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View Full Version : Went to the range, please critique my shooting position....


MyGunsJammed
October 27, 2007, 12:45 PM
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l58/Charlee123abc/R3-1.jpg

Well I went to the range for the first time to fire a semi-automatic handgun. Previously, I've fired .38 cal revolvers which had no kick at all and felt like cap guns. But anyhow, I got to fire a 9mm Sig P228-229 forgot which model it is and also a Colt 1911A1 .45

Upon firing the .45 for the first time, I was like crap, I cant even hit my target and I'm nearly firing at the paper target at point blank range.

With the 9mm, I did so much better, I was able to empty a 12+ round clip on target, but couldnt hit squat with the .45

Anyhow, my buddy who owns these guns told me that the kick from the .45 is slightly stronger than the 9mm, but he prefers the stopping power of the .45.

will shooting position always affect accuracy?

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l58/Charlee123abc/R1-2.jpg
Showing off my car :D

mballai
October 27, 2007, 12:55 PM
The first time I shot a 1911, I couldn't hit squat either. Watch your front sight, press the trigger, let the recoil go up your arm. Takes a bit of practice. If you are still having trouble get an instructor and let him show you how to do it correctly. From your picture I'd lean a bit more forward.

stmcelroy
October 27, 2007, 12:57 PM
You're going to fall over backwards....:D

You need to lean forward towards the target. Also I would try straighten both arms and try shooting with both thumbs facing the target, instead of burying your right thumb. If anything, I would have your right thumb on top of the left one. It will give you more control of the weapon.

Creature
October 27, 2007, 12:58 PM
Looks more like you are using a modified weaver/isosceles mix. Pick one or the other.

And you are leaning back on your heels a tad too far. I would try to straighten up your stance and shift you weight to the balls of your feet.

You might even want to try leaning forward a bit, bending slightly at the waist.

rellascout
October 27, 2007, 01:00 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysa50-plo48

Lean forward more, stand straight on square to the target, adjust your hands slightly

What Just Happened?
October 27, 2007, 01:06 PM
For your stance, think snowboarding. But not as aggressively leaning forward.

crashm1
October 27, 2007, 01:49 PM
As others have said lean forward, concentrate on the front sight and press. There now I can say nice wheels dude. I prefer sport bikes for vehicular toys but an EVO is right up there of 4 wheeled vehicles I lust after.

The Tourist
October 27, 2007, 02:14 PM
Lean a tad forward, sell the plastic car and buy a Harley.

Practice, practice, practice. Get a dummy round and then dry fire...

MyGunsJammed
October 27, 2007, 07:15 PM
The Tourist Lean a tad forward, sell the plastic car and buy a Harley.

Practice, practice, practice. Get a dummy round and then dry fire...

That sounds like a good idea, I shoud get some dummy rounds and practice.
LOL about the car, I've always been into Jap rockets.....I also have a Jap crotch rocket....

Later in life I'll get a Harley ;)

crashm1 As others have said lean forward, concentrate on the front sight and press. There now I can say nice wheels dude. I prefer sport bikes for vehicular toys but an EVO is right up there of 4 wheeled vehicles I lust after.

Thanks

rellascout http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysa50-plo48

Lean forward more, stand straight on square to the target, adjust your hands slightly

Thanks for the video, as of now, I'm in the process of applying for a rifle/shotgun permit, and also a premesis/target pistol permit....but once I get licensed and get my guns, I'll definately see if I can get some practice.... the instructor in the video sure gave some good pointers

Dash
October 27, 2007, 09:48 PM
wrong support hand placement, you have to rotate your wrist so that the thumb points to the target not locking them together, seems like your afraid of the pistol, lean forward a bit and relax the shoulder.

front sight ... trigger slack off ... easy trigger press with the pad of the first joint ... let er rip ... recoil management comes after.

your accuracy should be the same with the .45, try loading some dummies with the live ones, i think you're flinching

curmudgeon1
October 27, 2007, 10:35 PM
If your practice is for self-defense, you might also want to try some one-hand shooting. Might need that free hand for something else. FRONT SIGHT, PRESS! FRONT SIGHT,PRESS! :D

MyGunsJammed
October 27, 2007, 10:40 PM
Dash wrong support hand placement, you have to rotate your wrist so that the thumb points to the target not locking them together, seems like your afraid of the pistol, lean forward a bit and relax the shoulder.

front sight ... trigger slack off ... easy trigger press with the pad of the first joint ... let er rip ... recoil management comes after.

your accuracy should be the same with the .45, try loading some dummies with the live ones, i think you're flinching

I think your observations are dead on.....thats what my buddy told me also....

And yes, it was my first time firing a semi-auto pistol so I was flinching... and secondly I felt like the 1911A1 pistol was kicking me a bit harder than the 9mm, thats why I was missing all my targets lol


curmudgeon1 If your practice is for self-defense, you might also want to try some one-hand shooting. Might need that free hand for something else. FRONT SIGHT, PRESS! FRONT SIGHT,PRESS!

Dont I need to line up the front and the rear sights before I pull the trigger?

Ralph Allen
October 27, 2007, 11:06 PM
Just some friendly advice. Invest in a pair of shooting glasses. Eyesight is precious and non replaceable in a mishap.
Ralph

MyGunsJammed
October 27, 2007, 11:09 PM
Ralph Allen Just some friendly advice. Invest in a pair of shooting glasses. Eyesight is precious and non replaceable in a mishap.
Ralph

Thanks, advice taken, I'll look into that....

after spending $$ on lasik, and now that I have 20-15 vision I wouldnt want to mess that up.....

another complaint about that range is that it was real bright that day, and it was hard to focus on my target, too much glare I guess and my eyes are sensitive to bright lights..... shooting in the sand pit.... wish I had brought my sunglasses.....

CGSteve8718
October 27, 2007, 11:16 PM
I never asked for this advice but read it on here in another thread about shooting technique, tried it and it helped me out.

No one can tell if you are doing it or not in the pics (most likely not with that hold), but after you heed the advice from others about fixing your grip, try this push/pull method. You want to kind of push forward with your strong hand (one holding the weapon) and pull back with your support hand, with more emphasis on the support. This should help with your grip and stability of the weapon.

curmudgeon1
October 28, 2007, 12:04 AM
Sure, but do it by concentrating on the front sight.:)

JohnKSa
October 28, 2007, 12:34 AM
another complaint about that range is that it was real bright that day, and it was hard to focus on my target, too much glare I guess and my eyes are sensitive to bright lights..... shooting in the sand pit.... wish I had brought my sunglasses.....I've got several pair of shooting glasses. Some clear, some yellow and some with gray/dark lenses. ;)

Can't tell, but it looks like your tilting your head a bit. Generally you'll do better with a normal (non-tilted) head position.

Try putting your support hand thumb on the bottom (against the gun) instead of on the top. I find I get a more stable grip with the strong hand thumb on top.

Don't get to wrapped up in the idea that there's only one right way to do things. People are different enough that people's stances and grips will be different.

General ideas.

Find something comfortable. If you're tortured into an abnormal or uncomfortable position it will show in your results.

Get as much contact with the gun as possible, especially with your support hand.

Jacobie
October 28, 2007, 01:00 AM
Nice EVO, my STi would pull though:D

RoscoeC
October 28, 2007, 09:42 AM
I think the best advice I was ever given was to think about what you are doing when you fire a pistol. You are FIGHTING (or practicing to do so). Before you ever touch a pistol, assume a fighting stance. Strong side foot slightly back, feet shoulder width or a little wider, 60% of your body weight forward. If you will assume a boxing stance, you are there. Now properly grip your pistol, extend it forward and you are ready. When you are shooting a semi-auto pistol, it is very important to get your upper body weight behind the weapon in order to insure its proper function. The pistol is the most difficult weapon to master, so technique becomes doubly important.

Dash
October 28, 2007, 10:15 AM
you can try different stances and holds. see what fits you best. weaver or iscoseles. the best hold would be the one that keeps the gun steady while you're pulling the trigger and one that absorbs recoil and not fight it. you'll see that the gun will return to the original position after recoil for faster follow up shots.

