The return of old models....

[Mastrogiacomo]

Beretta is bringing back the Brig and Vertec, would S&W ever reissue with the 3913?

Laura

[ATW525]

Probably not. S&W officially dropped all support for 3rd generation guns last year.

[Mastrogiacomo]

I'm actually surprised and kind of sad that S&W has lost interest in steel guns. I love my Glocks but there's something about a Beretta that feels more solid. I hope at some point the plastic gun fad fades....

[turkeestalker]

I hope at some point the plastic gun fad fades....

Boy howdy! I'm kind of afraid it won't, but I'll be wishing right along with you.

[TheTurtle101]

I really wish S&W would bring back the 10mm steelie (5006?). I love steel guns and am glad to hear about this. I actually carry a fullsized Beretta 92fs iwb/owb every day. Love guns built like tanks. Can't complain about the one plastic gun I do own, though (M&P .40 VTAC)

[chip86]

Bringing back the slide mounted safeties :(

[BlueTrain]

Without making reference to S&W's website, if they can make a .45 auto, all steel, then they could just as easily made all-steel anything, more or less. But maybe they don't sell like we think they would. The current prices of revolvers is depressing, to say the least, but there may be other reasons you aren't buying all the revolvers you can find. Even 75 years ago, some guns were being replaced by newer models that didn't cost as much to manufacture. Even so (in 1940), the older models typically were continued in production even when officially replaced by newer models. Of course, nobody thought they had plenty of anything in 1940.

[Independent George]

As much as I love steel for the feel of it, plastic is not a fad. It's a significant advance that reduces weight, cost, and maintenance; I can easily imagine polymer or composite slides in the future, along with ceramic internals.

Steel won't disappear any more than wooden stocks or revolvers did, plastic is here to stay, and we're better off for it.

[Brodieray]

I love my S&W 39-2. I might be heavy and doesn't hold 18 rounds but it is still one of my fav. guns to shoot.

[rt11002003]

OP,How reliable is the info that Brigadier is being brought back?

[ATW525]

OP,How reliable is the info that Brigadier is being brought back?

The Brigadier and Vertec are both already back and available.

[ninjarealist]

I would love to buy one of the P210 reissues but, just like the originals, they're extremely expensive. Like $3,000 seems to be the absolute low end, and that's far more than I'm willing to pay for any gun at this point.

I guess real quality can't come cheap. It's far more than I'm willing to pay but I can't call it overpriced because, wow, what a beautiful gun. I guess I've always liked most of SIGs metal guns although I don't own one and I'm far from a SIG fanboy. But the 210 is the one SIG pistol that I have to admit makes me feel like a geek.

I've never had the privilege of shooting a SIG 210, so I don't know how nice it is to actually shoot, but they're truly gorgeous pistols and all the examples I've seen on Gunbroker just ooze quality and patient craftsmanship. Aesthetically, I have to say that it's one of the best-looking guns ever made.

I don't expect the prices to ever come down :(

[AustinTX]

I share the nostalgia for out-of-production metal-framed pistols. Aside from high-end 1911s and European target pistols, it's about the only kind of semi-auto I'm interested in buying these days.

As much as I love steel for the feel of it, plastic is not a fad. It's a significant advance that reduces weight, cost, and maintenance...

It definitely has its advantages in certain applications, and I agree that it's not going anywhere, but plastic has its disadvantages in certain applications as well. It's not an unambiguously better material for a pistol frame.

I can easily imagine polymer or composite slides in the future, along with ceramic internals.

Don't count on any of that.

OP,How reliable is the info that Brigadier is being brought back?

100%. :) It's already back. And the thanks goes entirely to Bill Wilson, who got Beretta to bring back the Brigadier slide for the gun he collaborated with Beretta in designing and producing. (The 92 is his second-favorite pistol platform after the 1911, and Wilson Combat is heavily involved with the platform now.) Having recognized your love of higher-end pistols, you really ought to look into getting one of the Wilson/Beretta 92G Brigadier Tacticals (http://shopwilsoncombat.com/Beretta-_-Wilson-Combat-92G-Brigadier-Tactical-9mm/productinfo/BER-92BRIG-9/). Standard Berettas are great guns, but these are tremendous. There's not a better value in the semi-auto world for $1,200, in my opinion. You'll be hard-pressed to find anything but enthusiastic reviews on them, even from long-time 1911 devotees who never considered buying a Beretta until Bill Wilson started talking about how much he loves the guns.

I would love to buy one of the P210 reissues but, just like the originals, they're extremely expensive. Like $3,000 seems to be the absolute low end, and that's far more than I'm willing to pay for any gun at this point.

