First Handgun

[jarboarder1]

I was wanting some input on a first handgun. I just tuned 21 so now I kinda have an itch to get a handgun. I dont have the funds right now, but I think i will get one this summer when I make some more money. Im quite certain that I want a 1911.
I live in Colorado and do a lot of camping and stuff like that. I want to have it for camping and also want to have it in the truck with me. I know 1911's are accurate and everything, but how is there stopping power? Would it work well against a bear if I had to? I will also carry it when I get my concealed cary permit. I also would use it just for sport.
I guess I wanted to ask if you think a 1911 is a good fit for me. Also what kind of 1911 would you recommend? I really like Smith and Wesson.

Thanks for any input
-Jared

[HvyMtl]

Ok. 1911's are not the "cheap" end... So. Expect to pay good $.

FIRST: Go and rent a 1911 and shoot the thing... see if you 1) like the feel in your hands 2) like the recoil/ can deal with the recoil

NOTE: REAL 1911's are 45 caliber. This should suffice in most defense applications.
Want to stop a Bear? Get a Rifle, say in 30.06 that allows for quick follow up shots, as a full on charging bear is not an easy thing to stop... particularly if it is a Grizzly.

A Standard sized 1911 is not a good "Conceal Carry" option... as they are quite big guns... The only way you might CC a full size 1911 is in a "fanny" pack... Which might be the more comfortable way of carry...

However there are 1911 designs that are short barrel conceal carry (Colt's Defender and New Agent, Para-Ordinance Hawg series, Kimber Ultra Carry, etc.)

NOTE: The Conceal carry size 1911 give up a little velocity on the bullet (slower out of the barrel) as they are in the 3-4 inch barrel range... So, the +P or "short barrel ammo" may be a good option to ensure stopping power equal or better than a standard sized 1911.

Further note: a Conceal Carry 1911 is expensive - starting in the $800+ range new...

A GOOD basic 1911 (Rock Island Armory/Armscor or Metro Arms) can be found in the high $500 range new...

I think the Colt Defender is a good option. Or the Colt New Agent, if you do not mind the different groove in top of slide aiming sight...

Best of Luck...

Research and review is best right now...

[rsxr22]

The 1911 model is a great fit. Yes it has enough stopping power! i have never shot a bear, but im sure if you put 9 in him, that would probably do the trick. Save the last one for the head LOL. In many ways i am just like you. I am 22 and got into handguns about a year ago. I started off w/ alot of plastic beauties(glock,hk,sig,walther, and springfield) and about a week ago bought a Kimber SIS. It broke the bank a tad w/ a price tag of $1100, but it is a nail driver and i love it. If you are thinking about CC also you might want to look at a commander model (4.25" barrel) but i would make sure you get a steel frame and not alloy. It will soften felt recoil immensely and in most respects will be more accurate.

[Shane Tuttle]

Based on your post, I don't think you're ready for a 1911. If you have no knowledge of 1911s and not much experience in gunownership to begin with, I recommend starting out with a .22 instead. Look for a Ruger MkII, Browning Buck Mark, or Smith & Wesson 22A for example.

You need to learn the basics of gunownership including gun care, correct safety practices, proper gun handling, and marksmanship. It's very unwise to buy a sport bike for your first motorcycle when you don't even know how to properly ride one.

Just my $.02

[Shane Tuttle]

The 1911 model is a great fit. Yes it has enough stopping power! i have never shot a bear, but im sure if you put 9 in him, that would probably do the trick. Save the last one for the head LOL.

This has to be one of the most ignorant statements I've read in quite some time. I cannot believe I see this post before me...:barf:

..well there is Lucky and Sniper inKY to compete with that.

[jarboarder1]

Thanks alot for the replies.
I have never seen a bear up close while camping here in CO, so it wasn't my first concern. I just thought of the bad things I could run into while camping and that seemed to be the worst.
I would like to start carrying in the near future(once Im out of school), but I will be using this primarily for sport, camping, and will keep it in the truck when Im out on the trails. It seems like a full sized barrel would be the best fit for me. I do plan on getting the 45ACP.
I also realize that these are not cheap. I do not plan on buying a cheap gun, and realize that putting the money down on a good gun is worth it.

