need a compact 9mm... any suggestions?

[johndavid400]

Hello, again I am asking for your opinions. I am looking for a compact 9mm for concealed carry to replace the Beretta 3032 that I now carry (only reason for switching... .32auto is kind of small for carry). I want something completely reliable and somewhat accurate that will last, yet is small enough to carry without being noticed. I also do not like a long DA trigger pull and until recently, I wasnt even considering a DA only gun. I know these pre-requesites are stiff, but there has gotta be something out there. Oh yah, it also needs to be under $400 ;). So this is a tough one.

So here is what I am looking at and I just wanted to make sure that I am not overlooking any good prospects:

Within my immediate price range: $250-$400
In order of desirability:

Baby eagle compact - $350-400 (love it, a little bit big, comparatively speaking, but probably well worth it)
Witness compact - $300 (same as baby eagle)
Taurus pt-111 - $300 (don't love DA only, but is acceptable on this gun, otherwise great)
Beretta 9000s - $350 (kind of thick but I could get used to it)
Ruger P93 - $350-400 (ugly and big)

Not really within my price range, but attainable if necessary: $400-$500
(obviously, these are better quality choices, so don't be so quick to suggest these... keep $$ in mind):

S&W SW99 compact - $450-500 (love it, but pricey)
Glock 26 - $450-500 (ugly and expensive but reliable)
Springfield XD-9 - $400-$450 (same as glock)

Oh yah, ABSOLUTELY no kel-tec's. Thanks for your input, JD

[denfoote]

I found you a nice CZ100 at http://www.gunsamerica.com/1248/1248-random-1.htm for $365.

You might also look at the CZ-75 compact. I'm not sure what they go for nowadays, but I'm sure you could find one in your price range!!

Hey!! What's wrong with carying your Baby Eagle????

[johndavid400]

Believe me, I've thought about it. But the dang thing weighs a ton... it is the full size steel version and with a full magazine would pull my pants down. Plus it is so big that it can hardly go un-noticed. If the grip AND the muzzle were about an inch shorter, we would probably have a winner... but it is by far the best all-around gun that I own (or have shot for that matter), that is why I am kind of bent on the compact Baby Eagle or Witness idea.

But thanks for the CZ link, I hadn't ever seen that one before, but it looks good! I am going to go to my local gun store to see if they have one I can hold.

[Cheimison]

P99/SW99 is the nicest handgun I've ever shot, although only slightly better than a USP9.

[nssa4914]

Spend a smidgen more and get the Kahr PM9. Probably the best little 9 on the market especially for the $439 price I found :)

[Ala Dan]

Or you can have a factory refurb SIG P228 with standard capacity
magazines for $499. That certainly would be MY choice.

Best Wishes,

[nssa4914]

If weight isn't an issue there are a few dealers selling the all Steel
Kahr MK9 on Gunsamerica for $399.00 new.

[45 Fu]

You can find good Glock 19 & 26s if you take the time to look that will be in your price range. If I were going to carry a compact 9mm these would be my first two choices.

[IRock]

Buy used and get more for your money. Kahr?

[czmatt]

CZ 100 or the P-01 would be right around that price range with some searching. Both really good guns.

[Smith66]

perhaps a compact S&W like the 908, or 3913? I have seen both for less than $400, plus they are pretty easy to conceal. I personally think they look better than a G26, but don't hold as many rounds.

[SouthpawShootr]

I have an SW99 compact, Glock 26, Beretta 9000s and an XD-9. I like the Glock the best. Next up would be my 9000S, followed by the SW99. My 9000 is reliable and accurate. I have no information on durability, but I'm sure all of these guns would be good for about the same amount of shooting. The SW99, I don't really care for the trigger. Otherwise it's just fine. My absolute favorite is my Glock 19, a bit bigger than the guns you list, but I have no problems concealing it.

There is also the CZ P-01. It has an aluminum frame, so it will be considerably lighter than the full size CZ-75. You list the Witness compact and Baby Eagle, but said the CZ was too heavy. :confused: They should be about the same weight, since all three are essentially the same design (I believe the Baby Eagle should even be a bit heavier since it's got a full-length dust cover).

[johndavid400]

Southpaw: Sorry, I was unclear... I was referring to my Baby Eagle being too heavy to conceal as it is the full frame steel version. I actually hadn't thought of the CZ P-01. I did know that the witness, cz, and baby eagle were pretty much the same gun... but I have no knowledge of their weight comparison. Is the Beretta 9000s too thick for comfortable concealed carry? I am a thin guy (5'11" 150lbs) so trying to conceal a big gun is kind of hard for me. thanks ~ JD

[saands]

I have no idea what a used Sig-P225 would go for these days, but I love the way they feel and shoot. Single stack mag costs you in capacity, but pays off in slim-ness.

Saands

[Chip Dixon]

I think your money would be better spent on a quality gunbelt and holster for your Baby Eagle.

I am 5'7", 140 lbs. (when I haven't been working too hard, sometimes 10 lbs less) With a Brommeland Max-Con V I can easily conceal my full-size 1911A1 year round, with nothing more than shorts and a patterened, button down shirt.
With it, I have no use for any smaller guns unless I can't wear my belt. (as the 1911 is a heavy piece, and would drop my pants in short order unsupported)

Then I opt for a S&W 642 w/ a pocket holster.

I swear, I've never been "had" except for when someone comes up and gives me a big hug from behind. No rig is going to help you with that problem, though.

[Quartus]

it is the full size steel version and with a full clip would pull my pants down.

:confused: What's a clip got to do with it?


This is a clip:

http://www.korteng.com/KWjpg/M1SideAP.jpg


This is also a clip:

http://www.rusmilitary.com/images/5.45_loading.gif

A stripper clip, to be precise.




This is a magazine:

http://www.rusmilitary.com/images/9x18_makarov.gif



The Baby Eagle (like almost all self-loading pistols) uses a magazine.

An interesting exception is the old broomhandle Mauser:

https://iar-arms.com/images3/c96-10.jpg

It really DID use clips.

[denfoote]

Sorry, I was unclear... I was referring to my Baby Eagle being too heavy to conceal as it is the full frame steel version.

Perhaps what you need is a better holster and belt combination!! These are just as important as the gun, less expensive as well!! ;)

I've been known to hoof a full size 1911 around, having no difficulty concealing it!!

[johndavid400]

.... dang we live in a political world! I would just assume not speak than have my every word analyzed and slaughtered :rolleyes: . I know you don't mean any harm though quartus. Please excuse my insolence ;) .

[Doug Add]

I would go for the SIG 225 or 228. I carry a 228 everyday, and am quite satisfied with that choice. You can get a factory reconditioned and warrantied 225 or 228 for not much over your price limit here:

http://www.onpointfirearms.com/handguns/sig.htm

[Quartus]

One cannot think any more accurately than one can speak. I know of no benefit to sloppy thinking or speech.

Well, unless one is a liberal, of course. Apparently they consider both to be highly desired.

[SouthpawShootr]

I don't have any trouble concealing my 9000S. I haven't measured the two, but it hardly seems any wider than my G26. If the 26 hadn't come along first, I'd probably be carrying the 9000. It should be even more attractive once the 12 round standard cap (formerly LE) magazines become more widely available. Whether you can effectively conceal either one depends on how you dress. I'm 2 inches taller than you and have about 100lbs (which I'm trying to be rid of) on you. I think it's a myth that big guys have an easier time hiding big guns. I don't wear clothes that fit me tightly and when I get new clothes, the waist is always a little bigger than perfect fit (so my guns will).

[Handy]

One cannot think any more accurately than one can speak. Pure horse hockey. Ask a cognitive psychologist about this one. This "friendly correction" is just an excuse for a gloating put down.



Anyway, I found my Baby Eagle too heavy for toting, as well. It didn't distribute the weight as well as a 1911.


I think the Kahr line is really excellent. While not the smallest, the standard K9 might be the best all-arounder. The trigger is very light. You'll have to buy used to keep in the good price range.

If the size and grip suits you, there are few better deals than the Sig Pro pistols that sell NEW for right around $400. Traditional DA/SA, but smooth.

Another good deal is the S&W 908. Relatively compact, and $410 new. You could easily find one for $300 used.

Finally, look around for the FM (not FN) BHP Detective model. Nice gun for $300 new if a single action is appropriate.

[Bob Freddy]

Spend a smidgen more and get the Kahr PM9. Probably the best little 9 on the market especially for the $439 price I found

I second that!

[45 Fu]

Quartus - thank you for making the comment on one of my pet peeves. Regardelss of whether it was arrogant, self righteous, or whatever, it was right.

Anybody don't like it I got your six :D

[Handy]

My pet peeve is boorish public behavior.

[johndavid400]

I agree with Handy

[Quartus]

Hey, if you find that ignorance improves your life, go for it! It's a free country!

It's certainly an easier way to live.


In the short term, anyway, which is all that concerns most people.

[Handy]

Misuse of one (1) term is not "ignorance".

Publicly and forcefully correcting minor language errors is. It shows a lack of manners and an inability to interact in polite society.

