Help me Pick a New .45 ACP Pistol

[vitesse9]

My wife got sick of hearing me complain about my Kimber Custom II's inability to feed anything reliably (even after two trips back to the factory it still coughs enough to give me pause) and agreed to let me buy a new .45. Her conditions: 1) that I reseach the heck out of my choices, and 2) buy a gun that I will keep for a very long time. Price range: $1,000 max.

Here's the short list I've compiled so far (in this order):

1) H&K USP
2) Sig P220
3) Glock 21
4) Glock 21SF
5) Springfield XD 5' Tactical
6) S&W M&P

To narrow the field, here are my criteria (again in this order):

1) Reliability. No doubt that it will function in almost any condition whether hunting in the field or right out of the nightstand.
2) Durability. I shoot A LOT and the gun has to hold up. I don't want to worry about rust, early wear of small parts, springs etc. It has to be around for the long haul with minimal maintenance (i.e. routine cleaning).
3) Shootability.
4) Accuracy.

I am interested in FIRST HAND experience with these guns, or with guns not on the list. I'm only interested in a full sized handgun and NO 1911s. And please, no comments about what some guy at a gun shop's brother's uncle told you etc.

[pogo2]

You have listed some good guns in your post. The one that I have the most experience with, and could recommend highly, is the H&K USP 45. I have owned the one shown below for about 7 years and have fired it a great deal at the range. It has been reliable and accurate with all types of ammo. The gun's components are "heavy duty", which becomes apparent when you field strip it for cleaning and inspect the parts. I think it would be difficult to wear out this gun.

It is a little large for carry purposes, but I presume you have something smaller for that application.

http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o25/pogo2/HKUSP4522.jpg

[PSP]

To narrow the field, here are my criteria (again in this order):

1) Reliability. No doubt that it will function in almost any condition whether hunting in the field or right out of the nightstand.
2) Durability. I shoot A LOT and the gun has to hold up. I don't want to worry about rust, early wear of small parts, springs etc. It has to be around for the long haul with minimal maintenance (i.e. routine cleaning).
3) Shootability.
4) Accuracy.


The most accurate pistol I own
Durable as they come
Shootable...Oh yes.
Reliable, as reliable as a pistol can be.
HK USP .45 Elite

Similar to the above but with a hand fitted 6" barrel. A very nice firearm available from CDNN for the excellent price if $1004.

http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i186/ripley16/HKElite.jpg

[STAGE 2]

HK USP or the new HK 45 though the latter hasn't been out long enough to wring out the bugs yet.

[Wildalaska]

220. never seen one burp

WildsiggyAlaska ™

[rjs]

Guess I would vote for the Glock 21 seeing that it is my goto gun after my 1911's. Have not yet held the SF version. Good luck on your purchace.

[RJM]

I have owned a Sig p220, G21 and now own an XD .45 tactical. All I can say is that the XD shoots the best out of the three. My Sig was sold to my father in law who uses it at work for a carry piece and I will eventually buy it back from him. It shoots great and to my knowledge has never had a hiccup, but the single/double action trigger was hard to get used to and I had to add a hogue grip. The stock ones blew. The G21 did not fit my hands well and I found it to be not as accurate as the sig in my hands. It has a very large grip, but it does have that glock reliability. Enter the XD. What can I say. It is a tack driver, fits my hands, recoil is low, looks cool (dark earth) and has been completely reliable after 1500 rounds. Just a good gun. I plan on getting the compact version as soon as rounds become available.

FWIW, I have also started looking at Glocks GAP pistols for a CCW .45. Its not ACP, but it does push a .45bullet out of a pistol the size of the G26. I may pick up one of these after the XD compact.

[allenomics]

I'd get the G21SF. I bought one for $529. With a $1000 budget, you'll have a lot left over for ammo.

[625]

Of those choices, I'd choose the Sig or the Glock and have money left over for whatever.

