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Mausermolt
March 28, 2010, 01:13 AM
i am looking for a pistol that
A: Kill or scare away a hungry cougar,
B: is small enough to fit in my pocket without detection of 2 legged friendlies
C: is within the 300$$ range
what caliber am i looking at (i am already set for reloading 9mm and 45 acp)
and what breed of pistols am i looking at?
i have thought about a LCP or a P11 but the P11 is a bit on the large side and the LCP sounds a little underpowered.
any ideas? thanks again from Oregon!

shortwave
March 28, 2010, 08:00 AM
How bout a Makarov, pa-64,pa-63 or a CZ82. All chambered in 9x18, very dependable, within your price range and IMO, large enough for your task-at-hand.
There are many dependable pistols out there in different calibers to fit your bill but the $300 cap makes it a little tougher.
For pocket carry, hope your considering carrying in a holster. Especially with a semi-auto. Pocket lint and pistols don't mix.

KMO
March 28, 2010, 08:22 AM
For effectiveness (.45 acp), reliability, and within your budget range...

http://www.taurususa.com/product-details.cfm?id=39&category=Pistol&toggle=tp&breadcrumbseries=CC1

t45
March 28, 2010, 10:11 AM
If I thought I had to kill a couger I would go with a 40 or 45acp. Neather one is the best however. Just my .02

Webleymkv
March 28, 2010, 10:16 AM
Cougars aren't particularly large or tough animals, so I'd think that any major caliber (9mm/.38 Special or larger) would be fine. That being said, a revolver will offer the highest size-to-power ratio particularly a small .357 Magnum like a S&W Model 60 or Ruger SP101.

shortwave
March 28, 2010, 11:31 AM
Agree with Webleymkv.

My fav. for pocket carry is an S&W 442 or 642 with Crimson Trace laser grips in a pocket holster.

You'll spend a bit more than $300 but...

Edward429451
March 28, 2010, 12:23 PM
Cougers are real thin skinned. The weapon of choice for couger hunters is the 22 LR. Almost any gun will do

Mausermolt
March 28, 2010, 12:40 PM
Seriously? a 22lr? i know a guy that popped one with a little Jennings 22 pistol on his front porch trying to eat his chickens lol. but he didn't kill it, the reservation cops found it hiding in some guys tree and put-er-down from there. i think i want something a little bit larger than a 22. sounds like a 380 or 9mm or larger would be an acceptable cartridge then?

Edward429451
March 28, 2010, 01:17 PM
Yes. Mostly to save the dogs. The dogs tree the cat and then the hunter shoots em thru the lungs with a 22 and the cat bleeds out and dies rather than blast the cat out of the tree with something larger and the cat tears up some expensive huntin dogs in its death throes.

Cats are very thin skinned. Any gun will kill a cat but you do have to hit vitals so I would take whatever you can hit best with. Dogs are thin skinned too.

Old Grump
March 28, 2010, 02:13 PM
commander size 45 if you are really wanting a pistol and need serious stopping power for a less than perfect shot. Personally I think a 44 spcl revolver with a 2 1/2" barrel might fit your plans better and would be easier to shoot for those fast follow up shots if needed. Assuming you are set on it being a pocket gun.

Mausermolt
March 28, 2010, 02:42 PM
i would like to remind that i am looking for a pistol that is at budget price and can stop a cat in its tracks. i dont want to shoot a charging putty tat and have him slowly bleed out as he is chewing on my leg :p :barf:

Charles Ellis
March 28, 2010, 02:51 PM
Within your price range the choices are very limited unless you can find a good deal on a used gun.9mm Kel-tec would come close,one of the new slim Taurus models maybe.If it was me I would spend a little more and get one of the S&W or Taurus small frame revolvers in 357 mag.

skifast
March 28, 2010, 02:56 PM
Keltec PF9

Chesster
March 28, 2010, 03:34 PM
I paid about $200 for this "customized" .44 Special last year. It fits well in a pocket holster made for my old Colt Agent. Good for man or beast, short of the big bears!!!

http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m60/Chesster_photos/CAdog1-1.jpg

bigghoss
March 28, 2010, 04:23 PM
you could find a pocket .45 but I feel better with a .357 mag like an sp101. personally I live in NE Oregon and I carry a ruger blackhawk in .45 colt with hot "ruger" loads in a shoulder holster AND a gp100 .357magnum. but I'm paranoid.:D

chris in va
March 28, 2010, 07:26 PM
Sawed off/pistol grip shotgun? :cool:

I kid. Mostly.

MadHatter1
March 28, 2010, 07:28 PM
While a .22 will kill a cougar (albeit slowly), any small caliber is not a good choice for an attacking cat. While thin-skinned, mountain lions are mean and muscular. When fueled with adrenilin during an attack, they are not easy to kill. Yes, shot placement is king, but putting a round throgh the brain or spine of a pouncing cougar is not something I'd count on. A big, heavy, expanding bullet causing sever damage to whatever area is hit is required in my opinion. Maybe a used 2" 357 could be had in your price range.

WvHiker
March 28, 2010, 07:48 PM
If I were you I would look at the .357 magnum, especially if you are at all concerned about possible two legged predator problems. It shouldn't be much of a problem to find a good used Ruger or Taurus in your price range, if you aren't too concerned about the condition of the finish.

