Scopes You Use For Your Long Range Rifles

[Hoskins]

I currently am upgrading my WIN MOD 70 "Ranger" 7mm REM MAG w/ some free floating work, trigger adjustment, & a new scope. I think I'm going to put a Simmons AETEC 4x14x44 w/ MILDOT reticle on top. I can get it for around $160.00 brand new & have heard great things about it.

I want the 7mm REM MAG to be my long range shooter. From what I've researched & read, the Ranger series Model 70s were a economy rifle produced by Winchester back in the late 80's or early 90's. It is the most powerful/flattest shooting round/rifle I have so I'm gonna see what I can personally do to improve on a factory, economy MOD 70. Glass on top is part of it but I aint got $500 to $2,000 to spend on a scope.

I have always used cheaper Bushnell Banners Dusk til Dawn 6x18x50 w/ regular crosshairs, Bushnell Sportsmans 3x9's/4x12'sx40's w/ crosshair reticles, have (2) Nikon ProStaff 3x9x40mm's...one w/ plain crosshairs & one with the Bullet Drop Compensator (BDC)

I know that folks say that you have to spend loads of $$$ & give up your 1st born child for a quality scope but I have had good luck with the above mentioned scopes. They all have been a bargain. I got the Nikons on sale for around $110 & $120 on base. The Bushnell's are Wally World (Walmart) specials, etc... they work fine "for me." I want the Simmons AETEC for a quality MILDOT reticle. The only thing I wish it had was target turrets (wind/ELEV).

What optics are you guys using on top of your long range shooter? What brand, model, magnification, reticle, etc...? It doesn't matter about price or anything. I just wonder what most folks use. Regardless if it is a Centerpoint from Walmart or a Zeiss, Sworski, etc...

[geetarman]

Nikon Monarch on M1A and Ruger 77V 4-16X50
Redfield Widefield on Ruger 77V 3-9
Leupold VXIII on Remington 700P and DPMS Panther Bull 20 6.5-20X40
Nightforce on Remington 700BDL 8-32X56
Weaver K6 on Marlin M39a
Weaver K4 on Ruger 10-22

You are right, I have dropped a bundle on glass:rolleyes:

Geetarman:D

[DiscoRacing]

sightron big sky II 6-20X50 mil dot
bushnell 3200 elite 5-15X44

[FrankenMauser]

Leupold VX-3, 3.5-10x50mm, 1" tube.

Bushnell Elite 4200 3-9x40mm, 1" tube. (Get a Leupold, instead. The new Bushnells are tremendously better than the older stuff, but the VX-2 is still a better scope. A VX-3, on sale, can be had for only $30-50 more. It's adequate enough for me to have no reason to spend more money to replace it, but disappointing enough for me to complain. ;))

Leupold Vari-X III, 6.5-20x50mm, 1" tube. (circa 1986)

[Kreyzhorse]

I use a Bushnell Banner 6x24 (or maybe it's a 6x18, I can't remember) on my 7mm Rem Mag. I've wanted to upgrade but that scope has held zero well, is clear and pulls in a ton of light during both dawn and dusk.

[rezmedic54]

I use a WOTAC 4 x 14 x 50. Glass is clear and they seem holod zero well and pass the box test with flying colors. The price is right under $400.00 and they have a lifetime warrenty.

[kraigwy]

I've been shooting the Weaver T-10 on my1000 yard target rifles, (M-70 300 WM) since the late 70s.

I haven't notice a reason to switch.

[arizona hunter]

My friend has an Aetec (without mil dots) and I have shot with it too. The glass is surprisingly "bright' and he put lots of rounds under it from .260's, .308's and 50 cal Muz and it still works perfectly. Also, the image is clear to the very edges of the glass.

[taylorce1]

Long range scopes are all about features and it all depends on what you are willing to pay for. If you want an entry level long range scope the Bushnell Elite 3200 10X has pretty good ratings. Pair that with a 10-20 MOA base and it should get you a long ways down range.

[Rob96]

I have a Mueller APT 4-16x40 on top of my Remington 700ADL Varmint.