[ShootingNut]

That way you will never wonder if you made the right choice. Just tell the little lady, that it's only 6 guns, and a lot of guys have many more than that in their collection!
Show her post #59 here. http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=187857&highlight=Gixerman&page=3
Good Luck:D
SN

[ShootingNut]

I need help also, my delima (spelling?) is do I go 1911 or another Poly?
Like the mag capacity of the Poly's, but am taken by the Springfield "Loaded"
Stainless or the S&W 1911 stainless also.
Can't sleep at night over this!:eek:
SN

[briang2ad]

If you want a gun the size of a REAL Compact that really fits the hand, has 10+1, is accurate, reliable, and looks cool, get one. Then when you want 13+1, you slap in the 13 rounder with integral grip adaptor, and you have the service pistol. And you have a grip safety, loaded indicator, and striker indicator to boot.

Or, if you cannot STAND having a convertible gun, get the service or tactical!

[optimist]

Beretta PX4

Robust lockwork design, accurate, and if my 9mm PX4 is an indicator, it ought to be stone cold reliable. Of course it's new, so no absolutes yet, but it ought to be on your short list.

[Perldog007]

Since you did not say what fer you wuz a wantin' this pistol that muddies the water some.

I love my XD, have experience with Glock, fine gun too. Only peripherial (shot samples belonging to acquaintances) of the USP and 220.

You didn't say if you had a press. Me, for a grand would snag an XD/Lasermax and try to pull a dillon square deal out of my cheeks (up to over a grand now).

The XD is ugly,small,accurate and a good grip for a doublestack acp IMO.

No experience or even much press knowledge of the M&P - I seriously doubt if you would be hating life with any of your choices.

[DBski]

Ruger 345. Reliable, shoots anything I've put in it. Fairly concealable, alot slimmer than the P90. More than adequite for accruracy. Nough said.

[michael t]

Gee in the 1911 its called a Colt I have never had a Colt that needed anything right out of the box relieable and accurate. I HAD a Kimber for a little over a mo. I learned my Lesson. I have replaced with another Colt.

[oldandslow]

vitesse9

Happy new year. I have the Sig 220 and HK-USP .45 compact. Both have thousands of rounds through them with no problems. While I think both are equivalent in quality I would recommend the Sig because of the plentiful supply of spare parts and cheaper replacement mags. I had some serious problems getting HK spare parts. Good luck.

best wishes- oldandslow

[MTMilitiaman]

I'd go for the 220 in your choice of trigger configuration (SAO, DA/SA) or the Glock 21SF depending on how either fit your hand and pointed for you.

I can't recommend HK. I didn't have a good experience with mine, and regardless, even if it works as advertised, it is overpriced as a polymer framed handgun.

[Pilot]

Sorry to hear your soured on 1911's. Here's a few alternatives:

CZ-97B - Robust, accurate and reliable.

HK USP Tactical .45 - Gives you a match trigger, adjustable sights and O-ring barrel for increased accuracy.

Sig P220 Match - Tuned trigger, better accuracy than standard P220 which is another fine choice.

The HK and Sig Match are still under your $1K limit with the CZ being about half that, but not half the pistol.

[Bentonville]

the new HK45. Meets or surpasses all of your criteria. In addition, back strap choices making the grip the most comfortable I have held. What more can be said?

[MTMilitiaman]

HK USP Tactical .45 - Gives you a match trigger, adjustable sights and O-ring barrel for increased accuracy.

Match trigger...

Heehehehe...ahhhh...

It's sad they call it a match trigger, too. Long, heavy, gritty--not typically associated with "match" triggers, but o wait, it has that fancy over travel adjustment, so it must be match :rolleyes:

[Taurus_9mm]

Springfield XD Tactical, some extra magazines and some ammo. :D


www.xdtalk.com

[orionengnr]

Don't know if you are going to carry it or not, but either way...

I've shot the HK, several XDs, many Glocks of differing calibers--even owned two of them. Have not shot the 220 or the M&P, but have handled both. While all of these are capable, none really does much for me.

That said, I sure am taken with my Kahr P45. Somewhere in the "compact" range, 18.5 oz, 4" barrel, 6+1 polymer frame. Mine is accurate, dead reliable and, while brisk in recoil due to it's light weight, is not unpleasant. (And I'm a skinny old fart with previously broken wrists--if you are not, it will be a non-issue.)

They now make a PM45 which is closer to he "subcompact" size. I might have to buy one of those too :)

[katana8869]

Ruger 345. Reliable, shoots anything I've put in it. Fairly concealable, alot slimmer than the P90. More than adequite for accruracy. Nough said.

