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spookygeek
May 14, 2010, 08:19 AM
I want to say hello as this is my first post on the Forums. I am looking at purchasing my first handgun for use as a home defense gun. I want something that is reliable, accurate and I'm partial to the 9mm caliber. My wife while not totally anti-gun is at the least very nervous regarding my idea. I have some formal training using the M9 (through 2 years of ROTC, expert qualified I might add), and a few trap/skeet shoots I do once or twice a year. To help make her feel better about the new member to our family I promised I would pick up a model with a manual safety and a decocker (if applicable). I plan on shooting each handgun prior to purchase, but wanted to do my own research to at least narrow down the list. What other 9mm handguns would fit the bill?

On my short list I have the following models:

Beretta 92FS (Again I have experience with the gun already)
Ruger SR9
Stoeger Cougar or Beretta PX4.

Brian48
May 14, 2010, 08:27 AM
I don't see anything wrong with the 92FS you are already thinking about. It's a great gun and you're already familiar with it. I would just get that and not look back.

LordTio3
May 14, 2010, 08:42 AM
It would help to know how much you were planning on spending. But as far as the 9mm goes, it is plenty adequate for self/home defense provided you load it with good quality ammo and train with some frequency. (Sounds like you have that part down)

That being said, the models you stated are all very nice. I personally like the Px4 Storm or the Ruger SR9.

Other models you may consider:
Smith and Wesson $350-450 usually
5906
6906 -(one of my favorite guns ever)
3913LS -single stack Lady Smith. Very nice weapon.
908
909
All 9mm's with external safeties

CZ -Around 400. Great weapons. "Beretta-like"
75
P-05
Rami- sub compact
All 9mm's with external safeties

H&K -Bit more Pricey $500-800 rough estimate
USP
USPc
P2000 (or p2000sk) -no safety, decocker only.


Sig-Sauer -Bit more Pricey $500-800 rough estimate
P226
P228
P229
P225-great gun
All Sig-decocker/safeties in 9mm

Ruger- $350-500 rough
P95
P85
P89
SR9

Taurus- $350-500 rough
PT92
Millenium "pro"- pt-111

There are several I'm missing, but this should give you a basic starting point.
Happy gunning and I hope you get something you really love.
I'm partial to the **06 Smiths myself.

~LT

spookygeek
May 14, 2010, 08:45 AM
Probably looking in the $400 range. I was also looking at the CZ-75 because i've heard good things, but I'm really looking for a handgun that has BOTH a safety and decocker, unless like the SR9 the decocker is N/A.

BRENT

cougar gt-e
May 14, 2010, 08:49 AM
Browning hi-power.

FNP-9

You could also get a 1911 pattern gun in 9mm, but they will normally be a bit more $ However, this link has a decent one for little $.

http://www.centerfiresystems.com/AC-RI1911TACA9MM.aspx

LordTio3
May 14, 2010, 08:50 AM
I'd say that the Smiths are your best friend then. They have the same Decocker/Safety that the M9 has. As do the CZ's. And I've been finding them on GunBroker.com for just over $300.00

Really the 6906 tends to fit just about everyone I've ever asked about it.

~LT

gotigers
May 14, 2010, 08:56 AM
Ruger is a good choice within your budget. I've had a P89 for 18 years. Still runs like it is new. Many rugers are easily within your budget. P89, SR9, etc. Any full size, hi capacity Ruger will be a fine home defense weapon.

9mm FMJ and some JHP will penetrate several home walls, so pick a good quality self defense round that will reduce this.

for HD a pump shotgun with big bird shot is best.

Glock_19
May 14, 2010, 09:04 AM
Given the list you provided I would go with the PX4.

spookygeek
May 14, 2010, 09:10 AM
I am leaning towards the SR9. Reasons being that it really acts in some respects as a DAO, with no need for a decocker. Its really a glock with a manual safety. I like the fact it will have a constant trigger pull.

My only problem with the SR9 is the potential reliability.