[ISP 5353]

Leupold LRT 6.5x20 MilDot reticle, 30mm tube. I have a couple of others that have the same scope, but with 4.5x14 power.

[Wildalaska]

Hensoldt 4-16x56FF

WildspendybutthebestAlaska ™©2002-10

[mapsjanhere]

Nightforce NSX 5.5-22x56 with the NP-R1 reticle on my 300 RUM , Zeiss Conquest 4-14x50 with a Rapid Z 800 reticle on my 223 Rem.

[Doodlebugger45]

Price doesn't always dictate the quality of the scope. The three best scopes I own are (1), a Weaver W-9 (3-9X). I have had it for 18 years I guess. It's still mounted on my Browning BLR 7mm Mag. At the time it was the most expensive scope I ever had (they sell for about $160 now) and sure enough it was a lot better than the cheapo scopes I'd owned before. The next quality scope I acquired came along with a custom built 7mm Mag I picked up. It's a Leupold VX-3 and it's darned good too. I see the new price is about $400 now. The most recent quality scope again came with the rifle, a Model 70 in .270 WSM. It's a Nikon Buckmaster 4.5-14 and it's a real dandy too. They sell for around $290 I think.

All 3 of them are a step up from the cheap stuff like BSA (I have a couple of those also). But you can't really compare them to each other until you take them out the same day and shoot 3 shots back and forth from each rifle one after another. I hadn't done that until the other day. Overall, they were all very good, but after several different 3-shot groups alternating rifles I definitely liked the Nikon the best. It wasn't the most expensive but was definitely the clearest. The $160 Weaver was every bit as clear as the Leupold VX-3 that costs more than twice as much.

I also have a couple of Simmons scopes that cost even less. They are better than the BSA stuff. But I only keep them on the more mild recoiling rifles like the .243 and .223. They aren't as clear as the better ones, but they are plenty good. And just like the expensive scopes, I have never had them shift their zero point.

[Fat White Boy]

+1 Kraigwy. I have started switching over to fixed power also. I have a Weaver 4X on my Rem 700VLS in .308. No reduction in accuracy...

[DnPRK]

2 each Nightforce NSX 6.5-22x56
2 each Leupold VX-III 6.5-20x50

[mitchell koster]

Not my "long range gun" but my uncle is using a Night Force 12-42 x 56 NXS on top of a blaser .338 lupua magnum

[Crankylove]

Weaver Grand Slam 3x10x40mm on my .270 Winchester.

Leupold Rifleman 3x9x40mm on my .358 Winchester...........although it's not really a long range gun.

[slowr1der]

I almost hate to post my opinion. The reason I hate to post it is so far, I've had pretty decent luck with Simmons, and in the past, I've thought they were one of the best of the bottom tier brands, but I'm still going to say what my opinion is and what I think. Hopefully, I don't get flamed.

One bad thing about Simmons is they are always changing hands so you never know who makes the scope you are buying.

Anyway, I've had two Simmons and I've been decently happy with them. However, if I was using them for long range shooting I would not be happy with either of them.The first one I've used is a 3-9x32 Simmons Deerfield. This one was on a .22. It worked great for years. It was fairly clear, and actually pretty decent in low light. It really impressed me. It would probably be about 6 years old now so I'm not sure who made them at the time. It's been dropped, banged around, and really just treated like crap, yet it still always has stayed zero. It took a hard fall right on the scope once and it was still dead on. I've had others take less and softer falls and be off several inches. This scope also seemed to track well. I've read all the complaints about cheap scopes and this one didn't seem to have any of them. The glass wasn't the clearest I've seen, but it was better than some scopes 5-6 times it's price range. It was perfectly clear enough to see anything you wanted to during the day. I also took it out in all sorts of weather and it never fogged internally. It did fog on the outside so that I had to wipe off the lenses, but all scopes do this. All in all this scope was just a great scope and is what turned me on to liking Simmons. The reason I wouldn't have been happy with this for long range shooting is the limited magnification. You want more than 9x for long range shooting. The one issue I did have with it is that after quite a few years of abuse the front ring thing that screws on and holds the front lens came loose. If you take this off you can turn the front lens. When this happened it did shift the poi a couple of inches upwards. I tightened it back down tight and just checked it periodically, and never had an issue again. I guess it just worked loose after years of abuse. I can't blame it. I think if I put epoxy or something on it it would guarantee that it never came loose again, but I didn't really see a need for that since I tightened it down and it fixed it. I'm also not sure if it still had nitrogen in it after this. It may have leaked out, but I'm not sure. I will say though that even in rough weather it never fogged internally even after this. All in all I loved and still love this scope. I actually still has it and last I used it it still worked perfectly.


