AMT .380 Back-Up

[djdasher]

Years ago, I purchased an AMT Back-Up in .380 caliber. I fired it on the range several times but put it away in favor of a Walther PPK in .380 caliber. Do you think that it's safe to carry cocked and locked? It's been a while since I've thought about carrying this piece, but the appearance of other, very small caliber guns like the Ruger and Desert Eagle have interested me. Any opinions?

Thanks,

DJ

[no1_gun]

AMT is DAO. So is the 380s from Ruger and Magnum Research (maker of the Desert Eagle). No option of cocked and locked. Look for the Colt 380 Mustang if you're looking for a single action to carry cocked and locked. Another option is the CZ 380 which double action but can be carried in single action as a cocked and locked.
:)

[Sulaco2]

The first generation of the AMT Backup were single action and could be carried cocked and locked No1 Gun. The second generation about ten years ago were built as DAO's. Not sure about the safety of cocked and locked carry of this small pistol though...I would vote no and carry empty chamber. 2Cents...

[bald1]

Actually one could say that there were several generations of the SAO version if you wanted to count the different manufacturers / locations. But for simplicity there were two. Here is my AMT 380 Backup II which was made roughly between 1993 and 1995. It is fitted with the optional walnut grips vice standard black plastic. Note the style of the magazine finger grip extension as well.

Despite the concerns some voice, the safety on mine is extremely secure and coupled with the grip safety (the picture shows the pistol uncocked... cocked would have the grip safety extended out) makes it safe to carry one up the pipe for a full 5+1 capacity.

http://rap.midco.net/bald1/AMT380BackupII.jpg

[loosecannon]

Personally I wouldn' own an AMT. I hope you have better luck with that .380 then I had with ,y AMT .45 it constantly jammed. It was about the worst handgun that I have ever owned.

[bald1]

No question that the QC, especially in later years, at AMT sucked. The later DAO 380 was also known for a very heavy poor trigger pull. All that said there are some of each vintage that slipped through to become well functioning and reliable pieces. Mine is one of those.

I got mine used from a large and very reputable dealer who allowed me to take it out and put several hundred rounds through it before finalizing my purchase back in '97. BTW shooting that many rounds through this 19 ounce piece is not a lot of fun.
I wouldn't have bought it had I not only been able to handle it but also be able to do reliability and function checks at a range. Plus the price was more than right :)

[Tom2]

I had one once and it did go bang every time with ball ammo, but I cannot recall if I had issues with HP or even tried any. All my 380 shelf ammo is going to the gunshow this weekend to save some of the lost souls that cannot find ammo for their little pocket pistols. I am keeping my 32 autos and ammo as I consider them easy shooting fun guns or collectables.

[laktrash]

I have one of the old amt 380's like bald1s with a safety and grip safety bought it new early 80's I think. Never had any issues with it at all. Also have the 45 hardballer really like this one shoots great also this is after a colt barrell exchange and new spring done way back then too. I know the reputation ofamt but got lucky on both of them

[Tophog]

Same here. I have a .380 backup and a .45 Hardballer. No problems with either.

I did get one recently with the barrel split. Might have been a factory defect or bad reloads.

Only obvious mfg. flaw is that all parts are stainless steel, so are susceptible to galling. Some experts recommend lubing with lithium grease to prevent that problem.

[Mike Irwin]

"Is it safe to carry cocked and locked?"


ABSOLUTELY NOT!!!

Many of the early AMTs were defective in that if the safety moved something like 10% out of the safe position the gun would fire.

My Mother had one of these, purchased back in the early/mid 1980s. It was an abomination, but I didn't know about the safety problem until I was working for NRA and AMT was sued by a man who, while carrying the gun cocked and locked, managed to shoot himself with it.

Mac Scott, of Scott McDougal Gunsmithing (now retired), put out a call for anyone having an AMT under a certain date, and Mom's was the earliest one he found. Mac bought it (for a much better price than what Mom bought it for, but it was charged to the client, I guess), and used it in his position as an expert witness in the case.

After the trial he encased the thing in a block of lucite and engraved on it "In case of emergency get a real gun."

It sat on the counter in his shop for a number of years.


