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View Full Version : Glock 19 vs. Walther P99 vs. USP vs. XD


tx-witt
May 10, 2010, 07:16 PM
I am looking to purchase my first handgun, and those in the running are the Glock 19 (rtf), Walther P99, HK USP, and Springfield XD. This is also my first post on TFL so bear with me. I will be going with a 9mm, regardless of my choice.

From what I gather the USP seems to be regarded as the superior pistol out of the group, but it is also considerably more expensive. A used USP priced at $500 caught my eye at the gun store today. The gun itself looked to be in perfect condition, but the night sights looked very old and dim (indication of the gun's age), and I am worried about having to replace the barrel in the near future.

I like the trigger system of the P99 (double, single) and the decocker for added safety, and the ergonomics are great. However, my local gun store (McBrides - very reputable) no longer stocks the P99 because they didn't sell, and that worries me.

I don't know much about the XD other than they have been getting tons of praise recently.

And the Glock...well it's a Glock. Reliable, simple.

On a blind point the grip angle of the Glock suits me better, and the HK points low. This makes me lean toward the Glock because it will be on target in a SHTF situation, but it seems like something that practice could remedy.

I'm looking for recommendations from users of the above mentioned pistols, preferably those with extended use, as I am looking to make a long term investment.

Let me know what you think

FreakGasolineFight
May 10, 2010, 07:24 PM
HK's are good, but overpriced for what they are.

The Walther, XD, and Glock are all good choices.

However, if you like decocker pistols, I'd strongly suggest you check out the CZ P-01--all metal, will take pretty much any abuse you can dish out, just as reliable as the Glock, and, if it counts for anything, just plain sexy.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/c/c2/Czp01-001.jpg/300px-Czp01-001.jpg

Shane Tuttle
May 10, 2010, 07:50 PM
From what I gather the USP seems to be regarded as the superior pistol out of the group, but it is also considerably more expensive. A used USP priced at $500 caught my eye at the gun store today. The gun itself looked to be in perfect condition, but the night sights looked very old and dim (indication of the gun's age), and I am worried about having to replace the barrel in the near future.

Subjectively superior, maybe. Objectively, I disagree. The four you've mentioned have all been proven to be extremely reliable and each offers their own unique features. Example: Just because the XD may feel better in one person's hand doesn't mean it's a better fitting gun for you. What is it about the USP's barrel that makes you concerned? Sights are easy to replace, but if you're on a budget I would find sights you like that fit and consider it in the final investment.

I like the trigger system of the P99 (double, single) and the decocker for added safety, and the ergonomics are great. However, my local gun store (McBrides - very reputable) no longer stocks the P99 because they didn't sell, and that worries me.

Why does it worry you? My guess is it may not be a popular firearm given your demographic or competition may be stiff. The P99 has been a solid selling firearm and product support, if you ever need any, should be a non-issue.

To provide a better answer, can you tell us what you'll be using it for? Home defense? Range plinking? Concealed carry? Training courses? Are you looking to have any custom work performed? Are you willing to tinker with the gun yourself?

lee n. field
May 10, 2010, 08:37 PM
This is also my first post on TFL so bear with me.

Welcome.

I will be going with a 9mm, regardless of my choice.

Fair enough. I guess. Shorts the caliber war argument to ground.

USP I am worried about having to replace the barrel in the near future.

Unlikely unless it's damaged. Shooting it's not going to wear out a handgun barrel.

I'm looking for recommendations from users of the above mentioned pistols, preferably those with extended use, as I am looking to make a long term investment.

I can directly address two of them, as I own both a Glock and an XD. Either will shoot well.

The Glock has better parts support for the end user, broader aftermarket support and basic parts replacement type maintenance can be done in minutes with only a punch.

The XD has conventional land and groove rifling, meaning you can safely shoot cast lead bullets (important if you a cheapskate like me, and cast your own). The XD's extractor design is "funky" and looks like it could be a bear for an end user to replace. I have never heard of one needing to be replaced. I find I shoot mine very well. Point, click, dead on target.