Wildalaska
October 28, 2007, 12:11 PM
Nice ride.

Now as to your shooting position, I have spent years developing same and what Im going to tell you works for me.....its all about balance....

You are evidently a young man so you have the balance handicap, ie, your gut does not protrude enough to balance your body. A steady diet of double whoppers with cheeese 3x a day for two months should cure that. If you are in a hurry, add a medium pizza 2x a day for between meal snack, and a pound of oreos with a quart of eggnog before bed.

Make sure you wear pants two sizes two small after your gut reaches the optimum tactical level. That forces your gut up and out and gives you more forward balance.

These two tips will cure that leaning back flaw ;)


WildmybellyistacticallyoptimizedAlaska TM

defjon
October 28, 2007, 12:43 PM
Hmm, yes. Good observation Wild.

I'm also a young man, but these last two years of college have effectively eliminated my free time and disrupted my old jogging schedule. Thusly, I was able to invest in my new tactical belly balancing, and I have to say, wow. It feels good. I've tried attaching a surefire and a laser on either love handle, but the duct tape is painful.

Oh, and if the pizza and whoopers aren't your bag, might I recommend tacos and beer? Beer! The fast track to tactical foreward balance! Or whiskey! Drink the equivalent of double whoopers with cheese in about five minutes!

...did I have a serious contribution to this thread? Eh. Okay, lemmie try. Trigger time. Find what works for you, what gets results. Asking for advice is a good idea, so you don't develope bad habbits like flinching, etc. But you should be out shooting.

When the holes get closer to where you want them, and more of them appear closer together, then you should just keep doing what you're doing. There is no substitute for getting out there and blasting the crap out of paper, or....get into the spirit of the month! Try a reactive target in the form of pumpkins.

Good solid fun, that.

defjon
October 28, 2007, 12:49 PM
Oh, and after you acquire all those guns you want (probably never happen, as there always seems to be something else you CAN'T LIVE WITHOUT, but once you got a few) you'll need to get some kind of disparaging quote in your signature about the government. Might I suggest finding a suitably fascist quip from a presidential front runner, or something Nazi-related to gun control? Maybe a quote from one of the early founding fathers?

Oh yeah, cool spoiler. Nice Sig in that photo, too. Great guns, way too fat in the grip for my liking! You should try shooting a forty caliber and then go back to that .45 1911. Watch your bullseyes :)

Wildalaska
October 28, 2007, 12:50 PM
I'm also a young man, but these last two years of college have effectively eliminated my free time and disrupted my old jogging schedule. Thusly, I was able to invest in my new tactical belly balancing, and I have to say, wow. It feels good. I've tried attaching a surefire and a laser on either love handle, but the duct tape is painful.


Wait till ya get to Alaska, you will have all winter to lay on the couch and work that belly!

WilddominosoneverycornerAlaska TM

MyGunsJammed
October 28, 2007, 05:22 PM
curmudgeon1 Sure, but do it by concentrating on the front sight.

I'll try that, but in theory, wouldnt concentrating on the front sight make me shoot higher than I want to?


Jacobie Nice EVO, my STi would pull though

heheh lol, btw my EVO makes ~500 AWHP from 6500 RPM's to 8000 RPM's, should be a fun race though....:D


Wildalaska Nice ride.

Now as to your shooting position, I have spent years developing same and what Im going to tell you works for me.....its all about balance....

You are evidently a young man so you have the balance handicap, ie, your gut does not protrude enough to balance your body. A steady diet of double whoppers with cheeese 3x a day for two months should cure that. If you are in a hurry, add a medium pizza 2x a day for between meal snack, and a pound of oreos with a quart of eggnog before bed.

Make sure you wear pants two sizes two small after your gut reaches the optimum tactical level. That forces your gut up and out and gives you more forward balance.

These two tips will cure that leaning back flaw

Lol. Thanks, I dont know about growing the beer belly gut though, I'm 30 years old now, Asian, skinny as you can see, and even my male relatives who are in their 40's dont even really have a beer belly big enough to write home about lol....but yeah that food you suggested sounds good and fattening.

defjon Oh, and after you acquire all those guns you want (probably never happen, as there always seems to be something else you CAN'T LIVE WITHOUT, but once you got a few) you'll need to get some kind of disparaging quote in your signature about the government. Might I suggest finding a suitably fascist quip from a presidential front runner, or something Nazi-related to gun control? Maybe a quote from one of the early founding fathers?