How would I go about renting one? I did not know that it was possible to rent guns.

[Chesster]

I learned handgunning on an older brother's military 1911A1. Not the easiest task in world but can be done. On the lower end of prices, I like the RIA Tactical, around $500. For $900 +/-, the Springfield Loaded.

[jarboarder1]

Tuttle8 I am not new to guns. I have grown up shooting and hunting and know how to take care of them. I used to shoot a 22 pistol my dad had when I was younger, it just doesn't really fit my needs. I also like shooting my dads 9mm. I just really like the 1911 base and since I dont have money to buy lots of guns I figured I would save up and get one good pistol

[HvyMtl]

Snakes are more likely the issue than a Bear.

Something that can fire birdshot (Taurus 3in Judge Revolver or a 410 or bigger shotgun) would come in handy...

Go to the best known and most recommended shooting range that is attached to a gun shop - they most always have rentals.

Truly a 1911 is a great gun... I think the concern is the single action trigger...

45acp - Look at these guns: Beretta PX4 Storm F, Springfield Armory XD...

Getting used to the safety rules, proper firing and cleaning of a gun is priority for you

[Father Time]

A good 1911 is something every american should own...
However don't expect it to stop a Grizzly. For a massive animal you REALLY want a rifle

[tom234]

jarboarder1, PM sent.
SW1911s are great but there are other options to think about.

[Singlesix1954]

John M. Browning made the 1911 in 45 ACP to fill a U.S. Cav. contract. It Replaced the SAA 45 Long Colt. One requirement was that be able to bring down an enemys horse. Since then it has been refined and ammo has improved. Now there have been a lot of bears killed with SAA 45 and 44-40 in camps in the last 100 yrs or so. I wouldn't recomend it as your main bear hunter, but as camp security I'd feel safe with one on my hip. I strongly belive you have more to fear from 2 legs than 4 legs anyway, even out in camp. If the 1911 is what you want and shoot well it is what you should have with you. As for CCW you might find it a bit large in summer garb.

[jarboarder1]

Alright, thanks for everyones input. It is appreciated. I have found a pistol range that rents about 30 minutes away and I think im going to try and head over there this week.

I am not completely set on a 1911 I just love the way they look, and how easy they are to disassemble. If I don't get a 1911 I would probably get a 40S&W.
For everyone saying it might not be the best first gun, Why is that? What makes it harder to learn with than any other gun?
HvyMtl- Why would a single action trigger be a bad thing?

Thanks
-Jared

[Brian48]

Alright, thanks for everyones input. It is appreciated. I have found a pistol range that rents about 30 minutes away and I think im going to try and head over there this week.

I am not completely set on a 1911 I just love the way they look, and how easy they are to disassemble. If I don't get a 1911 I would probably get a 40S&W.

For everyone saying it might not be the best first gun, Why is that? What makes it harder to learn with than any other gun?
HvyMtl- Why would a single action trigger be a bad thing?

Thanks
-Jared

I think a lot of that stems from the fact that it's a SA design and is not as "idiot proof" as one that is DAO or DA/SA. To be carried effective, the 1911 needs to be in Condition 1, ie. round chambered, hammer cocked, safety engaged. This takes discipline and presence of mind as under stress, it's easier to trip the trigger. If you already have experience with handguns, then I don't think it's a major issue for you to learn it's best practices.

[HvyMtl]

The single action "concern" was in response as to why a 1911 might not be the best "first" gun. With completely newbie owners (not yourself) the single action trigger is a concern as a 4-5 pound pull is very quick on the trigger and limits the ability of the brain to "cancel" the trigger pull.

Dual Action is roughly 12 pounds, allowing time for the brain to say,"Wait! That is not a target!" and allows for the gun to not be shot until the full pull of the trigger... A secondary "safety" of sorts.