BRENT

DBAR
May 14, 2010, 09:49 AM
Welcome aboard, and your going to get a lot of varying opinions. So far, you've received a pretty good list from LordTio3. I like the Ruger SR9 idea, but if I were you, I'd give strong consideration to the CZ line of 9mm's. CZ makes a great product, at a reasonalble price. The Ruger SR9 is a fine handgun in it's own right, but there are other options for your consideration. The Sig P226 would be an excellent choice, and would probably be my first choice. With that said, the only 9mm I own is a CZ 85 Combat. My CZ doesn't fit your requirements, but CZ does make some that do. CZ75 BD, and the new P01 probably would be excellent choices.

The Beretta 92FS is a fine choice, but not one that I'd pick, simply a matter of opinion. If you've trained on one, and it's comfortable, then that's the one I'd go with if I were you. It just makes more sense to go with a platform that your familiar with, and one that has proven it's self to you.

Good Luck,
DBAR

Sturmgewehre
May 14, 2010, 09:54 AM
The Beretta Model 92 is a good choice, and as mentioned you have experience with it.

The next up for a double action auto with a manual safety and decocker, I would say check out the FNX-9. It has both a safety, decocker and it has an ambi-mag release and ambi-slide release. It's one amazing little handgun.

I would buy the FNX over the FNP (older model).

You can also look into HK USP's, but IMHO they're a little too big for a 9mm.

The CZ-75BD or SP01 are great pistols and both have decockers.

spookygeek
May 14, 2010, 10:08 AM
Does the CZ-75BD have a manual safety, or is the lever a decocker only?

BRENT

dirksterg30
May 14, 2010, 10:09 AM
Welcome to the forums, spookygeek.

I'd take a look at the M&P series; available with a manual safety and/or a mag safety (although I am not a fan of either on a striker-fired DAO gun). You will need to spend more than $400 for one; I lucked out and bought the full-sized M&P online for $439, but that was well over a year ago. Now they are over $500, but still well worth it in my opinion.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y217/dirksterg30/M%20and%20Ps/MPpair.jpg

dirksterg30
May 14, 2010, 10:11 AM
Does the CA-75BD have a manual safety, or is the lever a decocker only?

BRENT

The BD has a decocker only (that's the 'D' in the model name; the CZ-75B is manual safety only.) CZ's come with either a decocker OR a manual safety. The manual safety models will only allow the safety to the on position when the hammer is cocked.

spookygeek
May 14, 2010, 10:20 AM
Whats the general opinion of the Taurus 92fs style guns? I like the fact that they have lowered the safety/decock lever. I also noticed the 909, which seems to look like a 92fs, with a slightly more compact form to it.

BRENT

dirksterg30
May 14, 2010, 10:25 AM
Brent, I'm not a fan of Taurus pistols; too many accounts of issues with their customer service & quality control. The only thing I like about their 92 clone is the style safety; much better design that the Beretta's bass ackwards safety.

spookygeek
May 14, 2010, 10:28 AM
OK, so lets keep Taurus off the list then...

DBAR
May 14, 2010, 10:37 AM
Does the CZ-75BD have a manual safety, or is the lever a decocker only?

BRENT

The CZ75 BD has a lever de cocker, and it's a DA/SA handgun. It has a long DA pull, so it's completely safe de cocked, in my opinion. I had one for a couple of years, but ended up selling it. I prefer the "lock n cock" method.

In my opinion, the CZ has a better grip feel than that of the 92fs, but you have training with the 92fs, so that's the one that makes sense to me, for you. I understand you may want something different, and that's perfectly understandable. I think that the CZ is a great gun, and one that you'd feel comfortable with, especially with your training on the 92fs. They are different handguns, but not that different. I feel that the CZ is an improvement over the 92fs when it comes to ergonomics.

DBAR

DBAR
May 14, 2010, 10:41 AM
There is one other gun that you should consider. It's the new FN 9mm, not the old style, but the new one. I can't recall what they are calling it, but it has the de cocker, saftey combination that your looking for. It also has a very good feel to it. I had one, and loved it. I could shoot it faster, and more accuratley than a lot of the 9mm's I've owned. With that said, the location of the de cocker play havic with me. I ended up selling it.