XDs come in a new variant, the XDm. They tweaked a lot of stuff, and too all reports it's quite a nice gun, but I wouldn't (and don't) feel put out by having the older XD.

Glock's are more expensive, but XDs have been creeping upward. Buuuut, XDs can now be had as a cheaper "Essentials" package, without some of the free doo-dads they normally come with.

Magazines for both are easy to find and relatively inexpensive.

roman3
May 10, 2010, 09:06 PM
All are excellent guns but unless you are planning to get the compacts of the German and Croatian guns listed, all of the guns mentioned are full size handguns closer in size to the glock 17. The Glock 19 is really in a different class than the other full size guns.

I would choose the Glock 19 for many reasons. Price, price of mags, vast aftermarket stuff, toughness, size to capacity (even the USP C is slightly bigger with less rounds) and simplicity.

The Walther P99 AS trigger can take some getting used to, the QA trigger is not very glock like. While the gun is often at an expensive price point, the biggest problem with the Walther P99's are the OEM mags are hard to find and expensive when you do. And no P99's don't sell well and Walther's marketing of them sux. Walther P99's are never seen in stores or at shows around these parts.

The USP is a great pistol, I like the Variant one, (there are several variants so make sure it is a varient you would want) but its expensive new, used prices are OK ($500 BTW is excellent) but can be still high. The mags are easier to find than the Walther but HK mags are also expensive. Replace the barrel? I would be shocked if a HK ever needed a new barrel in your lifetime from normal or even above average shooting.

That leaves the XD which is a good gun but does not, for me, best the Glock overall.

All are excellent guns, at one time I have owned them all, and all should last a lifetime with no issues.

For me in order would be the

1. Glock 19
2. HK USP Compact
3. Walther P99 fullsize (QA trigger) - the $ mag issues really drops the P99 (I like to have plenty of spare mags)
4. the Springfield Armory XD

usnavdoc
May 10, 2010, 09:29 PM
glock 19 or sw mp9

evan1293
May 10, 2010, 09:38 PM
Glock 19.

redstategunnut
May 10, 2010, 10:10 PM
Easy. Get the Glock 19 and spend the balance of your budget on a quality pistol class. Repeat: Get the Glock.

Glock_19
May 10, 2010, 10:13 PM
Glock 19 all the way

LanceOregon
May 10, 2010, 10:20 PM
You forgot to include my two favorites: The S&W M&P and the Beretta PX4 Storm.

My Beretta has a much better DA and SA trigger pull than my HK USP. The gun that has the best ergonomics and feels the best, though, is easily the S&W M&P. It has the same type of trigger that the Glock has.

http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s272/lanceJOregon/guns/40pair1_on.jpg

.

JohnKSa
May 10, 2010, 10:20 PM
Second what lee n. field said. It takes a LOT of shooting to wear out a pistol barrel. If an autopistol has been shot enough that the barrel is about worn out then that DEFINITELY won't be the first thing you'll notice that needs replacing. ;)

RT
May 10, 2010, 10:29 PM
I would get the G19, Hk P30, M&P 9, or FN FNX in that order.
Below are some links to endurance tests
http://pistol-training.com/archives/category/range-reports/p30-thursday
http://pistol-training.com/archives/998

Officer's Match
May 10, 2010, 10:30 PM
The G19 is one hard to beat pistol if you want a 9mm.

zombieslayer
May 10, 2010, 10:36 PM
I have several .40's and I love my XDm. But I'd trade a couple of them for a P99. I have to have one. I'm in love with my PPS and think the P99 will be even better. Just my 2cents

madmedic
May 10, 2010, 11:05 PM
I would go with the glock 19 hands down. Just make sure you program it into your muscle memory keeping the trigger finger straight and off the trigger until ready to fire.
I think glocks are the best combat handguns out there, but in my opinion they are also inherently less safe than DA/SA guns or those with a manual safety(excluding maybe ones that can go bang when u drop them). So trigger and muzzle discipline is important to ingrain in yourself from the beginning.