I prefer the 45 to the 40 due to the recoil differences... Test out the 40 when you go to the shooting range...

[hdawson228]

I couldn't be happier with my Springfield Armory 1911 in stainless. And they do make smaller sized of the 1911 design. Mine is full sized and I have carried it some, but usually I carry my Kahr for SD. :cool:

[jarboarder1]

I see what you mean now HvyMtl. I have never shot a double action handgun before. I will give it a try when I go to the range.
Thanks for the input.

[Warchild]

Personally being the key word, if you were looking for something to take into the woods, hunting, backpacking, look into a Glock 10mm, if you're looking for a nice piece to carry concealed and have a blast at the range, 1911's are great. Just make sure it's a Dan Wesson Bobtail.

[DocDizz]

I have to STRONGLY disagree that a DA/SA or DAO is more "idiot proof" than a straight SA. Most current 1911's have 3 safeties, whereas the older ones have 2. How many "safeties" does a Glock have? 1, and to disengage it you simply apply pressure to the trigger. For the 1911, you have to manually release the thumb safety as well as push in on the grip safety firmly (the third is the firing pin block that SOME models [Kimber Series 2, Colt series 80, etc]) and consciously squeeze the trigger. Compare that to an idiot with a Glock sticking his finger in the trigger guard "accidentally" and causing it to "magically" discharge with his booger hook.

I would not discourage a 1911 as a first handgun for "lack of safety features." If price is an issue, I'd say Glock (if you want .45 look at the 21SF or 30SF). Otherwise, a Springfield Mil-Spec or basic Kimber (can be found used in the $600-700 range) would be a great gun to start with.

[jarboarder1]

I dont understand why a glock would be a better choice for being in the woods. The 1911 was made for the military originally, correct? Im sure Browning wasn't expecting it to be in the cleanest of environments when he designed it.
I dont think Im going to get a glock. I dont really like the way it looks. I like the looks of some of the Kahr's though.

[hdawson228]

Kahrs are great for a close-in self defense weapon. www.kahr.com:cool:

[Lolgasm]

Because the Glocks are also made for ruggedness and in torture tests they work extremely well. The 10mm is a good caliber as well, its a big bullet and has a lot of velocity. While I like the looks of a 1911 as well, I carry a revolver because its easier to conceal, and I dont worry about the lack of ammo in it, I have 5 in the cylinder and 5 in a speedloader and that should get the job done. As for stopping power, a .38 is all i need.

You may want to reconsider your first gun, for a bedside or truck gun or an occasional use gun, a 1911 is ideal. For concealed carry and all around use, a springfield XD or a Glock would be the better buy IMO.

My grandad has a beautiful Remington Rand 1911 from WWII. Its in immaculate condition and while i dont think running around in the woods or scratching it would ruin its performance, why beat the hell out of a beautiful gun like that? If you get a Glock, no matter what you to do it, its gonna look butt ugly anyway.

[allenomics]

Rent some guns and test fire a bunch of guns. Let us know what you buy.

[Shane Tuttle]

For everyone saying it might not be the best first gun, Why is that? What makes it harder to learn with than any other gun?

Forgive me for thinking this, but when a member states they're 21 and want a first handgun, doesn't know anything at all about the 1911 yet claims to be experienced with gunhandling practices with pistols, it just doesn't add up to me. I'm by no means accusing you of lying. I don't know you from Joe Smoe. But I don't have much to go on except the pattern of onslaughts of new members that come onboard and want to jump in with both feet before testing the water. What makes it worse is other members egging them on with no inhibitions. There's way too much "advice" given that's merely what an OP wants to hear rather than what the OP should hear. IHO, this isn't only an unwise practice, it's flat out irresponsible. That's why I come across as being a jerk. I don't tolerate it and I have no respect for people that are "yes" men or give an answer without making sure bases are covered in reasonable fashion. My apologies to you if I stereotyped you or jumped to conclusions.