You should look into them. It would be time well spent, and they are affordable too.

DBAR

spookygeek
May 14, 2010, 10:47 AM
The only thing I have against the 92fs, is I'm not a fan of where the safeties are located, high on the slide, and its such a large 9mm handgun. I'm not married to that specific model. Any handgun I pick up I'll to a ton of range time before I even think of stashing it near the bedroom.

I'm just hesitant on any SA gun without a decocker. It seems to me if you have to put lead on target in a stressful situation with the blood racing, then with a half empty mag, carefully lower the hammer, all sounds like a recipe for trouble.

I guess the decocker, is just my preference, the manual safety is the wife's requirement. I would totally call this case closed and pick-up a CZ, but they just don't quite fit the bill.

BRENT

LordTio3
May 14, 2010, 10:59 AM
Another question. Do you have a permit to carry, or do you ever plan on carrying this weapon? Or is it simply for home defense?

If you were ever planning on carrying, and you like the Beretta battery of arms, I'd have to say...

Beretta 9000 9mm.
http://www.imfdb.org/images/4/43/Beretta_9000.jpg

I personally love these little guns and with a little searching around, I'll bet you can find one right close to your price range.

+1 on ex-naying the Taurus' from your list. They're mostly good guns, but not if its the ONLY gun you have IMO.

~LT

spookygeek
May 14, 2010, 11:03 AM
No plan to carry, and I'm sure if I did, I'd just pick up Handgun #2.

A full grip is a must for Handgun #1.

BRENT

rsxr22
May 14, 2010, 11:12 AM
You should probably just stick with the M9 given your restrictions. There are other very comparable pistols but will be out of your price range and do not have everything you are looking for.

Drock
May 14, 2010, 11:40 AM
I would love to find a Beretta 92fs or Px4 in the $400 range. If you're thinking in that range LordTio3 has a good list. I carry the S&W 915 every day. SA/DA with a decocker. Has never let me down.

My wife had a problem with firearms 'till last year. Made a New Year's resolution to fire one. Now I have the 915 and a S&W M&P 9c, she has 9 different pistols and is getting ready to start competition. We belong to two different ranges and go at least three times a week. I love it!

Dave

Terry A
May 14, 2010, 01:52 PM
Nothing wrong at all w/ the Beretta 92. It served police and military fine for years, so it should serve your purposes well. This particular pistol is my wife's first pick for her bedside gun, although I, naturally, (:D) prefer the .45ACP.

Elvishead
May 14, 2010, 03:43 PM
Go light and narrow, every time with hi-cap. No-brainer!

Ruger SR9

spookygeek
May 14, 2010, 04:07 PM
I've been reading about the SR9 and there appears to be some issues with the trigger? Has this been resolved post-recall or is it still around.

Also in further research I'm starting to like the look of the FNP-9, and it looks like I can get a version with a manual safety. They think they may be near my budget.

BRENT

scottperk
May 14, 2010, 04:42 PM
Lets get this straight right up front. If a gun is only for
home self defense it is in reality an OFFENSIVE weapon.
The biggest heaviest pistols shoot the best in that environment
because they recoil less and point better with longer barrels.
Also surprisingly, even some of the very big pistols may
have a handle that will allow your wife to shoot comfortably.

SO the point is, RULE OUT all the compact short barrel light
pistols. You must have some appreciation of what I am saying
because of your experience with Beretta.

With the exception of a few saturday night brands which have
not been mentioned,.... THEY ALL WORK. If they really
didnt they wouldnt be around today.

I have some favorites and my own pistols but you really
need to define your parameters better and that is what
this msg is about. Forget Self Defense.... Think "Offense"
now.

Nother thing, just like cars, you can get the used mercedes
for the same price as a new chevrolet.

Just a little hint if it floats your boat.... rental range guns
that you shoot first prove they shoot well and are well
broken in if you buy them AND you get a great discount.
I have bought many. Pawn shops are just a little bigger
gamble but there isnt a whole lot that can go wrong with
pistols if you pick a tank to begin with and give it a good
scrutiny before you buy. With so many people out
of work these days, pawn shops are having to nearly
give their pistols away.

I just bought a SW 4506-1 for $349 the other day at pawn
shop. Yep it is a rugged 40 oz tank with all the safety features.
Was a police trade in. Carried a lot but fired little.

dirksterg30
May 14, 2010, 07:37 PM
for HD a pump shotgun with big bird shot is best. Birdshot is a terrible idea for home defense. If you are using a shotgun for self defense, use buckshot. Birdshot is for the birds.

Hoss Fly
May 14, 2010, 07:44 PM
SR9 or SR9C :cool:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v610/hossfly692000/ee.jpg

gearchecker
May 14, 2010, 08:45 PM
Smith & Wesson 469, 569, 669 are excellent 2nd generation pistols and can easily be found around $350 or so. they have a Manual Safety, Ambidextrous Decocker, and Mag Safety as well.


there are numerous 9mm handguns that wioll fill your needs perfectly. Go slow, try out as many as you can gets your hands onto for fit and function. Once you're pretty sure which are on the top of your list see if you can get range time with a few of them. the Beretta is a reaaly sound choice, especially having experience with it already.

I've put a couple thousand rounds thru my 669 and it's never failed to fire.
Here is my 669 so you can get an idea what they look like.

http://i671.photobucket.com/albums/vv72/gearchecker/just%20stuff/669-1.jpg

Esteban32696
May 15, 2010, 07:39 AM
You have a good many choices , but you will be limited by $400 top price, & manual safety desired. Don't rule out a Bersa 9mm, or a Ruger. A friend has a Ruger #89 & I have never seen a pistol that was as dependable as his. I think it would feed & fire a marble !!

indykappa
May 15, 2010, 10:40 AM
+1 on the Smith and Wesson 5906

this pistol is tough as nails, and eats everything! i could feed it gumballs, and it would still send em down range at 1100fps ;)

in all seriousness, it's a solid pistol. 15+1 round capacity. kinda heavy (but that will help further reduce recoil). and if budget is a major concern, you can find this pistol for $300-$400 everywhere (expect to pay about $350 though)

38superhero
May 15, 2010, 10:58 AM
hello, welcome, beretta-CZ75 in that order you cant go wrong with either as a home defense and all around handgun.

SW40F
May 15, 2010, 11:06 AM
I want to say hello as this is my first post on the Forums. WELCOME!

I am looking at purchasing my first handgun for use as a home defense gun. I want something that is reliable, accurate and I'm partial to the 9mm caliber. Others have offered some really good advice, and I have little to add, other than agreeing that 9mm will do the job well.

My wife while not totally anti-gun is at the least very nervous regarding my idea.I will suggest that you get her actively involved. Go take shooting lessons with her at a range. Encourage her to get the feel of it, and don't hesitate to start with a .22. She will learn that there are procedures for loading a gun, holding a loaded gun safely, and to unload and make sure that it is 'safe.' Familiarity should make her less 'nervous' and more aware of the part that she plays in this safety.

To help make her feel better about the new member to our family I promised I would pick up a model with a manual safety and a decocker (if applicable). Again, go take a class together. She will learn of the various 'safeties' built into most guns, starting with "Keep the trigger finger off of the trigger and the gun won't fire" and other mechanical safeties such as "The gun won't fire even if dropped."

Who knows, she may warm up to shooting like my wife did and before you know it she will buy 'her own' gun and you can go shooting together!

Best of Luck

timd
May 16, 2010, 01:20 PM
Stick to the Beretta that you know well. The fact that you are "expert qualified" should make her feel better about the situation. Since you are not carrying it concealed, the size, weight, dependability and accuracy of the M9 make it a logical choice.
I bought a factory refurbished police trade in for $429, with night sights and two mags. Hard to beat, and a sweet shooter.

obxned
May 16, 2010, 01:53 PM
The Bersa full-size Thunder 9 is a darn good choice. These pistols are relatively inexpensive (less than $400), reliable and accurrate, have good triggers (both SA ans DA) right out of the box, 17-round magazine, and a safety/decocker.

pgdion
May 26, 2010, 01:45 PM
Beretta 92FS is my best suggestion, especially for home defense. It's accurate, reliable, easy to shoot, has a DA first shot, and is loaded with safety features which make it a great personal defense gun (it's what I use ;-) ). My second favorite is the CZ75B and if I went to .40 I'd look at the PX4 or the Smith and Wesson M&P (excellent poly frame gun). The SR9 is a good runner up in my book.
_________________________________
"Ooops" ~ Martin Riggs

twobit
May 26, 2010, 02:27 PM
I've shot / carried a 92FS as one of my primary duty guns for 20 years and I love it. I have nothing but praise for that pistol. One thing I will caution you about it is that the grips are rather large so persons with small or medium size hands sometime have trouble with the grip size. If your wife is going to shoot it, make sure it will fit her hand. .....For a 40 cal. I'd have to have a 96A1.

oneshot onekill
May 26, 2010, 02:46 PM
I have to agree with the "Pump Shotgun" answer for home defense. (18" barrel... MAX) What you load it with is up to you but bird shot isn't the best. Not enough penetration through things like heavy coats or a lot of clothing.

The main reason is because if you are awakened in the middle of the night and it's dark in the house you don't have to be as accurate with a shotgun. Especially if the guy's any distance away or moving quickly. Some people believe also that racking a round in a pump shotgun is enough to scare most criminals away. I don't personally agree with that because the last thing I want an intruder to hear is the Gates of Hell closing behind him:D. My shotgun is cocked and locked next to the bed.

*Disclaimer** No kids in my house. If you have kids in the house any firearm is a bad idea unless the kids are properly trained in firearms safety.

spookygeek
May 26, 2010, 04:31 PM
Thanks for the help guys. I've narrowed it down to the following selections which are sort of broken out by how much I eventually decide I want to spend.

$in the $300ish range Ruger P95 (new), S&W 5903/5904 (used), Stoeger Cougar 9mm (new).

$500 and up, M&P9 w/ thumb safety (new) or FNP-9 USG.

I'm going to go around and see what I can get my hands on to fire if possible or at least check how they feel in the hand. Got a feeling I'll be going with the $300 range considering the quality of the guns available seem more than adequate for my needs, although the FNP-9 would probably be my first based on research alone.

Thanks,

BRENT

Distortion
May 26, 2010, 11:00 PM
There is one more gun that might fit your qualifications. The fairly new polymer framed CZ P-07 Duty model with the new "Omega" trigger. The P-07 Duty can be modified by the operator to have either a manual safety or a decocker (but not both at the same time).

I think the manual safety/decocker configuration is actually part of the new Omega trigger, but I'm not sure. There are new Omega trigger versions of the regular CZ-75B, so that is another option.

Edit: I just looked on CZ's website. The CZ-75B Omega does not have the interchangable safeties, but the new P-02, which is a P-01 with the new Omega trigger, does have the interchangable safety.

Lucky 7
May 27, 2010, 06:50 AM
You may want to check out the Jericho 941 (commonly called the Baby Eagle). Controls are similar to Beretta (with the exception being take-down), the ergos are superior as is the trigger and trigger reset, and it holds an extra round.

That being said, the Beretta is a fine weapon along with others that have been mentioned (SW 3rd Gens, Browning Hi-Power).

Regards,
Lucky

keens
May 27, 2010, 09:58 AM
Glock 19.

It WILL go bang.

FreakGasolineFight
May 27, 2010, 12:19 PM
Glock 19.

It WILL go bang.