I guess real quality can't come cheap. It's far more than I'm willing to pay but I can't call it overpriced because, wow, what a beautiful gun. I guess I've always liked most of SIGs metal guns although I don't own one and I'm far from a SIG fanboy. But the 210 is the one SIG pistol that I have to admit makes me feel like a geek.

I've never had the privilege of shooting a SIG 210, so I don't know how nice it is to actually shoot, but they're truly gorgeous pistols and all the examples I've seen on Gunbroker just ooze quality and patient craftsmanship. Aesthetically, I have to say that it's one of the best-looking guns ever made.

I don't expect the prices to ever come down

The Swiss SIG P210 shoots every bit as well as you're imagining. It's the finest production pistol ever made, hands down. The quality of the materials and the precision with which the gun is constructed is only matched -- if at all -- by the very highest-end custom 1911s produced today. And even then, the P210 is a far more rugged design.

The new P210s, the Legend from SIG Sauer (as opposed to SIG, which no longer exists), is an excellent gun, but it gives up a fair amount to the old Swiss guns in the aforementioned categories -- even more so now that the new ones are now all being made from stainless rather than carbon steel, which was a very unfortunate decision.

I don't know how much you're ultimately willing to spend, but you can get a Swiss P210-2 or matte-blued P49 (identical, except the latter was military issue; the former will have serial numbers beginning in "P," and the ones for the latter will begin in "A") for a lot less than $3,000 these days with some patience and diligent searching. The military guns often come with a decent amount of finish wear, but they're in great shooting shape (unless abused by a private buyer afterward), and build quality on these is equal to any other of the Swiss versions. Supplies are a bit depleted at the moment, for some reason, but that comes and goes. I'll PM you some info about some good deals currently.

[Uncle Malice]

I would love to buy one of the P210 reissues but, just like the originals, they're extremely expensive. Like $3,000 seems to be the absolute low end, and that's far more than I'm willing to pay for any gun at this point.

I don't know where you're looking but you can pick up a P210 for about $1,900 any day of the week.

[smee78]

"Probably not. S&W officially dropped all support for 3rd generation guns last year."

Thats to bad, I had not heard that. What a shame, I do love my 3rd gen S&W's. My 3904 is one of my favorite carry guns.

[power5]

Don't count on any of that.

Is a high point pot metal slide any stronger? F1 cars are made almost entirely of CF with metal insets for stress areas. Why couldn't a CF slide be designed around a metal insert for the lockup and chamber?

[AustinTX]

Strength (of varying kinds) is not the only consideration. A slide needs sufficient mass, and carbon fiber doesn't provide it without enormous bulk. And that's not the only property it has that counsels against this application. Just because something delivers an advantage in one application doesn't mean it will in a totally different application where different properties are important.

[BlueTrain]

How soon before someone starts making Lugers again?

[AustinTX]

How soon before someone starts making Lugers again?

Also already happening: http://www.waffen-werle.de/. :) Though admittedly I've never seen one of these come up for sale over here.

[BlueTrain]

Das ist verrückt!

On a more serious note, it seems to be common for older models, such as the Sig P210, to have updated features, like extended beavertails (if that's the term) and larger safeties. But things like that are also found on models that have never gone out of production, like the PPK and the Colt Government Model. I guess it's to be expected.

The now extinct company, US Firearms Company in Hartford, made some pre-1911 versions of the .45 automatic (never saw one). But maybe the market for things like that isn't that big after all. Still, there is a market for certain older models, like Sharps and Single Action Army revolvers. They don't seem to evolve like other reproductions. Maybe the market consists of purists.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

A 45 ACP Luger - that's neat. Probably way out of my price range. And the snubby Lugers!

That American made SS Luger was a dog from reviews.

[jmr40]

If someone can find a way to make small runs of older designs and still be profitable it might happen. But at this time there are more than enough used examples out there to meet the real demand.

They ain't gonna bring back wooden wheels on cars either, except on a limited basis for those interested in nostalgia.

[michael t]

It's a significant advance that reduces weight, cost, and maintenance; I can easily imagine polymer or composite slides in the future, along with ceramic internals


Reduces cost to make also .But that not passed on to us . Once molds up and running the plastic wonders cost little to make. Great profit for company :mad:

Let S&W and others go that way I won't I have enough plastic in my cheap KelTecs. and their still turning a good profit.

[deputy tom]

I really wish that S&W would return to the past and retro some 3913s but have given up waiting. I feel the Shield is the new version of the 3913 with a plastic frame. YMMV. tom. :cool: