. It has the grey, Teflon like frying pan finish and with no scuffs whatsoever.

I also have an M&P 9 that I like but it's just not balanced or proportioned to carry IWB at appendix position. It looks smaller and less blocky but in application it's a different story.

That said as far as carry, my go to is a Smith and Wesson 442 that I shoot better one handed than I do with two hands but that monster is a handful!!! ;) Back to topic, Glocks are a decent defense tool. With proper care and feeding, your grandchildren will enjoy them if guns are still allowed for the proletariat. I would suggest the Glock 19, Glock 23 or Glock 30s/Glock 30 Gen 4. In full size, I like the way the Gen. 4 17/22. fits. I don't think it's any better, it just handles better.

The new S&W SDVE 9's are a great value IMHO. It's the pistol I suggest to new shooters not wanting to spend a ton but in need of a dependable weapon. I actually like the way they handle and the trigger is much better than it used to be. The thing about the Glock trigger is the reset. Once you master it, you can quickly get shots off and on target. I qualified for the TX License to Carry with my G4 22. I was amazed at how fast I was able to do the drills accurately. There should have been much more shooting in that course but that's a different topic for w different time.

You'll be well served with a Glock. That said, I can't warm up to stuffing a Glock with one in the chamber in an IWB holster near by private equipment.

[ThomasT]

Thanks WILL and Navyvet for the caliber suggestions and Glock experience reports. I am pretty much wedded to the 9mm just because I have so much of it and a large stock of componants to reload for it. I have no plans to take on yet another caliber to stock and reload for.

WILL did you watch that video I posted in my last post? Hickock 45 makes the new S&W SD9VE look like a target pistol. But he is an excellent shot. But anyone can shoot like that with enough practice. I am sure my earlier model S&W9VE will shoot just as well.

I just like a new gun now and then.:D

[dogtown tom]

ratshooter Hey Dogtown I have been to the market hall GS before and from what I remember the parking was a pain in the rear. Are they charging for parking like a lot of GS are doing?
I believe only the Ft Worth show charges for parking, Market Hall definitely does not and never has.

I bet I can find a better price than $539. But you gotta figure in gas and time and parking fee if any and the $30 less than Academy doesn't sound like much of a savings.
Doubtful. Glock's Minimum Advertised Price on a G19 gen4 is $539. If a dealer advertises it lower than that, Glock Inc will cut him off from future sales. The dealer CAN negotiate, but just can't put a lower price on the sticker. He is required to charge Texas sales tax. The likelihood of finding one cheaper than $539 is slim to none.....they sell plenty fine at that price.

[joey.losurdo]

Why not go GSSF 2 year and buy a blue label for $398?


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[ThomasT]

Why not go GSSF 2 year and buy a blue label for $398?

Can you please explain what that is? I would like to know. And welcome to the forum.

Dogtown you may be correct. The $539 may be the best it gets. In that case I would come out just a well buying it for $569 without having to drive to Dallas. A town I hate going to.

[ThomasT]

OK I found this on googlefoo at the Glock forum.

So I have been looking at joining the GSSF, and it is EXTREMELY beneficial for anyone who has been considering it. Membership for 1 year is $35 and two year is $60, but after you have been a member for 12 months, you are eligible for Glock discounts! The gun discounts are as follows.

Glock 17, 17Gen4, 19Gen4, 26Gen4, 22, 22Gen4, 23Gen4, 27Gen4, 31, 32, 33 = $425

I don't think waiting 12 months fits my game plan. But its a nice deal if you aren't in a hurry.

[dogtown tom]

ratshooter OK I found this on googlefoo at the Glock forum.

So I have been looking at joining the GSSF, and it is EXTREMELY beneficial for anyone who has been considering it. Membership for 1 year is $35 and two year is $60, but after you have been a member for 12 months, you are eligible for Glock discounts! The gun discounts are as follows.

Glock 17, 17Gen4, 19Gen4, 26Gen4, 22, 22Gen4, 23Gen4, 27Gen4, 31, 32, 33 = $425

I don't think waiting 12 months fits my game plan. But its a nice deal if you aren't in a hurry.
You won't get the discount by buying a one year membership and waiting 12 months....you'll have to renew in order to get the coupon.
Buy the two year membership and you get your discount coupon immediately.

The only Glock Blue Label dealer in the Dallas area is GT Distributors....and typically has a wait list. (meaning it might be several months before the gun is in your hands)

[ThomasT]

The heck with that. I want it now.:rolleyes:

[JDBerg]

I saw a lot more reports about early generation 4 Glocks in 9 mm throwing at people's faces than generation 3.