Consider reading the whole thread before you post.

bd18packer
June 23, 2010, 11:04 AM
I have a S&W 469 for personal defense/ concealed carry, and home defense. It was my duty weapon for many years until the department made us carry issue guns, ie: Glocks. My personal choice for a duty weapon now would be a Sig-Sauer P220 or P226 (as AZ DPS issued in the 90's). A good choice for home defense would be a 9mm single stack , or a 38/357 revolver, especially if your spouse intends to use it when you are away from home. A 12 gauge shotgun with a 18" to 20" barrel would be my choice if I had kids at home. It is unlikely kids could cycle a round and fire it, though I WOULDN'T leave it laying around loaded with one in the chamber. My kids have been taught gun safety since they were old enough to learn. Besides, a racking a round into the chamber makes a chilling sound in the dark, and is one most every criminal I know recognizes as "lethal force will be applied if you continue". Just my thoughts...

DanThaMan1776
June 23, 2010, 12:35 PM
FNX-9 :)

Were you aware that the Ruger is striker fired and doesn't have a hammer to decock???

Also look at HKs an Sigs

pgdion
June 23, 2010, 12:47 PM
Ruger P series (P95 mentioned) is hammer fired. The SR9 is striker fired. That said, I hear a lot of mixed things on the P95's, I'd prefer the SR9 myself (and then yes, you have a striker). I do have a friend with the P345 and the gun has not given him any problems and it is fun to shoot but my local gun shop guys (all of them) continue to curse the Ruger P's.

btw - this thread is over a month old, so what did you end up buying and how do you like it?

IM_Lugger
June 23, 2010, 01:26 PM
92FS is a great handgun and would be perfect for HD. If you liked it back than why not get it?

Also guns to consider; CZ 75, P226, M&P and Glock 17 gen4 but the last 2 don't have a traditional safety.

doc540
June 23, 2010, 02:51 PM
I'd consider several things before I purchased a home defense pistol:

1. dependability/durability (eats every thing and goes "bang" every time)
2. ability to shoot accurately and confidently (features/ergonomics)
3. type of ammo (Barnes Bullets)


Say what you will, but my wife is confident and deadly with her downstairs Sigma w/laser. (S&W smoothed the trigger)

The Sigma has an added feature: any thief who might steal it probably won't use it in a crime because of the crappy trigger action.:D

Rayndeon
June 23, 2010, 03:10 PM
The only models that fit your requirements off the top of my head are either the HK USP, HK P7, or Jericho 941/Baby Eagle. I would lean towards getting the last one for the best combination of price, ergonomics, reliability, and overall package.

HK USP 9mm has both decocker and safety. It is a bit pricey though, even used. And some people find it somewhat uncomfortable to grip. This gun, by the way, can also be carried cocked-and-locked, unlike the other guns in this list.

HK P7M8/M13, though it doesn't exactly have a decocker/safety, is a 9mm handgun with a unique cocking-lever - basically, in order to fire, you have to squeeze the grip, which will let you fire. Its functionality is almost the same as having both a safety and decocker - since letting up the grip decocks the gun and the gun cannot fire without the grip engaged. However, it is pricey, especially the M13 variant. It's a fairly unique design.

The Jericho 941/Baby Eagle standard models have a slide-mounted safety/decocker that handles both roles. The safety decocks the hammer and you can't fire while the safety is on - so it's not just a decocker. The gun, obviously, is DA/SA. Prices are more reasonable for this. The gun can be found either in steel or polymer and it's a very nice, ergonomic gun. It's actually a clone of the CZ75, but it's still quite a gun. I think this is the best choice overall, for a gun with both a safety and decocker.

group17
June 23, 2010, 03:18 PM
Since you all ready know how to handle Beretta's but you wife might find the 92/ 96 a little large to shoot go with the Stoeger 8000 which is a bit smaller. It's also the right price NIB.

http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/2701/p1010061il.jpg

tex45acp
June 23, 2010, 07:55 PM
While the 92FS is a fine weapon and certainly deserving of it's praise, I prefer something a little different. A Browning Hi Power is my choice if I have to go to a handgun.
http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f43/mike_seale/BHPNEWPARTS-2.jpg

But that will be a last resort if cannot reach my Winchester Defender 12ga. for some reason.
http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f43/mike_seale/Winchester1300004.jpg