So, why would I not recommend a 1911? Because there's arguably better platforms to start out. This is not the correct forum, but I'd look into a revolver for one. If you're adamant on a semi-auto I have to ask to clarify if you're well founded on safe gunhandling practices. If so, I think you should look into striker fired guns such as a Glock, XD, M&P, etc. or Ruger's P series. They come in DAO or DA/SA utilizing the tried and true hammer yet are set on polymer frames.They're inexpensive, utilitarian, reliable firearms that you won't cringe if they get a little beat up and will still function without a hitch. If you think a 1911 is truly easy to disassemble, then the said suggestions will bring a pleasant surprise.

A 1911 is a great gun. It's my favorite platform. I'll argue 'til kingdom come that it's just about the best platform out there for most applications. However, I think it would be wiser to purchase one down the road for other applications such as training courses, competition, range plinking, etc.

[B.N.Real]

Go rent some guns and spend some money on ammo.

You will save yourself thousand of dollars in disappointment if you do.

Only a 10mm semi auto (full sized Glock) or a 44 mag revolver (four to six inch Smith) is the starting point for a self defense handgun against bears.

And that is being used by experienced shooters.

Both handguns have a substantial blast and recoil.

And almost all handguns are a poor solution to a charging bear.

If you are new to handguns,you are actually better served by buying some bear pepper spray or foam and whatever handgun you want to carry.

Being a good shot with a shotgun loaded with slugs ( and having it with you)does'nt hurt.

But the best defense against bear attack is being very alert to noises and unexpected turns in the trail plus being very sure to not have any open food garbage or supplies around you.

Bears can smell food at very long distances.

You don't want the bear close to you in the first place if you can help it.

[Gunscribe]

If you have your heart set on a 1911, you probably won't be satisfied with anything else.

The Beretta 92fs was my love at first sight. It remains my favorite gun, and if I had bought a different pistol based on technical considerations, I would still be thinking about that Beretta.

That said, .45-caliber ammo is so darn expensive. You sure you can afford the bullets at this point?

[jarboarder1]

Hey thanks for all the input.
I am reconsidering getting a 1911. If i were to get a good deal on one I dont think I could turn it down, but I now understand what everyone is saying about not getting one.

Tuttle8, thanks for the input. I am glad you actually gave me some feedback instead of just encouraging me to do whatever. I am familiar with guns. I grew up in an atmosphere where my dad was intolerant of any messing around. Admittedly most of my safety training and training in general has been with rifles, and shotguns, and very little with handguns. That is why I came here asking for input. I plan on taking a three day corse that will also satisfy a CCW corse in colorado in the next couple months. This should further my knowledge of safety and use of handguns.

Lets forget about the Bear thing that was a stupid thing to add into my first question. I have a browning 12 ga. that I took to Alaska for that purpose.

Anyways it seems like everyone keeps recommending glock, Springfield xd, Beretta px4 storm, and Ruger P series. I am not a huge fan of the way glocks look, but it seems like everyone likes them. I do like the looks of the px4 storm and the xd, as well as some of the P series. Are any of these a better, more accurate pistol. I realize this all comes down to preference so until I get a chance to go hold and shoot them I wont be able to decide.
Hopefully I will be going to a range on friday.

[Shane Tuttle]

Are any of these a better, more accurate pistol.

People will argue Ford vs. Chevy 'till the cows come home...then argue some more. When the chips are down, the majority of the big name polymers out there are proven to be reliable, combat accurate, easy and simple to clean, and reasonably priced. Not everybody likes Glocks. I'm one of them. But just because it feels like a 2x4 in my hands and is uncomfortable to shoot doesn't mean it will be the same for you. Like you said, it really comes down to personal preference. If the gun feels right in your hand, points well for you in your own stance, and firing it is enjoyable, I'd buy it. If you're wanting my personal preference, I'm an XD man all the way.

Glad to see you're looking into attending more classes. You can never attend too many.