What handgun is the best for silencers?

[Greg Bell]

Guys,

What gun would you say is the best platform for mounting a suppressor? The SOCOM comes to mind but I don't want to put out 1500-2000 for the base gun if at all possible. I realize the Ruger 22's are favored but I am looking for something in a stronger caliber. I thought the P7 would be nice but I hear that the gas system nixes this possibility (although I am not sure how reliable my sources were on this). The P7 seemed perfect because of its fixed barrel, etc. I remember the HK P9 was used by the seals but buying a solid P9 and getting an extended barrel is also getting up in the Socom price range. I am open to any make (other thaan Lorcin, Haskel, etc). Also, who makes good "cans?"

[blades67]

If you're looking for a semi-auto pistol platform I think the 9mm is ideal. With the simple addition of a threaded barrel and a can from AWC or Gemtech, using 147 grain sub-sonics, any of the high-end 9mm's (e.g. Sig, Glock, Barretta) would be righteous. You could also use a Dan Wesson revolver with a can because of the ability to adjust the barrel/cylinder gap.
Of course the HK MP5 is one of the most successful platforms available. :)

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May your lead always hit center mass and your brass always land in your range bag.

~Blades~

[Ed Brunner]

The best suppresed sound would be from a single shot pistol or a semi auto that has been modified to lock the bolt or the slide closed after firing. This prevents the escape of gas except through the suppressor.

Some government agency has modified a Ruger 22 auto with such a locked bolt so it would not be beyond the ability of a good gunsmith or machinist.

If you are going to experiment with suppressors be sure to check your state laws as well as your friendly ATF.

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Better days to be,

Ed

[Kodiac]

Colt Woodsman, Hi Standard.

A Ruger Mk II would make a good one too...

Ramline made a .22 that would make a good one too...

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"But I don't want to go among mad people," Alice remarked.
"Oh, you can't help that," said the Cat: "we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad."
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice.
"You must be," said the Cat, "or you wouldn't have come here."

RAGE AGAINST THE MACHINE

[4V50 Gary]

Thompson Center Contender. No mechanism to make noise.

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Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt

[Ewok]

In .300 Whisper, maybe.

[James K]

You don't need any special modification to keep the bolt shut on a Ruger .22 auto; you can hold it shut with your hand.

Jim

[Long Path]

Another vote for Ruger MK I and MK II. You can even bring the sound down further with shorts, since you're manually operating the carrier. I've seen one of these shot in an urban back yard in Dallas at night with an 8" can, and it was really cool. The barrel was cut to 2", and the rest was can. needed a front sight on the can, though.

My exclamation of "Wow." was far louder than the shot!


Of course, these things do cost some, what with silly licensing fees. I keep wondering when we shooters are going to file a class-action suit against the BATF and the U.S. Government for hearing loss. Explain to me again how it's beneficial to us all to make these things really, really loud?
What?


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Will you, too, be one who stands in the gap?

[This message has been edited by Long Path (edited August 12, 1999).]

[Greg Bell]

Guys,
I was talking about 9mm or greater calibers. I have seen Berrettas and Glocks with cans. Can these guns cycle?

[Ewok]

So, Greg, are you writing a novel, or what?

[Jeff OTMG]

I would have suggested the Walther PPK because the barrel is mounted to the frame and that supports the suppressor and the barrel does not tilt, but you are looking for somehting more potent. The H&K P9S in .45 ACP. It uses a rotating bolt so the barrel does not move when the gun is fired, on a tilting barrel type of pistol the suppressor must move up when the action unlocks. 230gr HydroShocks are subsonic whereas if it was a 9mm you would have to use 147gr HP. In fairness to Gemtech, AWC, and some others, the new generation wet suppressors are effective and light enough to usually function. Many have an expansion chamber added to the base of the unit that still allow tilting barrel pistols like Glock, 1911, BHP, SIG, and Beretta to cycle reliably.

[Greg Bell]

I don't think the P9/45 was availible with an extended barrel. Was it?

Ewok, what makes you think I am writing a novel? hmm?

I would love to put together a 45 P9 with a silencer. I know where a pretty sweet combat model is here locally.

Have any of you ever confirmed the story that a P7 can't be silenced without destroying it? The story seems plausable--but I know where to get an extended p7 barrel and would LOVE to set up a silenced P7.