Oh yeah, cool spoiler. Nice Sig in that photo, too. Great guns, way too fat in the grip for my liking! You should try shooting a forty caliber and then go back to that .45 1911. Watch your bullseyes

LOL, I'm sure the time will come, when I get my arsenal, I'll be sure to come out with some cool quotes in my sig.... I'm just in the process of applying for my pistol and rifle permit now..... you guys that live in gun friendly states have it sweet....

Jacobie
October 28, 2007, 08:56 PM
heheh lol, btw my EVO makes ~500 AWHP from 6500 RPM's to 8000 RPM's, should be a fun race though....

Sorry, you know I had to say it, you can't own one of them without the other car owner saying it. It's all in good fun, what do you have done to it?

MyGunsJammed
October 28, 2007, 09:06 PM
Jacobie heheh lol, btw my EVO makes ~500 AWHP from 6500 RPM's to 8000 RPM's, should be a fun race though....

Sorry, you know I had to say it, you can't own one of them without the other car owner saying it. It's all in good fun, what do you have done to it?

Yeah, I know its all in good fun.... as for mods:

AEM EMS, speed density conversion
AMS 50 Trim Turbo Kit, all supporting mods, HKS 280 cams, HKS DLI ignition, Buschur Race FMIC etc....
93 octane gas + Meth injection
brakes and suspension upgraded
etc etc etc....

I dumped a ton of $$ on this car, and if I werent such a bad driver the car should run the 1/4 mile in 11.0-11.3 secs @ 125-126 MPH


Anyhow, back to the gun thing, I guess whatever gun I ever get in the future will me customized and modded to my liking as well....

defjon
October 29, 2007, 12:53 PM
Customized and modded, hm?

Yeah we've got a future 1911 hound here. You just stay away from those unfooled around with series 70s!!

And I feel you about "gun friendly states". I live in IL, which is anything but!

Raytracer
October 29, 2007, 02:35 PM
Here's an exercize that will demontstrate what's wrong with that stance.

With an unloaded gun, magazine removed, and checked again to verify that it is unloaded: assume that same shooting stance and have your buddy stand just next to you and hand cycle the slide. See how easy it is for him to almost push you off your feet?

Now, with your feet spread to about shoulder width; lean forward a bit so that your upper body weight is in front of your hips. Have your buddy hand cycle the slide again. See how the force is transferred to your feet? It's much easier to keep the muzzle down now.

Same thing works when you're shooting. The .45's recoil is just more pronounced than the 9mm, so an unstable shooting platform is even more apparent.

What it's all about is providing a stable platform for the gun - being able to bring the sights back down quickly for a followup shot. It will also make a huge difference when you start shooting on the move.

Joe

FrontSight
October 29, 2007, 02:42 PM
Hey hey hey, I know that range...! Cool place...only $12 for the whole day or so...

Anyways, like everyone else said, you are leaning back too much - you need to lean forward more, and I think you might be holding it too low, too, but not sure b/c I can't see where your target is in relation...

Waitone
October 29, 2007, 07:55 PM
Looks like the pistol is not aligned with your eye.

Waaaay too much finger on the trigger. Back off to the first pad.

Lean forward and into the target.

curmudgeon1
October 29, 2007, 08:51 PM
MGJ;
What's your "theory" ? Are you shooting low now ?
:)

MyGunsJammed
October 29, 2007, 08:51 PM
Scrap5000 Hey hey hey, I know that range...! Cool place...only $12 for the whole day or so...

Anyways, like everyone else said, you are leaning back too much - you need to lean forward more, and I think you might be holding it too low, too, but not sure b/c I can't see where your target is in relation...

Yeah, I think that range is the best outdoor range in the area...

Before they banned "assault weapons" in NYC I went there a lot with my buddy and fired hundreds of rounds of SS109 ammo thru a new preban
Colt AR15 A2

those were the good old days.....