Of the MANY (17 or more) AMT firearms I have had extensive contact with over the years, only two have been functional, reliable, and overall usable. In my not so humble opinion, AMTs were never worth the seriously over-inflated price that was asked for them.

[Sulaco2]

Mike what do you think of the DAO version?

[bald1]

Well Mike, at least your post was not a universal indictment as you indicated you'd experienced at least two reliable AMTs :)

Again, as you indicated, there are some that slipped through AMT's QC as reliable and functional pieces. Anyone considering one needs to have it fully checked out. The safety on my AMT 380 Backup II takes a good solid push to move the control from "safe" to "fire." It will not move one iota on its own nor will it fire when in "safe" mode even if the grip safety is depressed.

So again I have NO problem carrying mine cocked and locked.

[Ozzieman]

I totally agree with Mike Irwin on the gun. Working in a major gun shop in Fort Wayne IN in the 80’s, we sold them by the truck load, they were very good selling guns, but on average 1/3 of them had major problems and went back to AMT. I will add that at the time AMT was very good about replacing defective guns.
We had a small number that the slide rails cracked, if memory serves me there were 4 or 5 of them and every one of them cracked on the same side in exactly the same way.
I won’t comment on the safety since I never shot one and would never shoot one. If yours works you should consider yourself lucky but in no way carry it with one in the chamber.

[Mike Irwin]

"So again I have NO problem carrying mine cocked and locked."

OK, Good, you're in South Dakota, or far enough away from me that when the inevitable happens and the POC AMT goes TU and NDs I won't be hit.... :D

In my experience and opinion, even the "good" AMTS are rather... marginal.

As for the DAO versions, I have no real experience with them, but I can only assume that they upheld, to a high degree, the honor, commitment, and quality standards of the AMT company.

In other words, I'd bet money on their being crap on a half shell, too!

TTFN! :D

[bald1]

Mike,

The "inevitable" hasn't happened in the over 12 years I've owned and carried the piece.

I'm a retired mustang military officer with plenty of weaps experience and would in no way be carrying something that hasn't been fully sanity checked. You can stay in Virginia but you'll be missing out on visiting one fantastic sportsmans' paradise here in the Black Hills:) BTW I don't hail from here either.

[Sulaco2]

Mike I speak for all of us here when I say (in the kindest way possible) STOP pussyfooting around and just tell us what you really think man!!!:D

[Mike Irwin]

"The "inevitable" hasn't happened in the over 12 years I've owned and carried the piece."

Hey, you know what that means?

It means that you're absolutely SAFE forever!

You can cancel your life insurance policies as obviously it's a waste of money. You've been alive what, 50 plus years, so that means that since the inevitable hasn't happened, it's never going to happen. Right?

Bad way of looking at it.

"I'm a retired mustang military officer with plenty of weaps experience and would in no way be carrying something that hasn't been fully sanity checked."

I, too, have plenty of weapons experience, including a 3.5 year stint as associate editor of American Rifleman magazine.

To put it mildly, there's absolutely no sanity in trusting an AMT in the manner that you are. Their quality of engineering, manufacture, and composition was just too spotty over the years.

I've seen more soft parts on AMT firearms than I have diplomatic license plates, and I live in Washington, DC, metro. OK, a slight exaggeration, but not far off the mark relatively speaking.

Did your sanity check include a full metallurgical examination of the internal parts of your AMT, including the sear, trigger assembly, and safety assembly to ensure that they are properly machined and hardened?

Yes, the AMT II was designed to correct the worst of the safety flaws in the original Backup's design, but I still wouldn't trust the design to safely do what you are doing.

If you're comfortable with it, then that's your decision, but I fell equally strongly that it is not a practice to be recommended.

[laktrash]

I seem to have a couple of the better amt's but never and would not carry my 380 cocked and locked. not 100% fail proof I may drop in pocket as bug I have better option S&W 640 ctc or cs45

[loosecannon]

Mike- I guess I was "lucky" then my AMT jammed so badly it wouldn't fire at all!:barf:

[azredhawk44]

Jeez, Mike, tell us all how you feel... :D

So you mean I shouldn't get a .400 Corbon High Standard AMT Backup for the stash of .400 lying around after my less than stellar G21 conversion?;)