My carry gun used to be my XD45C or my S&W PD Commander. I bought a Ruger P345 used for $350 and it has replaced both of these guns as my favorite carry pistol.

[Crimp]

Don't know if this will help - my only shooting experiences with the handguns on your list are with the M&P, Glock and the XD45 Tac. My experience with the M&P is limited to 50 rounds on an outdoor range and my experience was good. I have no good/bad comments about Glocks other than they don't fit me and I'm left-handed. I now own 3 XDs and will probably buy another one this year (40 Sub).

In the XD 45 Tac, I've shot 185gr SWC, RN and HP, 200gr HP/XTP and 230gr FMJ and HP - both commercial and lead/jacketed handloads. The only round I could never get to feed right were SWCs. I don't know how many rounds have gone through it (maybe 2500-3000?), but the SWCs are the only thing that ever made it burp.

I trust the XDs and my wintertime CCW is an XD9SC.

[old_ironsights]

The FNP-45 is getting rave reviews from critics. Now if FN Herstal would just produce the damn thing! Their ad says they're available, and it lies...
http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b130/martynoland/Jan0205.jpg

[YukonKid]

Sig 220

[dgludwig]

For just a little more than $1000.00, you can get the best .45 ACP ever made IMO: the Smith & Wesson Performance Center 945. Very well made, accurate and reliable. My second (and less "exotic") choice would be the Sig 220.

[ShootingNut]

The website shows over two grand?:eek:
http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CategoryDisplay?catalogId=11101&storeId=10001&categoryId=15714&langId=-1&parent_category_rn=15701&top_category=15701

[dgludwig]

The over $2,000.00 price is a retail figure. "Street" prices, as is the case for most other firearms, are considerably less. I paid too much for mine at just under $1,400.00 (new) last year as I've seen them since go for as little as $1,200.00 (new) and as low as $800.00 slightly used.

[jdc1244]

Sorry, whenever I see the phrase ‘.45 ACP Pistol’ I automatically think of a Colt 1911. Silly me, I keep forgetting there are others. Sorry again - carry on...:o

[rnxrx]

I've lurked for a while on here and would echo the comments from others that there are no bad choices on your list but wanted to chime in on the XD45ACP Tactical. I bought one of the first ones available in bi-tone (stainless over black) about a year ago. Out of all of the pistols I own I would trust this one more than anything else (with the possible exception of my P7). I've probably put in excess of 3000 rounds through it from most ammo manufacturers you could name - reloads, HP, RNL, light, heavy, +P, etc, etc and have yet to see it malfunction in any way. I find both the trigger and the sights to be highly user friendly and the various safeties (grip, etc) to be both non-intrusive and effective.

It's kind of funny - this gun is always by my bedside, ready to go. I actually don't even take it to the range all that often any more - in part because I'm usually working on guns that are more colorful/exotic but less consistent and in part because the XD is almost boring in its accuracy, consistency and reliability. I probably won't be buying another XD any time soon, but this would be one of the last guns I would sell. There's a niche in my collection for a gun that's absolutely reliable and fairly accurate for HD use and my XD45 pretty well perfectly fills it.

Good luck!

[novaDAK]

Consider a Ruger P90 :)

[IdahoG36]

I am picking up my GLOCK 21SF tomorrow. I can't wait. I held one and it fit my hand nicely. I used to have a GLOCK 20, and the grip was just huge. The new GLOCK 21SF I bought has night sights, and I picked up an Insight Technologies M6 light/laser combo. It is going to be a nice setup. 14 rounds of .45acp. What more could a guy ask for?

[IdahoG36]

I also forgot to add this- Ruger P345. I handled one the other day and the grip feels awesome. Ruger really did a good job in reducing the bulkiness of their autos. Check one out if you can.

[Shadi Khalil]

i shot a 220 SOA recently, quite possibly the sweetest shooting .45 I've ever shot in my life. You cant miss wiith this thing, accuracy, reliablity, no recoil, perfect balance. Take down is simple, 8 rounds mags (that actually work with the .45 it came with!) I was really amazed by it. He got his NIB for $950.00. I pick up my new 239 on the 15th and thats the same day I'm putting money 1/2 down on a 220 SOA. If you want something that is gonna work right out of the box, look at one of these. If you can, squeeze the ol' laday for a few more sheckles and get a two tone elite. thats boner city in my book.