Then the next scope I had was a Simmons 8 Point Blazer. I got this scope on a rifle used. That being said it works for what I'm doing, but would not for long range shooting. This is nowhere near as good of a scope imo as the Deerfield, but it does okay for the price. Once set it seems to hold zero. It's been banged around a little and I know some before I got it. Actually it road around in a truck and was hunted with fairly hard before I got it, but shot little and wasn't very old so didn't have a rough life too long. Then again they told me it was sighted in and it shot 1" or so to the right. So I went to adjust it. The issue I quickly ran into is that it did not track reliably at all which is why it would make a horrible long range scope. I moved it 2 clicks left hoping to move it about .5" then see where I was. To my shot it moved it about 2" left. I moved it back one click and luckily for me it hit dead center of the bulls eye and shoots perfect. It's held zero, and worked fine since. However, I wouldn't want to be trying to dial it in for long range shots as I just don't think it would turn out well. For a hunting scope that you set and leave zeroed it seems to work great. I try to put this one in a case instead of just putting it on the floorboard of the truck like the other Simmons I had. I also try not to drop it, so it doesn't see near the abuse the other one has, but it holds up to what little it does see.

Now the tracking is the major issue with this, but it's what kills the deal for the long range shooter. When it comes to the glass in this, I've not been as impressed with it as I was with the Deerfield, but once again it does decent. In daylight it does great. You can see great with it. The only time I had an issue is in bright direct sunlight I could see a little bit of reflection in the glass that was distracting. Now I'm not sure any scope wouldn't have done this so I can't criticize it. In low light it does decent. When I say decent I can say it performed better than a Leupold VX-I I tested it against, but it fails miserably compared to a Burris Fullfield II. So it's not great in low light, but isn't horrible and should treat you well during legal hunting hours. The tracking was the only issue I ever saw with this scope and for a hunting rifle that doesn't matter as you set it once.

So as you can see I've used two cheap Simmons without major issues. That being said, if you get one that tracks well I think it would work decent for long range shooting, but poor tracking is a common complaint of cheap scopes and one of mine did exhibit that. I will also say I have quite a few friends with Simmons and only one of them has ever had a problem. Some are 8 points which are cheapo's and some are Aetec's. So in general I don't think they are horrible, but I think you can do much better on a long range rifle.

If it was me for a long range rifle I'd look at a SWFA SS scope. They seem to be a much better bet for the money. That way you know it will track well and be durable, yet they still aren't horribly priced. If you really can't afford one though the Simmons may be a decent scope. Just make sure you test out the tracking ability, and it's ability to hold zero as well as have the parallax set correctly. If it passes these tests, I'd keep it. If not, I'd try to get another one while you can exchange it.

If you ever have to deal with the warranty service, I've heard it sucks many times over since Bushnell bought them. In fact, I've not heard much if anything good about Bushnell's warranty. They do service the SWFA scopes too so that scares me a bit about it. So I guess just make sure you have an exchange period to test it out during. If it doesn't work exchange it. If you have to deal with the warranty department expect to pay shipping both ways, wait quite a while, and just have a headache in general. If your scope is no longer available you may have to take a downgrade. There is a thread on Opticstalk.com talking about this right now. Basically, the fact that Simmons keeps changing hands so you never know who is making the scope (some seem good, others suck), and the fact that Bushnell owns them and handles the warranty work are the only two things that would make me not recommend them.

[sc928porsche]

For my long range target, I use a Zeiss Victory Fl Diavari in 6-24x56.
Brevix action with lilja 30" heavy bbl on Richards Microfit target stock. 30-378WBY.