I had an early Gen4 Glock 22 that used to bean me with brass like crazy. The Apex Tactical Failure Resistant Extractor is supposed to correct this in the Gen3 & Gen4 9mm 17, 19, & 34 when you use the Glock #30274 Ejector and that #SP01176 non-LCI spring loaded bearing piece that goes on the end of the extractor spring, but my Gen3 17 never had the BTF problem and I've used many types of factory ammo since I've had it.

[Will Beararms]

Hickok45 has been doing this a while. I have respect for anyone who can shot an Airweight Smith and Wesson a ton without flinching. Stay with the caliber that works for you. What we think here is not important. Try Crazy Gun Dealer in Alvarado. You should be able to get a Gen. 4 19 for $539.00.

[ThomasT]

Funny you should mention crazy gun dealer. While driving yesterday I heard his commercial on the radio. Before I could get his number dialed the light I was at turned green so I didn't make the call.

I was down there about 6 weeks ago and was interested in a no lock 442. He wanted about $450 for his in the case. I told him I could get one from Keely Arms for $339 and asked if he could match that. He told me he can't even buy them for that so no he couldn't match. He didn't even offer his at a lower price. So much for his commercial and offer to match anyones price.

Even Buds has them for $381 and free shipping.

P.S. I just checked the Crazy Gun Dealer site and he apparently doesn't even carry Glock pistols.

[Bart Noir]

I personally don't like the grip, to me it feels like I am sighting a 2x4.

For many years that was my tune also.

Then they came out with the Short Frame (SF) version of the .45 and 10mm guns. And now I have a bunch.

Then they came out with the Gen 4 smaller models. And the first Gen 4 G19 I held came home with me. It really is that much better in my hand (no back-straps installed), and even better was the fact it was an virtually unfired-but-used gun with price to match.

So you have to include which version when you talk about grips now.

Bart Noir

[ThomasT]

I just got off the phone with the Crazy Gun Dealer and guess what? They will not quote a price over the phone. You have to drive to their store to see what they want for a gun. And to even get them on the phone you have to listen to what must be at least a one minute commercial each time you call. I have crossed them off my list from now on. Here is the number if you want to listen to their windy message.

855 329-4867

So far Buds has the best deal. $542 + free shipping. Then $25 transfer when it gets here. So $567 total.

[dogtown tom]

ratshooter ....Then $25 transfer when it gets here....
Do you have a CHL/LTC?

[ThomasT]

No dogtown I don't. I see you have slightly better transfer prices but I am in Burleson south of Ft Worth and Plano is a long drive. I guess around 75+ miles away. I use LW guns just off the south loop of Loop 820. Its a husband/wife team and they are really nice folks.

[Blindstitch]

I have SD9VE and the more I shoot it the better it gets. 1500 rounds ago I really hated the heavy trigger. After the apex trigger/spring kits it got better. But I also think in the last 700 or more rounds it has gotten a lot smoother.

I can't wait to see what 1500 more rounds will make it feel like. By the way I hate the double jointed Smith and Wesson trigger and that's the main reason I switched the trigger.

I have shot the glock 17 and yes it feels better but I doubt it feels $200 better. Later on if I buy a glock it will be a 26 for ccw.

By the way Hickock shoots so many revolvers well why wouldn't he be able to shoot the heavy triggered S&W well. One of my favorite joke youtubers.

[JohnKSa]

...I am in Burleson south of Ft Worth and Plano is a long drive...Go to a big gun show in the DFW area and you can beat $567. The DACA show at Market Hall in Dallas is this weekend. You can get into the show at no charge if you donate blood at the Carter Bloodcare Bus in the parking lot.

[Bart Noir]

You can get into the show at no charge if you donate blood . . .

What, become weak and dizzy even before you get into the show?

Sounds like a perfect excuse to lose all restraint and spend lots of money :p

Bart Noir

[AxlMyk]

This convinced me to buy my Glock.
Amazing. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ub4OswUhLwo

[ThomasT]

I just went back to Academy and looked at the Glock 19 one more time. I wanted to compare it for size next to the S&W SD9VE and see what the difference was. They were far closer in size than I realized. The S&W has a slightly longer grip. But slide to slide they are pretty much equal.

So I have came to the conclusion I may just have to be satisfied with the 9VE I already own. I did buy a Fobus holster while there. Its a paddle holster and seems to fit well and is easy to insert and remove.

So thanks to everyone for your stories and input about the Glocks.