Hope you like what you get, please let us know and pics and reports are a must!!!

[Army GI]

H&K USP is good. Get that.

[obxned]

Have you looked at the Ruger P345? Don't be fooled by the low price. It will do the job reliably, accurately, and nearly forever.

I would not trade my used P345 for a NIB example of any of the other pistols mentioned.

[P97]

P345 would fit the Criteria and so will my CCW.
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b357/P97/p90-1.jpg

[DrLaw]

What about the Taurus 1911 clone? Anybody have any experience with that one?

The Doc is out and pondering now. :cool:

[Officer's Match]

I'd go with the 21SF. With the money you save, you can easily stock up on springs and other wear and tear items to last several forevers. And conversion barrels, etc. for other calibers like 10mm, aftermarket fun stuff like triggers - the fun never ends. Plus, since all Glocks look alike, it would be easy to sneak others in without the wife noticing (not that I'd advocate such devious behavior ;) ).

[rgunn.45]

Absolutely love mine, and carry it everywhere.:D

[dBA]

Another vote for the Ruger P345 - tough as can be, and fits my hand like a glove. At $450, buy two!

[WVfishguy]

With a $1,000 budget, you can buy a full-sized Bersa Thunder .45 for a house gun, and a compact Thunder .45 for CC, with more than $200 left over for ammo. :)

[Breakdaddy]

My XD45 has been 100 percent reliable. I trust it as my primary CCW and can recommend it. I have just over 1000 rounds through it but it's been rock solid. My XD40 and XD9 have also been absolutely reliable.

[jmark127]

I give another vote for the P345. It has been accurate and dependable from the start. It is a single stack, so it has slim profile. I'm waiting for the FNP .45 to be available. That may be another good option with more capacity in addition to the HK on your list. There are lots of good options. You just have to decide on action (SA, DA or DA/SA) and how much magazine capacity you want.

[imq707s]

XD-45 Tactical

[MrCleanOK]

I have over 2000 rounds through a 4" XD45 and have never had a malfunction of any kind. It's very accurate when I do my part, very "shootable". My only complaint is that I think it shows more holster wear than it should, but nothing to really raise a fuss about. I use it because it works and works darned well, not because it's pretty.

[DHart]

Glock 21SF. Will meet your needs in spades. Definitely consider the importance of capacity... missed shots and multiple perps commonly rule the hell-fire of a self-defense situation. The 21 SF will give you 14-rounds with standard mags.

[ShootingNut]

Yes, I understand the website shows msrp.
I just never saw any gun sell for less than 50% of it's msrp that's all, not trying to agrue or discredit your post.
Regards,
SN

[theotherguy]

Just go with a Glock and be done with it, it is ugly but if you can see past that, it is totally reliable. That is my two cent.:)

[dgludwig]

Shooting Nut: No problem on my end. I italized the word "little" in my original post because I'm well aware that $1,400.00 is a little more than a little over $1,000.00. :)A failed attempt at being cute or even facetious I guess.

But the 945 is still a great bargain even if it's only a little under $1,500.00!

[12-34hom]

For what you listed, i would go with a H&k compact - Variant #1 - 45acp.

Have owned a full sized & compact model. Both excellent weapons.

I prefer a 1911 government model - hence the series 70 that i carry CCW & duty purposes.

Your mileage may vary.

12-34hom.

[shortwave]

love my para ordinance 45- companion model. carries well,have shot various ammos of different loads and is accurate. trigger is as smooth as you`ll find out of box. you have your choice of single or double stack mags. 1st para i`ve owned but won`t be last. goodluck

[Aaron_B]

You have to give the Ruger P345 a really good look. I have put nearly 2000 rounds through mine. It has not hiccuped once, very accurate, compact enough for ccw, very easy to field strip, and it is a good looking gun!

I really cant say enough good things about it. Every time I hand it to someone else at the range they are impressed. I think I paid around $450 nib.

[Socrates]

Personal experience:
Sig 220. FANTASTIC GUN. Reloaded for it, and, it was always flawless.

Now, about that Custom II. If you want to send it to a decent gunsmith, for inspection, fixing or sale, email me, and I'll give you the guys name. My Custom II has a whole bunch of custom Ed Brown parts, and drives tacks.