This deserved a polite five word sentence and a :) , at most.

[nssa4914]

Some of you guys need a life :rolleyes:

[johndavid400]

Well quartus, it doesn't bother me that you feel the need to correct people when they say something that you think is wrong. But you aren't really sticking to the subject with any of your posts in this thread. It was about compact 9mm's, not clip vs. magazine.... which just again leads everyone into another little girly argument about who is right and who is wrong :barf: . Lets try to stay on topic, shall we?

[Alaskanmonte]

I like the Springfield XD compact for its size and also for its reliablity. Its a accurate gun for its size and could be used by almost anyone for CC. I have about 1,500 rounds through it and have had no FTF's. I know it might be pushing your budget a little bit but for what it costs, its a great little gun.

[Brian41]

I would check out any of the smaller CZs, the 100, P-01, RAMI, or even one of the regular 75s. Also maybee a compact HD

[Quartus]

There's no argument about who's wrong. The information presented is about as arguable as the meaning of "is". (Despite whatever empty philosphizing Handy may have offered.)

You could have chosen to learn. You choose to stay ignorant. Your choice.

[johndavid400]

alaskanmonte: is the XD-9 compact similar in size to the glock 26 or is it larger? I would just assume buy an XD-9 as a Glock (if I decide to spend that much money)... I've heard equally good things about both.

brian41: this may be a dumb question... but what is a compact HD?

quartus: again buddy, the rest of us are talking about guns...

[Borodin]

Forget the learning vs. ignorance. He who can pee the farthest is he who is king of his castle (or doublewide ).
:cool:

[Richard]

My first choice would be a Kahr K9, 2nd Glock 26, and 3rd Rami. My Taurus PT111 is a great pistol with the worst trigger I have used. To make things worse I have called Taurus and they do not care. I will never buy from Taurus again. Regards, Richard:D

[rdebert]

I have 2 compact Baby Eagles with the 3.5 inch barrels in 9mm. These are the all steel models and are heavy (I prefer heavy). They are great. They do make a compact polymer version which should be a lot lighter...but I haven't ever even seen one so I can't vouch for them personally.

P93 would be harder to conceal for sure..can be done..but harder. I like my KP94 in 9mm but it is my nightstand gun...not one of CCW guns.

No experience with the Witness line or the others mentioned but:

I have a S&W 908S (S=stainless) that also has a 3.5 inch barrel and because of the allow frame is very light. Very easy to conceal. An ecomomy version of the 3913 series. 8 round mags. The 6906 can be found in your price range as well but it is a little thicker in the grip so it can take the 12 round mags.

Of course there is always the Makarov.

[johndavid400]

rdebert: so you carry your compact Baby Eagle's? How much did you get your's for? the cheapest that I can find the compacts for is $450. I only paid $300 for my NIB full size steel Baby Eagle 9mm from gunbroker.com, but I can't seem to find any deals even remotely close to that one (for a baby eagle). I think that my next choice would be the Witness compact 9mm.
And about the Makarov... that is a 9x18mm right? how does it compare to the stopping power of .380 and 9mm? If it is closer to the .380, I would just assume carry my Bersa... I really want a 9mm for carry though.


thanks

[rdebert]

May have gone higher in price than you originally asked about actually.

One compact Baby Eagle (Blue, slide mounted safety/decock) I got in a trade and didn't cash pay for it. It was marked at $425 NIB and probably would have ended up paying that as an out the door price.

The other compact one I just got off of auction arms. This is the Jericho versions (locked and cocked) in CHROME for $399 plus shipping and FFL charge ($429 in total). Good deal because of the chrome finish ($225 factory option I believe).

Auction Arms and Gunbroker usually list the polymer versions for about $380 plus. But I have never actually seen one myself. And I have never actually seen a used baby eagle (in any size). Not that popular around here and apparently those that do buy them keep them. Expect a used one would be around $300 or so if you could find one.

Witness line should be around the $300-325 price range or so. I haven't tried one yet because of reliability concerns based on what I have read. From what I have read (but no direct experience) quality control is hit and miss. I probably will eventually buy one but I do have a lot of other hand guns that I can rely on should I actualy have a problem. Do think that most are probably OK (silent majority vs vocal minority) but that is just a WAG (wild a** guess).

Makarov=9X18. Most commercial loads seem to be light and therefore perform like a hot 380. Again, based on what I have read...no ballistic expert here. But it is a very good platform.