WESHOOT2
May 11, 2010, 02:32 AM
...relating to mag availability and cost, buy the one you like the best; they are all excellent choices.

Based on your remarks, it seems like the M19 is your logical choice (and from your list, the one I'd recommend).

ShipWreck
May 11, 2010, 11:47 AM
Definetly the Walther P99.

Walther relies on S&W to sell the P99s here in the USA. S&W has their own priorities with their own lines, so they do a bad job at advertising. But the P99 A/S is 1 of the best polymer 9mms ever made

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g320/mistershipwreck/P99-1.jpg

SVRider
May 11, 2010, 07:55 PM
OP, I have 3 out of the 4 on your list with the exception being the XD (on my list of wants though). I also have an HK P30, Beretta PX4 Storm and a few other 9s that don't really compare in size.

Hands down the P99 is the best of my arsenal. I like it so much I bought a 2nd one. The trigger is the best you'll find in a factory, mass produced gun. Smooth take up, very predictable & crisp break, short reset and perfect weight for a range toy or defensive gun. Unlike the Glock, you can restrike a bad primer by just squeezing the trigger again (albeit with a heavy DA pull). You don't get the easy re-cocking of a hammered gun though. Re-cocking requires pulling back the slide 1/4 to 1/2 and inch.

It's equally as reliable as a Glock or HK. The design touches are better as is fit & finish so it costs more than a Glock, but not as much as an HK. Which everyone says are over priced. I agree and yet I have 4 HK handguns.

Check out the M&P also. I have the .45 instead of the 9mm but it's a really nice gun and I'd put it 3rd behind Walther & HK respectively.

rsxr22
May 11, 2010, 08:47 PM
i am a huge fan of all of the pistols you have listed except the XD. The Glock is and always will be a winner. Nothing works better for me than a glock, probably because most of my usage is with one however. I love the P99 manual of arms but was not as impressed by it once i shot my buddies for an extended period of time. The gun recoiled relatively hard and overall was not that pleased. The USP is a great design but i personally like the P30 much better but it is also much more money. The USP has a very block like grip even more so then the glock and is nowhere as ergonomic as the P30.

Out of the options you listed my vote would have to be for the G19. Simply rugged gun like all the options are as well and equally as reliable, but there is an abundance of aftermarket accessories out there for the Glocks

tristar viper
May 11, 2010, 09:05 PM
In the order of my preferences:
Glock
Springfield
Walther
HK

The only thing superb about an HK is the trigger....it's superbly awful. Over priced guns if I ever saw one that was.

WVfishguy
May 11, 2010, 09:17 PM
tx-witt: I like the trigger system of the P99 (double, single) and the decocker for added safety, and the ergonomics are great.
I love the ergos of the P99 AS (.40 S&W), but I can't hit the side of a barn with it. :eek:
http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab64/WVfishguy/000_0067.jpg
Seriously, last time I went to the range, I fired several rounds from the P99, and there were NO hits on target. I switched to my el cheapo S&W SW40GVE, and shot like a champ. Switched back to my Bersa .40 Thunder, (which has a wonderful, smooth, single action trigger) and again, missed the target. With my Walther PSP, (a "double action" pistol) I did quite well
I believe it's because I usually shoot double action revolvers, and I have an over-developed trigger finger. Now, I know this is a mental state, so please no lectures. But I'm beginning to wonder if there are not a lot of guys like me out there, because my local dealer also told me he had trouble selling P99s.

predecessor
May 11, 2010, 09:39 PM
IMO, the P99 is easily the best. Glock or XD, dime a dozen, take your pick. USP doesn't offer enough to justify the price.

The P99 sells fine in my store because I take the time to show customers the options. If the budget is there, 3 out of 4 will walk away with the P99 over the others every time.

zombieslayer
May 12, 2010, 03:59 AM
Fwiw, the 2 local guinshops I frequent tell me that they sell quite well. But don't let sales of a gun be too important- one of my all time best handguns is a CZ40b and they didn't sell worth a darn. Just had to throw that in.