Do you have bears up there? You can kill a black bear with a .357, but if brown bears or larger are a possibility I would look into a .44 magnum. Yes, it is bigger and costs more, but to me it would be worth the hassle for the peace of mind.

Mausermolt
March 28, 2010, 08:18 PM
well im not really worried about anything except cougar, rabid 'yotes and maby a black bear. the reason i dont want and 2 legged friendlies to know im packin' is that im in a sort of "anti-gun" area and i dont think anyone i will be working with on my summer job would appreciate knowing i have heat on me. i would just like something to have in case something hungry trys to eat my fat a$$. as long as it goes away(weather thats a big fluff cloud in the sky or just back to its hole) i am happy. besides a 357 or 44 would be a little hard to conceal in summer wear so im still leaning tward the slim frame auto's

(BH)
March 28, 2010, 08:21 PM
I'd forget about pocket carry personally. I'd also throw out the notion of any smaller calibers. I just wouldn't have any piece of mind with a little pocket gun.

As for me, .357 is the smallest I go on woods carry. I was toting my sp101 but have now switched to a g20 10mm. I want to know for sure that as long as I do my part, the cartridge will drop anything charging my way.

Mausermolt
March 28, 2010, 08:47 PM
so i guess ive asked for the uninvented eh?

dairycreek
March 28, 2010, 08:54 PM
That being said, a revolver will offer the highest size-to-power ratio particularly a small .357 Magnum like a S&W Model 60 or Ruger SP101.

+1 - and both of these revos can be found in good condition used.

bigghoss
March 28, 2010, 09:16 PM
besides a 357 or 44 would be a little hard to conceal in summer wear so I'm still leaning toward the slim frame auto's

a 5-shot snub .357 wouldn't be hard to conceal and they are practically the same size as a glock 26

Mosin44az
March 29, 2010, 12:48 AM
Well, the combination you ask for is difficult: stop a cougar, $300, fit in pocket...

I have thought about cougar defense also, although statistically rare I suppose it's possible one will attack. The scary part is that they might jump you from behind, so you HAVE to be able to access your defense weapon QUICKLY and with either hand.

If a cougar appears in front of you, I think ANY gun is enough to scare it off if you fire at it; they're not stupid. But if one is on top of you you have to be able to pull and fire into its head area, and do real damage as it is likely pretty stoked up at that point.

I have found that my Smith 638 can fire 158-grain non+P .38s without much discomfort, and that's what I carry in it. The 158 grain has more penetration than the smaller .38 loads. The 638 ( or its equivalents, 442, 642 etc.) are easily carried in a front pocket without anyone knowing, I have found this particularly true in jeans or pants with larger pockets like cargo pants. The thicker the material of the pants the more stable and comfortable.

Good luck finding even a used Airweight for $300, however. Maybe gamble on a Taurus 85 UL.

For bears, I carry UDAP bear spray. Not that concerned about black bears, and the spray has had documented success plus the bonus that it will not enrage a 600 pound animal with a thick hide and massive power.

I have also thought about a serious knife on the off-hand side, like a KBar. If you are jumped by a cougar, that may work also.

Old Grump
March 29, 2010, 03:49 PM
When you throw that many compromises in the formula you will never get a completely satisfactory solution. If is't legal to carry get what you want, if it's illegal to carry in your proposed area then I wouldn't go there. If you want a serious gun then you might have to make a compromise in your wardrobe. Cargo shorts come to mind. If you are primarily concerned about people predators than a 380 will fill your bill, stay away from grizzlies and Bison.

golfnutrlv
March 29, 2010, 08:42 PM
I would stick to a j frame Smith Revolver. Find one that chambers .38 special and .357 magnun. Get some hot loaded .357, such as Cor Bon, or similar. Carry .38 special around town, and hot .357 against the cougars. .357 is a very respectable round, even out of a short barrel.

flyinpolack
March 30, 2010, 05:40 PM
I have been looking for a good excuse to get a .44 Mag but..

I have a .40s&w atm, is that powerful enough to take a NH or VT Black bear down? How about a moose? Or a Boar? (I had a boar digging for truffles under my tent last year, not fun)..

Is it best to go with a lighter 165gr. or is a 200Gr. better for that purpose?

Edward429451
March 30, 2010, 10:05 PM
Heavier bullets will always have more stopping power than lighter bullets.

Most Black bears are not very tenacious and if you put that 40 slug where it goes you will probably have no problem killing the bear. They have been killed with 22 LR's.

But if you get a nontypical bear, who knows? 40 S&W may turn out to be marginal and get you scratched. Choose the right bullet. No HP's for sure.

Hope for the best but prepare for the worst is what they say. There's no such thing as too much gun. I'd rather have a 357 or a 44 over the 40 for woodswalking. You know you want a new 44!

headbangerJD
March 31, 2010, 07:40 PM
If you could find it, I think a Kel-tec P40 would fit what you're looking for. 40sw power in a pocketable and inexpensive gun.

Chesster
March 31, 2010, 10:16 PM
Kel-tec P40

I would only recommend these to someone I was facing in a gun fight. Loved the P11, the P40 made my all time crapola list.