Bersa Thunder 380=have one of those myself and I do carry it from time to time. Reliable, accurate, very easy to CCW. Don't feel undergunned because I can draw and slide lock remaining on target very fast. Again, confidence in the platform and my ability to use it is more important to me than caliber. As long as it is in 380 and above I am happy.

[johndavid400]

I have thought it over quite a bit and looked at a dozen different guns and concluded that I am either to buy a new Witness compact 9mm in the polymer frame for $329 or a used but very good condition Glock 26 sub-compact 9mm with 2 mags for $400 at my local gun store. I really don't know which one to buy, Help me please!!

[Hal]

I'll echo taking a look at the S&W/Walther 99 series.
-------------------------------------------------------

Handy, Quartus -
Hey guys, drop it huh?
'member what it was like on the school playground when a couple of your friends got into it? I'd hate to see either or both of you guys get tangled up with a moderator over something as trivial as symantics.

[PaleRyder]

I have a Coronado leather concealment vest. The Springfield XD's do NOT fit the holster pockets it has. Also, right now, there are not very many holsters available for XDs.
Most of the other concealable semi-autos fit it just fine.
Something to consider when purchasing a weapon for CCW.

[fastbolt]

need a compact 9mm... any suggestions?

The pistol categories of Compact & Subcompact are starting to blur & overlap a bit, with all of the newer pistols on the market.

Still, I've received excellent service from my 3913 ... and the newer 908S is comparable to the original 3913 in size, ergonomics, etc.. The 3913TSW is even better in a couple of respects, but the standard 908S model should give anyone years and years of reliable service ... not to mention it's backed by S&W's Lifetime Warranty.

I've also received fine service from my CS9 so far, but if I had to choose only one of them it would be the 3913, because of its overall better ergonomics and balance ... for me.

Of course, after going on 15 years of frequent training & practice with the TDA (DA/SA) trigger design, I'm very comfortable with it. Some folks aren't.

I've recently picked up a Glock G26 & G27, and the Glock pistols are certainly okay for basic service/defensive pistols. The Glock Safe Action/constant double action trigger isn't as predictable and crisp as any of my S&W TDA pistols, but it's fine for its intended purpose. As far as a "Compact" model would go, the G19 would be more in line with what you're disscussing, I'd think ... and they're also decent pistols. Some folks with borderline "grip stability" issues need to carefully consider the virtues of the polymer-framed pistols, though, as frame flexing and really lightweight frames may not "mix well" with anyone who has the potential to "limp wrist" their pistol.

I'm considering picking up a SW99 Compact 9mm in the next couple of months, simply because I'd like something with the slightly increased capacity of my G26, but with the better (for me) ergonomics and TDA trigger of my other S&W traditional & 99 series pistols. (The Walther P99 would be fine, too, although S&W being willing to extend their Lifetime Warranty to their licensed versions of the 99 series is enough to keep me interested in their offerings).

The smaller HK & SIG pistols are okay ... a bit pricey,perhaps, depending on what you can find them for in many stores ... but a lot of folks like them just fine. Personally, I'd choose a compact SIG over a HK, but that's just me, and either design should provide reasonably reliable & satisfactory service for anyone.

I've handled and fired a few models of the Kahr line ... and I personally don't feel I'd want to own any of them. Lots of folks feel otherwise, and that's fine.

Don't care for the CZ or Witness lines ... or Taurus ... Some folks do, though.;)

Ruger isn't really into compact defensive pistols. Fine, basic, reliable and robust pistols for the most part ... and maybe they'll come around to considering the needs of the armed off-duty/plainclothes cop & legally armed non-cops someday.

I've handled and fired the XD 9's & .40's in standard size ... but not the subcompact. They're okay, but a bit too "new" for me to feel like owning one for serious purposes ... yet.

Lots of decent designs & models to choose among ... Can't imagine anyone not being able to find something that they'd like. :)

[rosenber01]

"Or you can have a factory refurb SIG P228 with standard capacity
magazines for $499. That certainly would be MY choice."

Solid advice on a compact 9

[johndavid400]

Thanks guys, I ended up with a Springfield XD-9 sub compact. I got it in perfect condition, barely used for $350. Thanks for all your help!

[fastbolt]

That seems like a decent price, especially if it suits your anticipated needs and desires.

I hope you let us know how your new (to you) pistol works out for you. Since the subcompact XD isn't something I've yet had a chance to handle and shoot, I'm curious how folks who own them report on their experiences.

[U.F.O.]

Hello all. New to Firing Line and CCW, having just completed a Level 1 course. I bought a Kahr PM9 a week ago and 2 holsters, a soft pocket and a belt. Any other suggestions for the "perfect" way to carry this pistol. Thx.

U.F.O.