N.H. Yankee
May 12, 2010, 04:52 AM
I have owned all 4 guns you have mentioned, the one I carry is the XD and I have convinced friends and family to go the XD or XDm route and all have thanked me.
The other option and I sometimes carry is the CZ P-01, excellent weapon and very accurate and the ergonomics are perfect for most people. The USP is over priced and mine wasn't all that impressive as far as accuracy but was 100% reliable.

The P99 has great ergo's also but the trigger has a learning curve as it is a bit different from conventional. very reliable and accurate also.

The Glock just never felt right for me and while a very good gun is over hyped, there are many excellent reliable guns in the marketplace and you named four that are hard to beat.

roman3
May 12, 2010, 05:16 AM
The P99 sells fine in my store because I take the time to show customers the options. If the budget is there, 3 out of 4 will walk away with the P99 over the others every time.

Do you sell OEM high cap factory mags for the 9mm?

What is the price?

Not aftermarket or even Smith made mags but Walther mags. $54 to $85 is a steep mag price curve, IF any one ever actually has them in stock.


This is my only constant irritation with the Walther.

roman3
May 12, 2010, 05:33 AM
Here in Central Florida we have a huge big volume gun outfit called Shoot Straight ( 4 stores, 2 being built and they attend local gun shows across the state and take up 4-5 ROWS of tables... not 4-5 tables). These are the guys who can undercut any other prices around if they want to and they usually do.

They never have for sale Walther P99's (the also never have Glocks in 45 GAP), they have plenty of Walther P22's and the PPS, heck they even have a good supply of older P1's.

But no P99's. Why? They have every other gun currently for sale and usually have plenty of them. But not the P99. Next time I see them at the gunshow I will ask why but I can imagine its due to poor sales but who knows?

zombieslayer
May 12, 2010, 08:44 AM
I'm in Shoot Straight all the time! I have a few buddies that work at the one in apopka. Go ask em', they love P99's and they told me they sell every one they get. Mags are hard to find, for now, but mags for various guns can take a bit to become readily available. My PPS mags were hard to find and expensive but it is the best carry gun I've ever owned. Shoot Straight is a great place to buy guns usually. I only deal with a few salesmen though, some of the older guys that work there are real jerks.

roman3
May 12, 2010, 11:50 AM
The gun has been out since 1997 and the mags are

mags for various guns can take a bit to become readily available.

And the hi cap ban has been off how long?

That's quite a "bit" for them to become readily available.

Ask them why they don't carry them on a steady basis in their stores or why they don't ever have new ones for sale at the gun shows?

roman3
May 12, 2010, 12:16 PM
I sure the Finnish army can get mags


http://www.mil.fi/maavoimat/kalustoesittely/index.dsp?level=65&equipment=170

tx-witt
May 12, 2010, 09:24 PM
Thank you all for offering your input to help guide my purchase; what a wealth of knowledge there is on TFL! I picked up a G19 with the RTF2 finish today. Put 100 rounds through it at the range and love it. Looking forward to many more years with and rounds through the gun.

BigMike72
June 27, 2010, 08:42 AM
My buddy just picked up a P99 a couple of weeks ago and we went shooting last night. He really wanted my opinion since I am the pistol shooter and he the rifle guy. This is his 1st 9mm semi auto purchase.

My 2cents, having previously owned a H&K USP .40, I think this P99 is the H&K twin brother. I really liked the feel in my hands, the recoil felt nice. I was shooting some real nice groups. As a CCW gun, it felt great in my waistband. I could see one of these in my collection (I would get a .40 though).

Highly recommend!

ojibweindian
June 27, 2010, 08:54 AM
tx-witt

I thought you'd get a Glock; based upon your first post, it was the best choice you could make.

threegun
June 27, 2010, 09:38 AM
Nice choice. You will be tickled pink.

