Anyone see the Ruger LCP .380?

[sdkidaho]

Not too bad looking for a small carry gun. Looks like it would be better than the Keltec and the price isn't too bad.

http://www.ruger-firearms.com/LCP/index.html

[DeathRodent]

I think Ruger has just gotten competitive in the CCW market.

I know a lot of people don't like .380's but thisone looks good.

Maybe they could make it in a 9mm or a .40?

[LightningJoe]

Manufactured under license from Kel-Tec? Look at the exploded diagram. It's P-3AT clone! Taurus built their version (improved) of the P-11 and called it the Millennium and then the Millennium Pro (the Mil-Pro is excellent, by the way, much better than the P-11). Now Ruger clones the P-3AT. It's nicer-looking gun, I think.

[Playboypenguin]

There are a few threads already going.

There is supposedly no joint effort with Kel-Tec according to Ruger.

[ShootemDown]

the finish on it looks much better than on keltecs.. I might have to buy one in the future..

[LightningJoe]

No joint effort. A direct steal. But better materials, better looks, higher price. Whatever. Let'em fight it out.

[Playboypenguin]

But better materials, better looks, higher price. Whatever. Let'em fight it out.
It's retail price is only $4.00 more than the P3AT.

[LightningJoe]

$4.00, you say. Well, that's pretty good for the better grip material. And is that a slide stop I see on the Ruger? I'm no Kel-Tec fanatic. Maybe the time has come to trade in my P-32.

[denfoote]

No joint effort. A direct steal. But better materials, better looks, higher price. Whatever. Let'em fight it out.

It's my understanding that George Kellgren did not patent the P3AT. It is in the public domain.

[LightningJoe]

Not everything is patentable. Not saying Kel-Tec can sue Ruger. But the derivative nature of their new gun is pretty clear. It's OK with me. If they can take Kel-Tec's pretty decent design and improve on it, that's good for us.

[JollyRoger]

+1 on LightningJoe's comment. The guts of the Keltec: delayed blowback system, polymer frame, lockwork have all been done before in other guns. Nothing original here to patent: you can't patent a combination of existing technologies. Ruger could have made an exact copy and Keltec wouldn't be able to do anything about it, ala NAA and Autagua copying Seecamp.

[hoplophile]

The rule is that when no patents exist or patents have expired a company is free to copy anything from another manufacturer provided they are copying something that has some sort of functional advantage. They are not allowed to copy features that do not relate to function but involve trade dress issues.

Trade dress refers to appearance. A manufacturer can freely copy everything from another manufacturer that is mechanical and not patent protected. A manufacturer cannot copy purely cosmetic features that would tend to create confusion as to which manufacturer is responsible for making a product. The internal workings of a Rolex may be copied. The copier just can't make the watch look like a Rolex.

I don't see the Ruger being a copy of the Kel Tec. There's nothing really unique or new about either pistol.

[NCHornet]

I have one on order, they aren't expected to hit gun stores until end of March to mid April so don't go looking for one yet. Price will be around $300.00. I will give my evaluation as soon as I get the call that it is in.
NCH

[Playboypenguin]

Check this out.
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=279717

[turbojohn]

Damn, another seecamp look-a-like with the same "too short" hand grip for .380 caliber. Such a short grip offers no more than 1+1/4 fingers at best to hold the gun which is nearly useless for these larger-high recoil .380s especially if any rapid 1-handed firing is planned. Shot placement with my .380 seecamp was worthless in rapid (panic) fire before I added a small 1/4"finger mag-extension" for a solid 2-finger grip to better stabilize the small pistol.

Maybe Ruger will be smart like North American (guardian380) and offer a small mag finger extension. The seecamp, overall, is still smaller (length 4.25"vs 5.6" ruger, height 3.25"vs 3.6" ruger), but is still heavier 11.5oz vs. 9.4oz(ruger). However, the 2.1oz may help some for better shot placement when the mousegun begins to jerk/jump around with rapid fire in a panic situation.

[Bill DeShivs]

It looks nothing like a Seecamp.
All of these guns of this type were designed to be as small as possible.
Beretta makes a large .380, if you don't want to learn how to use a small one.

[alamo]

+1 on LightningJoe's comment. The guts of the Keltec: delayed blowback system,

There is no Kel-Tec pistol (P-32, P-3AT or either of their 9MMs) that are delayed blowback designs.

[Mike H]

Looks nice, but I'll wait for the bugs to be worked out and the chromed versions to come out before parting with some $.

[Stevie-Ray]

Hmmm....I think I might get one right away. The P3AT came out too late, after I got my P32. Rugers though, well, I love all the Rugers I have. Maybe it's time to get another and see how they do on a carry piece.:D

[LightningJoe]

There is no Kel-Tec pistol (P-32, P-3AT or either of their 9MMs) that are delayed blowback designs.


OK. Then what do you call that kind of action? Kel-Tec calls it locked-breech. I'm a gun operator, not a gun technician. But it's a type of action that gives you less recoil than a blow-back (like the ferocious NAA Guardian .32)

[JRAR78]

It is a nice looking gun !

[jon_in_wv]

I caught the "delayed blowback" too but its not technically incorrect. That is exactly what it is. While most of these designs are usually called "locked breech" weapons, they are really delayed blowback weapons. The design of the weapon is to leave the slide and barrel locked together briefly to allow the bullet to leave and pressures to drop before unlocking, from there its no difference at all compared to a traditional blowback weapon. The locked breech simply negates the need for heavy slide and stiff springs to absorb the energy created by the process. The Keltec could probably be made as a pure blowback with a really stiff spring and maybe a tungsten slide. It would still be small but it would weigh a ton for its size.

No matter what anyone says I think Ruger is gonna sell a BAJILLION of these LCPs.

[darko]

I just sold my P3AT last night and will be picking one of these up ASAP.