Why you would send the gun back to the factory, to be worked on by rookie gunsmiths, getting paid minimum wage, is beyond me. But, feel free.

I'll give you 300 for it, shipped to my gunsmith, for inspection. Email me if you are intrested.

[Constantine1911]

Normaly I would have suggested the Custom II but today for the 3rd time shooting this gun it has jammed on me for the last time. I know it's a 1911 but I payed $600 dollars and got a gun that jams. Sadly I think I might buy another Glock or a Ruger.

[Socrates]

Same offer. 300 bucks, send to my gunsmith, 3 day inspection...email me...

[The Immortal]

Fnp-45

[The Immortal]

Fnp-45

[tomgow29]

Out of the choices you listed, I have had extensive experience with three so I will limit my comments to those.

H&K

I had a USP Tactical (My first high end purchase) and it was an expensive nightmare. The slide would not lock back on an empty mag. I replaced followers, mag springs, whole magazines and the slide stop (All at HK's high prices) with no positive resulst. Phone calls to HK yeilded their willingness to look at if I paid shipping both ways. They would not quote a time frame for the guns return so I headed for a local shop and traded it at a loss.

I have friends that love their HK's and I even had a USPc for a while that worked fine. The whole experience soured me for them.

I have had much better experience with the G21 and the M&P 45. Both have been very reliable and I just started issuing the M&P's to my guys.

Just my .02.

[Sgt.Fathead]

I've had my P345 for about two months and it has swallowed and belched out over two thousand rounds of various .45ACP loads with nary a hiccup. The grip feels like a firm, solid, handshake. The controls are in the right places. Recoil is minimal, for a .45 auto, and the sights are great, too. I also have the P90, just picked up for a steal this past Friday, and it can't compare, the older brother to the P345's sharp new kid.

Don't let the low price of a Ruger fool you; they are maybe ugly but they are built like tanks, handle and shoot very well and they last and last. For $1K, you can get one, a nice holster made by Simply Rugged and many rounds of ammo, too. I've never loved a semi-auto as I love it. I'd sell my two Para 1911s before this brute.

[softmentor]

+ 1 for the top of your list, the HK USP .45 I love mine. nicest recoil, notorious reliability, and they can run tens of thousands of rounds and keep on running.
if I could add one to the list you may want to consider the NEW HK45 with interchangeable grip and back strap

[philbo]

Based on your list I'd go with either the XD or M&P... whichever felt better. Been shooting an XD45 for almost 2 years, and after thousands of rounds it's been reliable with everything but semi-wad cutters.

[David the Gnome]

I'd love to have a Sig P220.

http://www.sigsauer.com/images/catalog/product/220EliteSTLeft.jpg

[jlficken]

I would go with a Glock 21SF if you have smaller hands or a 21 if you have large hands and add these sights if you don't want night sights
https://www.heinie.com/cart/product_info.php?cPath=9_11&products_id=89&osCsid=9b898199e83f21ea8d6c9a1a34669776
or these if you do
https://www.heinie.com/cart/product_info.php?cPath=9_11&products_id=90&osCsid=9b898199e83f21ea8d6c9a1a34669776

The sights are awesome I have them on my G23. Since I got my 21 (I also have a 21SF I have never shot...long story) I have just started add Glocks to my collection. I have a G20, G21, G21SF, G23, and a G27. They just seem to work and I am scary accurate with the G21 for some reason. My Kimber Pro Raptor II just sits in the safe now.

This is all mute if you don't like Glocks. If that is the case then the FNP-45 looks really interesting to me. I don't care for the triggers on HK's in general.

[Jim Z.]

I like my P-220 personally.


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v439/Pathfinder09/HPIM0698.jpg


:cool:

[sig-9]

Sig 220 no rail & the short trigger GREAT GUN.

I have shot the Ruger 345- feels great in my small hands & very accurate.
I am looking to pick one up used. I see them new in the low $400's so if I can save $100, why not.

Not giving up the Sig 220.

[Sgt.Fathead]

Got my P345 NIB for less than $400.00 delivered from Bud's on that damned credit card of theirs. It comes with two 8-round mags (a good start :) ) and the usual lock, instructions.