.357SIG
June 27, 2010, 12:06 PM
I see P99s once in a while, but they don't stick around long. The only ones I see anywhere in abundance are the P990 and SW990 (DAO). Anyone who fires mine loves it. I wouldn't worry about reputation.

velodemon
June 27, 2010, 09:51 PM
Great choice. I own 3 of the 4 guns mentioned by the OP(no P99). I like them all but if forced to pick one, it would be the G19.:)

Mawetta
June 27, 2010, 09:55 PM
You forgot to include my two favorites: The S&W M&P and the Beretta PX4 Storm.

My Beretta has a much better DA and SA trigger pull than my HK USP. The gun that has the best ergonomics and feels the best, though, is easily the S&W M&P. It has the same type of trigger that the Glock has.



+1 I'm picking up my new Px .40 tomorrow. Love the way it feels!

pilpens
June 28, 2010, 12:37 AM
My Vote:
1. P99 DA/SA in 9mm
2. HK P30 ---- I Have a USP 9 -- feels very big for a 9mm. Also, I have a V2 P2000 I bought recently (I should have waited for the P30s in 9mm) but it is for sale now. Both are very solid handguns.
3. I do not like the glock grip angle.
4. XD is OK, trigger reach is short like the P2000 (for me).

The P99 DA/SA, accurate. I cut the slide release on mine because my thumbs keeps hitting it (causes last shot/lock open failure).
Feels safe (for me) with the DA first shot.
SA is crisp and clean. DA is smooth.

zombieslayer
June 28, 2010, 01:14 AM
The mags I was refering to or at least thinking of were the 40cal mags, was under the impression it had recently(ish) been released. Of course, 1997 was a while ago, yeah that's not "a bit". My point wasn't well-made. Mag selection for me is just not that critical providing I can at least get three or four when I purchase the gun. I like when I can find my magazines readily, for sure. But sometimes you just have to weigh how huch you really need 50 magazines the first month you have the gun. In my experience, hard-to-find mags have a way of flooding the market eventually, on current production guns anyhow. Just my 2cents

LanceOregon
June 28, 2010, 08:31 PM
Roman3 said:

Do you sell OEM high cap factory mags for the 9mm?

What is the price?

Not aftermarket or even Smith made mags but Walther mags. $54 to $85 is a steep mag price curve, IF any one ever actually has them in stock.


This is my only constant irritation with the Walther.

Roman, that is a valid point to raise. Walther mags are indeed expensive, and hard to find.

Beretta has the edge here with their PX4 They have affordable slightly extended 20 round OEM mags available on the market. Here is a photo of my PX4 with an extended mag inside it, and another one beside it:

http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s272/lanceJOregon/guns/px4_on.jpg


20+1 rounds is plenty of firepower.

.

CzCasull
June 28, 2010, 09:37 PM
The USP is not over-priced for what it is, it's overpriced for what kind of service reps you get to talk to...

AustinTX
June 29, 2010, 11:13 AM
"You forgot to include my two favorites: The S&W M&P and the Beretta PX4 Storm."

I'm curious as to why the PX4 doesn't get more attention in these discussions. I've only heard good things about the gun. Is there some flaw that I'm unaware of? Is it just poorly marketed?

threegun
June 29, 2010, 12:29 PM
I'm curious as to why the PX4 doesn't get more attention in these discussions. I've only heard good things about the gun. Is there some flaw that I'm unaware of? Is it just poorly marketed?


My PX4 storm is wonderful. It has been flawless to date. It has no chance of unseating my Glock for my primary carry gun however. Plenty of accuracy, 100 percent reliable, light weight, etc. but the DA/SA and higher bore axis does it in for me. I wanted it to win out but it came up just short.

JohnKSa
June 29, 2010, 10:45 PM
but the DA/SA and higher bore axis does it in for me.Can't fix the bore axis issue, but the PX4 does come with at least one (maybe two) trigger action options that provide something similar to DAO action. The PX4D is the straight DAO and the PX4C provides a "Constant" trigger action which is something like a light DAO as I understand it.