[Jim Watson]

Leupold VX III Target 8.5-25X on my F-T/R rifles; .223 midrange, .308 long.

It's not hard to find a serviceable scope for 300 yards or so but the requirements get harder as the range gets longer.

[Boncrayon]

Nikon Buckmaster 3-9x40 with 92% light gathering.

[kraigwy]

+1 Kraigwy. I have started switching over to fixed power also. I have a Weaver 4X on my Rem 700VLS in .308. No reduction in accuracy...

The 4X is about perfect in my opinion for big game hunting. It allows for field of view so you don't loose the target yet within reasonable ranges it has the power needed for big game hunting. If you muff a shot and have to make a quick follow up shot at a running wounded critter, that field of view comes in handy. Its gonna be ruff finding a moving critter in a high magnification scope.

For long range target work, I like the 10X, it allows you a clear view of the target, yet not so much power that it allows mirage to Wash Out the Target. I still use a spotting scope to judge conditions. One has to be careful not to let the heat coming off the barrel to interfere with the down range mirage. 10X is a happy medium. (I use a barrel ban on my 1000 yard rifle to break up the heat coming off the barrel.)

The USAMU in their Civilian LE Sniper Schools recommended a Fixed 6-8 X for LE Counter Sniping pretty much for the above reasons. I found that worked great for me, (I used a 6X Redfield when I was in LE).

Regardless, there are some good scopes out there at reasonable prices. Weaver, Redfield, and Leopold are good example. And they hold up. Like I said, my T-10 is over 30 years old and still works, The Redfield I carried in LE listed above is above is about 35 years old and still holds a zero.

There are some pretty fancy scopes out there now, great scopes. they are fine if you learn to use them. But you have to keep at it. Shooting is not like riding a bicycle, you have to keep at it or loose you skills.

They just don't fit my shooting styles, I'm not going to snipe anyone, I'm not going into combat, I target shoot (though most of my rifle shooting is with iron sights), I hunt, I shoot varmints. My opinions are based on my shooting practices, and what works for me. I don't expect my ideals to work for everyone.

[geetarman]

Kraig,

Keep up the good posts. You offer a wealth of information.

Geetarman:D

[madcratebuilder]

I find I'm becoming very comfortable with lower, fixed power scopes. I shoot a Brit and Swiss mil-surp sniper and they are low power, 3.5 maximum. I recently picked up a Untertl "Condor", a 6X fixed with very nice glass. Excellent eye relief and fine cross hair, it well be moving on to a K-31 soon, replacing a Weaver K2.5. The Weaver K4 is also a great little scope. Often these can be found on the auction sights for less than the mount the sit on.

[Old Grump]

Weatherby Supreme 3-9x44 on my 300 Wby MkV mag but I don't believe they make it anymore.

[mrawesome22]

Sightron SII 6.5-20X42MM. Great scope.

[5RWill]

On my Rem. 700 5R I run a U.S. Optics SN-3, 3.2-17x44mm.
On my .243 small varmint/deer gun i run a nikon buckmasters 6-18x40mm.

[TXGunNut]

Hard to beat the Leupold VX-3. Full line for almost any application, legendary quality and lifetime guarantee. Rifles may come and go but my Leupolds are here to stay. :D

[TheNatureBoy]

Osprey International 10-40x50 on 7mm Rem Mag (Sendero). Was getting ready to purchase a Nightforce but decided to give this one a try at the recommendation of my hunting partner. What the heck I figured. Still have the $$$$ for the n/force.

[shanzlik]

Bushnell Elite 4200 Tactical 6-24x50 w/ mildot on Remington 700 SPS in .308 and another in .223

Nikon Monarch Gold 4-14x44 w/ mildot currently on .22LR but good for long range too

Nikon Buckmaster 6-18x40 w/ BDC on Remington 700 BDL 7mm Rem Mag

Weaver Tactical Grand Slam 3-10x40 w/ mildot on Armalite AR-10

Leupold Mark AR 3-9x w/ mildot on LaRue OBR .223

Redfield 4-12x40 w/ Accurange on Marlin XL7 .270 win.

