Why is Sig's first shot DA, and what is the advantage?

[dentodoc]

I'm more of a 1911 Single-Action shooter, but I see that a great number of guys like the Sig-Sauer first shot Double-Action mode. I can's understand the advantage of this. Why is it desirable? Please explain.

[Shorts]

My Beretta is the same way. If you want SA first shot, just pull the hammer back and lock it and you're good to go. As far as being desireable, ehh, nothing really catches my fancy about its workings, that's just the way it is. As for carrying either way, it makes no difference in the ability of the gun to fire ND or AD. The safety disconnects the trigger anyway.

As for as practicing at the range, I shoot both ways in order to stay proficient with each feel.

[flycaster]

The so-called "traditional double action"- DA/SA- has been called a solution in search of a problem. I had, and liked, a Beretta 92FS. I decided, however, that for a SHTF situation, I would want the first and all subsequent shots to have exactly the same trigger action. Thus I now have a Glock, a 1911, and two DA revolvers.

Chuck

[chris in va]

I think DA/SA is a good idea in a situation unless you have massive muscle memory for taking a safety off on a 1911, etc.

The DA pull is there to make *sure* you want to take the shot, then everything after that is made very easy to follow up. DA is also much stiffer to act as a safety.

I like the half-cock feature on my CZ. Less trigger pull, still considered first shot DA.

[Maxprime]

With something like the 92FS, if the safety is on (auto decocks) then you can be much more sure that an accidental discharge can't take place. I know that they shouldn't happen anyways, it's just one more precaution.

[fanoblack]

Considering the fact that sigs don't have what people think of as traditional safeties, that is the safety feature. My P99 AS has the same setup and I quite enjoy that. Just one of those things, practice with the piece you carry.

fanoblack

[KurtC]

It became popular back in the 1980's, during the revolver-to-auto changeover. It became apparent that more time and money would have to be spent in order to teach folks to qualify double action, or carry single action.

The result is the TDA. Folks safely carry double action for the first shot, yet get to shoot most of their qualification in the single action mode, yielding high scores.

The perfect answer to not having proper training. As stated above, every shot should be the same. DA, SA or striker.

[Robert Allison]

An advantage to the DA/SA arrangement, also, is to allow "safe" carry with a round in the chamber without having to keep the gun cocked and locked. No worry about accidentally bumping off the safety as there might be with a 1911, the gun doesn't look as spooky to the average citizen who might be alarmed when seeing a cocked hammer on a holstered semi-auto, and getting it into action is as simple as with a DA revolver. So it's actually not a bad system. The big disadvantage is the transition between the first and second shot, the long, heavier DA pull followed by the short SA shots can require a literal change in grip between first and second shots for some shooters.

[Shorts]

One thing I did want to add in is that only the first should out of the whole range session is DA (at least for me it is most the time). Slide stays back on the mag's last last shot, so of course, just drop in a new mag, release the slide and you're still in SA. I'm sure you guys know that so I'm probably preaching to the choir :o

I do practice on making that first shot in DA count. You have to, switching actions, I notice I have fliers if I'm not concentrating. But nice confimations and pleasant surprises that I'm doing something right is when I place the shot where I was aiming, regardless of action and I wasn't trying too hard to concentrate. I guess that means my muscles are learnin' :D

I think it was already mentioned above, it comes down to muscle memory. And I do notice my brain and hands involuntarily switching movement and allowing for trigger pull. Some range sessions I only shoot DA as well as practice snap cap pulls. Some range sessions I just follow the gun's function.

[Crimson Trace]

Many people who are much smarter than I advocate for the DA/SA as a response to the phenomenon known a "trigger check" or another phrase to that effect.

What it boils down to is that while reviewing video of high-speed operators, SWAT, etc...during simunition training it was shown that even the best trained shooters were putting their fingers on the trigger when they shouldn't. i.e. before they were ready to shoot.

The DA/SA reduces the chance for an ND under these scenarios.

-Z

[44-40]

I dont like to carry my 1911 cocked and locked,just a thing with me,so if I need it in a hurry I either have to run the slide or if it has a round chambered I have to cock the hammer.On my sig I carry a round in the chamber, hammer down, all I need to do to get it going fast is pull the trigger....

[Blind Tree Frog]

Many people who are much smarter than I advocate for the DA/SA as a response to the phenomenon known a "trigger check" or another phrase to that effect.

What it boils down to is that while reviewing video of high-speed operators, SWAT, etc...during simunition training it was shown that even the best trained shooters were putting their fingers on the trigger when they shouldn't. i.e. before they were ready to shoot.

This is the reason I was always told. You are absolutely sure that you want to shoot when you start shooting because you need to make an effort to do it. It makes sense for 95% of the gun owning people out there.

[IanS]

When I'm target shooting I tend to consciously think about the DA/SA transition and thats when I tend to have flyers. But when I'm doing bowling pin shoots or at a defense class I don't think about the DA/SA and concentrate on the fundamentals. That is when I don't even notice the transition and muscle memory takes over.

[allen268]

For me I just like not having a thumb saftey on my personall CCW (My own preference) with that heavy first pull it takes effort to fire so accidental discharge wouldnt be "too" accidental. Besides, the only time my fingers on the trigger is when Im prepaired to shoot. When pulled for defence a gun with saftey off (and less trigger pull required) it would seem to me that there would be a greater chance for accidental discharge then with a DA first pull like on the Sigs without a thumb saftey.

[mete]

Of course some of us have properly designed guns ,the HK P7, which eliminate the problems !!

[IanS]

Of course some of us have properly designed guns ,the HK P7, which eliminate the problems !!

Who said the DA/SA or manual safety were problems? These are preferences. Just like some people have an aversion to DA/SA some of us prefer not to have a single action trigger for the first shot for various reasons. Some of us also don't want to squeeze cock the grip before shooting which at times can throw off the sights.

No doubt a cocked and locked single action, P7, or Glock type trigger is desireable for timed competitions. But self defense scenarios, particularly for civilians, don't always involve a bunch of targets you're free to shoot under the clock. The DA/SA trigger theoretically is a bit more forgiving for people who might become trigger happy under times of stress.