[[email protected]]

Why not just get a HK USP Tactical? It's already set up correctly for a suppressor, all you have to do is buy the can (and pay the fees, and do the paperwork...).

No modifications needed, just screw on and go.

Spark

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Kevin Jon Schlossberg
SysOp and Administrator for BladeForums.com
www.bladeforums.com (http://www.bladeforums.com)

[Ewok]

Just wondering why you were looking for the best handgun for supressing, rather than the best suppressor for your handgun.

[Greg Bell]

Guys,

Is the tactical really set up for a suppresor? I know it has a threaded barrel but is it set up to cycle rounds? I know, for example, a lot of titling barrel designs won't function with a can. I know the Socom does but did it not have a lot of funky modifications?

[[email protected]]

USP Tactical is ready to go out of the box, just like the SOCOM, that's why they call it the Tactical, and why it has the raised sights. No use giving it raised sights and a threaded barrel if it has to be hugely modified before it will work.

Spark

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Kevin Jon Schlossberg
SysOp and Administrator for BladeForums.com
www.bladeforums.com (http://www.bladeforums.com)

[SKN]

Re: suppressed USP45T, I have it, use it and it works just fine.

[Jeff OTMG]

Greg, the P9S was not offered with a long barrel, but there are long barrels out there. You don't necessarily need a long barrel though. If you go with a 9mm version they counterbore and use internal threads in the stock barrel, that might work for the .45. It is the way to cleanest way to attach a suppressor to a Walther TPH. Check with a machinest to see if it is possible.

[.]

Greg,

For some of us, there is a distinction between the term suppressor and silencer.

The suppressor being defined as a "can" that is screwed onto the end of a barrel to attenuate the muzzle blast by cooling the hot gases and slowing the sonic movement of the air mass to subsonic levels. This does not affect the velocity of the projectile, hence the need for "subsonic ammo". An example is an MP-5 with a can on the muzzle. Cans are relatively inexpensive and some are actually engineered and manufactured to be disposable and/or rebuildable/renewable.

The silencer does essentially the same thing but usually starts by bleeding off the propulsive gases immediately after the chamber such that the projectile is also slowed to subsonic velocities to eliminate the "crack" as it passes through air. An example of this is the MP-5SD with the integral ported barrel and silencer. For obvious reasons this tends to be a more expensive route to "quite bliss".

Unless you plan to use it against medium sized game/pests or larger, then the .22lr or .22WMR should suffice for most applications.

[Sid Post]

With regards to silenced 22 pistols, something to consider is what the real goal is. Some pistols are quiet because the bullets are leaving the "can" at pellet pistol velocities. This works great for punching paper but, not so well for pest control.

There are a lot of good "cans" out there and there are several pretenders. The price difference between a premium can and an average quality no-name can is pretty small when you figure the tax, transfer fees, and purchase price overall. Buy from someone who is a known source and stands behind their work and has been around a long time. Names that come to mind are Gem-Tech (very highly recommended), AWC (customer service is pretty poor), SWR (Joe Gadini sp?) is run by a former Knight employee are among the names I watch. A good resource is Tom Bower's recommended dealer list at www.subguns.com. (http://www.subguns.com.) Those guys have all been proven in past dealings and are a great place to start when looking for a local dealer and/or manufacturer. For you guys looking at 22lr pistols, check out the Browning BuckMarks that look like the silohuette models. You have to look close to tell that it is a silenced/supressed pistol so, it goes pretty low profile until you start shooting.

For centerfire pistols, it is hard to beat a 45ACP. You get a large heavy subsonic round. You can do this with a 9mm but, terminal ballistics on a 147 Subsonic round really aren't very good unless you are using an HK MP5, one at a time in a pistol just doesn't seem worth it. Solid 9mm loads will be supersonic and have the ballistic crack but, you get better terminal ballistics. If you are just looking for a neat toy or a paper punching monster, then the requirements and equipment are much different.

If a Thompson Contender pistol is a remote possibility, I would suggest something along the lines of Gem-Tech TPR 30cal can and a 300Whisper pistol. With the quick detach feature, you can have one can that serves on the pistol and rifle both! Sort of a two for one sale! The 223 can works well on an AR-15 and could be employed with 22lr in the AR-15 and on a pistol such as a Contender.

If you want a traditional centerfire pistol such as a Glock or Beretta or 1911 or HK ... a heavy can without recoil boost most likely will be a single shot (like the contender mentioned above). A fixed barrel solution negates this concern. The other option is a compact wet can that weighs very little but, they are messy when you shoot and don't stay quite unless you do maintanence periodically.

check out: http://members.aol.com/SWRCOM/products.htm http://www.gem-tech.com/pistol.html

As to the P-7 question, because of the barrels being so hard to remove and install and to procure extended models, these pistols are generally ruled out. There is no obvious reason why you could not suppress one other then high cost. I am not a HK guru though, so time my words with regards to the P-7 with a grain of salt.

If it is financially within your means and you really want a top notch 45ACP solution, don't discount the HK MK23. These can be had gently used or NIB if you look around hard enough from a low of about $1200 (gently used) to NIB for $1500. With another $500 for the can (probably not a knight but, a good quality can like a SWR/Gem-Tech) and $200 for the stamp, you have a solid unit. The HK Tacticals work well to from a purely functional standpoint and will cut pistol cost some.

Hope this helps,
Sid

[zot]

BB gun is THE greatest silenced gun I ever
shot, Daisy makes the best I think, but I
guess theirs allways Crossman fans,

[SHORTFUSE]

"The Cheese Ripper"

[Greg Bell]

Sid post and RKN.

Do the USP tacticals cycle or are they just one shot? If so, is it reliable?

[fnwalther]

According to my personal experience:

H&K USP .45
Good:
- .45 ACP is subsonic so you dont need special loads.
Bad:
- You NEED special silencer IF you want that your gun will cycle. With normal silencer it doesnt and that same problem is with all Browning-link guns like Glocks etc.

MP5;
Good:
- Suppressor is easy to install without modifications to gun.
Bad:
- MP5 works marginally with subsonic loads AND you need those in case of 9mm Para..
- MP5 is not a pistol and very difficult to get
- Difficult to modify "non moving slide".

Ruger .22
Good:
- .22 is mostly subsonic
- You can hold slide closed easily by your thumbs.
- Easy to make for fixed silencer

Bad:
- Well if you dont like .22......


Walther PPK .22
Good:
- .22 is mostly subsonic
- You can make it manually repeater easity by using .380 spring.
- There is enough room in original barrel for connecting silencer.
Bad:
- Well if you dont like .22......


Walther PPK .32 or .380
Good:
- .32 and .380 are subsonic
Bad:
- You need to change longer fe. PP-barrel


Nat

[45King]

I have right at my fingertips the AWC catalog, and it lists the Nexus suppressor for 1911 pattern guns as being adjustable so that the slide will cycle or not, your choice. It requires their barrel be fitted to your gun.
I've shot the same suppressor on the SOCOM in .45, very efficient-as long as you use 230 gr. Hydra-Shok ammo. The owner bent the lower lip of the can out slightly by shooting it with a different load.

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Shoot straight regards, Richard
The Shottist's Center forums.delphi.com/m/main.asp?sigdir=45acp45lc (http://forums.delphi.com/m/main.asp?sigdir=45acp45lc)

[nauss]

If you go .22LR, the Ruger Mark II or III is easy to thread and you can, literally, put your thumb on the butt of the slide and hold it in place with ease. Doesn't make THAT much difference in my experience.

I like the Beretta 21A the best. It is a tad more $ to have threads soldered on but WELL worth the work. Much nicer to conceal and fun to shoot.
The Ruger is much more reliable.

You can suppress a .45 just as easily as a .22LR. Large, slow slug doesn't break the sound barrier so it works well. More effective but higher priced all around.

H&K is my favorite but expensive.

AAC is a good brand of silencer to start with.

[KyJim]

Replying to a 1999 thread? This has got to be a record. :)

BTW, for those who read this and similar threads, keep in mind it is illegal to own a silencer without paying a federal tax/registration fee. It is illegal to manufacture one without registering with feds and illegal to build one without a serial number. State laws vary. It may or may not be legal in your state.

[CraigC]

The search function works! :rolleyes:

[Texas Armadillo]

1999! Big database! Oh well, since it's back... I always wanted a 92fs with locking slide and a quick detach Knights Armament Can.

http://www.olegvolk.net/gallery/d/6037-7/beretta9702.jpg