I think that's about it for long range stuff (500 yards and up, target shooting only for me at those distances).

[Hoskins]

This is outstanding gentlemen!!! I just got a Savage 10FP & am researching all the scopes that you all have said that you use. Thank you so much for the info & thanks in advance for anyone else that posts to this thread.

[hooligan1]

kraigwy is absolutely right, buy what you can afford, and that will last you forever. I managed, over a period of two months, to purchase from the internet, in my area, two Leupold scopes in fantastic condition, for 150.00 each!:D A 4x12x40 VXII for my Weatherby and a 3x9x40 VXII for my Savage 110, I'm hoping they last for 30 years,(they get treated like kings at my place) because of the financial factor. Of course they will come up with a higher standard in a few years.:rolleyes: and geetarman is right on about kraigwy, he seems to be a wealth of knowledge! That means a lot to me :)and the rest of us here!! we seek proper knowledge.....;)

[tachunter]

Kraig,

Keep up the good posts. You offer a wealth of information.

This is pretty much what I had in mind.

[Hoskins]

+1 about Kraig!!! Also, I have been a Marine for 14 years & wondered why the Scout Snipers only used a fixed power 10x on thier M40s...you answered my question.

See, I figured you would need a Hubble Telescope :D on top of your long range gun/weapon, but you are exactly right, IMO, if you crank the power up to 24x the your FOV is greatly narrowed. So you are saying, please correct me if I am wrong, a 10x max power magnification is plenty enough for 800 to 1,000 yd shots?

Additionally, my eyesight has been tested to be 20/10, so my sight is extremely good, that should also mean that I don't need magnification that someone that has normal or less than normal eyesight has...correct?

I think my eyesight is so good beause my hearing is soooo dang bad!:( LOL, allot of machinegun fire & explosions tend to do that to a person though. Ah, you can't "hear" a target out to 800-1000yds, so that aint gonna affect anything! Though hearing aids should be in order for me to be a more effective stalk hunter!;)

[Txhillbilly]

Nikon Monarch 4-12x40 and a Swarovski PH 4-16x50 on a couple of 300WM rifles,and a set of Sightron SIII 6-24x50's on my LR Tactical rifles.
The Sightrons are right there with the Swarovski,IMO,for 1/3 of the price.They are quality optics.

[Zak Smith]

http://demigodllc.com/photo/AI-AWSM/icon/A100_1910_img.jpg
article | Practical Long-Range Rifle Shooting, Part II - Optics http://demigodllc.com/icon/extwh3.png (http://demigodllc.com/articles/practical-long-range-rifle-shooting-optics/)


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article | The State of Optics for Practical Long-Range Rifle Shooting [2009] http://demigodllc.com/icon/extwh3.png (http://demigodllc.com/articles/optics-for-long-range-rifle-shooting-2009-update)

[bamaranger]

Burris 6-24x XTR on my F/TR .308 Savage, the "green monster".

Vintage Weaver K-12 on my Ruger 77V -22-250.

I hope to put together a .223 bolt HB w/ a more conventional stock, and like the looks and reports on the Nikon Monarch "X" 4-16X, the same scope in 2.5-10x is a bit more affordable and a hoped for option, for bamaboy to shoot F/TR w/ me.

[Bagmup]

I find it amazing the high power of scopes guys stick on their rifles now, seems that varmint scopes on big game rifles are the norm. Maybe everyone thinks they're a sniper? :p

As for me, i have a Bushnell Elite 3-9x 40 on my 7mm rem mag, guess i'm boring like that :D

[Fat White Boy]

I realized that when hunting, I always shoot using the 3X setting on my scopes. Like you said, wider field of view plus large exit pupil. The one I won't change at this point is my Model 70 in .270 Win. Using a Buckmaster 3-9X40 scope and stock Remington Corelokt 130gr, it shoots cloverleafs. As long as it is that good, I won't mess with it. I have a Model 1885 highwall in .22-250 with a Leupold VXII 3-9X40 that I will probably change over to a 6X fixed power...

[chaser_2332]

Nikon at the moment currently saving for a nightforce