Nutria Rats...

[mattd]

Anybody ever hunt Nutria Rats? I'd never even heard of 'em until I moved to the south a couple months ago. I've actually seen one, and Man they are UGLY! Big as a dog, and fairly aggressive from what I hear. I wasn't even sure if this qualifies as hunting, and wondered how one goes about it...just curious.

[ballistic gelatin]

do you mean possum?

[Al Thompson]

Not a possum, it's an aquatic mammel - imported IIRC. I'll drop southla a line and see if he can help.

[mattd]

Yeah, I'm from the PRK (People's Republic of Kalifornia) and I asked the same question. It was imported to eat up some kind of vine or weed or something. They live in the swamps and their fur appears to be like a beaver, insulated against water that is. But make no mistake, this thing is definetly a rat in every appearance. Anyway, I'd put it in the pest/varmit category I guess.

[Northwest Cajun]

From what I know about them(I've been away from home for 10+ years) is they are related to the rat and that are about the size of a beaver. When you are in the swamp at night they sound like a baby crying....spooky. They do trap them in the swamps and rice fields South Louisiana. The cajun chef K-Paul Prudhoume makes saugae out of them.
Thats about it. Mabe Mr Hebert may have some more info on thise critters

Cajun
PS I did a quick search on google and came up with this info page
http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Farm/7720/nutria.html

[mattd]

Wow...that's incredible. Thanks for the link. Might be investing in a .22 this weekend.:D

[Southla1]

The first thing about them to remember is they go just fine on da pit or smothered down in onions! (ain't that just like a coonass...........thinking about cooking them first?).

Y'all are right ............they were imported back in the 30's to Avery Island, La. (about 10 miles from me) by the McIlhenny's of Tabasco Pepper fame, and put in a cage on Avery Island. Some time later a hurricane destroyed the cage and they escaped into the marshes. They thrived there and are overrunning the state.

They destroyed most of the muskrats and the trappers started trapping them for their fur which makes good coats and stuff, however with the anti's the fur marked is off and they are overrunning everything. They are vegetarian and eat the marsh grass which leads to coastal erosion after it is gone. They have also seriously weakened levees in and around the New Orleans area.

No one that I know of actually "hunts" them per se. If some are needed for the pit a ride down a coastal canal with either a 12 gauge loaded with lead #5's, or a .22LR will do the job just fine. That approach also works at night with a Q-beam :D. (oops did I say that?).

The last I heard was a few months ago the state was looking into putting a bounty on them hoping to keep their numbers down. Jefferson Parish (county to you Yankees :D) had a bounty on them a few years back and it was working..............the levee damage had dropped and the coastal grasses were recovering, but some of the do-gooders got word of it and the bounty was dropped ........................ then it was like in the movie "were backkkkkkkkkkkkk."

There is no doubt in my mind that they will never be totally eradicated. The best we can hope for is to control them. Any that I see are destined for the cooking pot.

The State of Louisiana has supposedly either opened a web page or is thinking of opening one to promote them for food value hoping to give incentives for control of them.

K-Paul Prudhomme has begin to push the use of them (even though he can't cook his way out of a wet paperbag :D. His sister Enola is a much better cook!!). If the effect is the same on nutria as was the effect he had on redfish, when he introduced blackened redfish that will be great.

[Art Eatman]

The dadgum things have even spread into central Texas! I've seen them swimming along in Town Lake, in downtown Austintatious. Unfortunately, it's a "No Shooting" zone.

Southla1, you forgot the most important part of all Cajun cooking, including instant coffee...

:), Art

[[email protected]]

I hate those things! I used to walk my dogs next to a pond at night and there was one in particular that would "follow" us all around the perimeter - 10 feet out in the water. It was about a 20 pounder, and it's very disconcerting to watch an animal following you at 0200 while walking the dogs. Not doing anything but paddling and watching... always watching. I got to the point where I'd have my Glock 30 in my hand as we walked along ready to shoot the thing if it got squirelly - screw the sleeping neighbors.

I hate them! Floating rats...

[Double Naught Spy]

Several points of fact to clarify.

First of all nutria are NOT rats and they are NOT closely related to rats as suggested here. They are not even in the same family as rats. New World rats and mice are from the family Cricetidae. Old World rats (like the Black and Norway rats) and mice are from the family Muridae. Nutria are from the family Capromyidae. People call nutria "nutria rats" because they look something like a giant rat with the typical scaly tail. That is simply a problem of associating generic rodent traits with a specific variety. Based on the teeth, skull, and jaw musculature, nutria appear to be more closely related to beavers (Castoridae) than to rats. From outward appearance with the exception of the tail, nutria look more like beavers than rats.

Calling a nutria a "nutria rat" is about as accurate as calling a Panda or Koala a bear as pandas are actually in the racoon family (Procyonidae) and Koalas are marsupials. Don't be fooled by common names that are descriptive, but inaccurate.

Another point. Nutria did not become hunted for their fur after they broke loose and out competed local fur bearing animals. Nutria were imported into LA originally for the express purpose of having growing the animals for their pelts. That is why they were brought into the states. Of course, the idea was about as smart as bringing Africanized bees into South America to try to step up honey production.

Unfortunately, farmed nutria produce pretty good pelts, but when allowed to go about their business in the wild, their pelts are not of a good enough quality to be used for clothing and so their economic value as a wild fur bearer is extremely low.

Lastly, they are not aquatic in a strict sense. Manatees, whales, and the like are aquatic. Nutria, beavers, and various other part time water mammals are semi-aquatic, spending part of their life on land, part in the water.

[buzz_knox]

Sounds like ya'll should be investing in some suppressed .22s.

[leadbutt]

We hunt them here in the swamps, and feed them to the hunt dogs, used to be a lot of trapping here in this area to,but most have given up on it now.did read an article in some mag that the state government in LA was trying to set up an export deal with China,seems they like the meat over there.

We use high speed 22 shorts and walk the banks,for them
One thing though make sure they are DEAD before picking up they have some real NASTY teeth

[Double Naught Spy]

The Insomniac show with David *** did a piece on one of the southern LA departments that as part of animal control have the city's sniper doing double duty in animal control. They drive around in a pickup truck with a driver, spotter, and shooter. The spotter spots, the truck stops, and the shooter shoots the nutria using a bolt action suppressed .22 with a scope. What a great way to practice your art! Who better to do the job! What amazed me is that you can see other traffic around the vehicle as the guy is shooting. It is definitely all in town.

[dZ]

Because nutrias reproduce so quickly (one female can produce up to 150 young in 16 months and they appear to breed year round), they quickly exhaust the food supply in their areas and have to move on. This rapid reproduction and resulting crop and levee damage accounts for the nutria's classification as "vermin" in Louisiana.

some doods had a website back in 99 that was a Maryland league of Nutria hunters

they prefered Black rifles, AKs & .308 veprs

that made them blow up good... reeeal good

[Southla1]

"southern LA departments that as part of animal control have the city's sniper doing double duty in animal control."


Can't swear to it but I think that was the Metarie PD that was doing that. Metarie adjourns New Orleans and is home to New Orleans International Airport (MSY).

[Mannlicher]

I just happened to have a fairly good recipe for 'smothered Nutria'. Not a bad way at all to cook the critters.

I just know this will set off a storm of competing Nutria recipies.

Smothered Nutria

One Nutria, dead of course, and as we say down here, dressed. This is not a
task for the faint of heart. You need about three pounds of meat.
Two onions, chopped
One bell pepper chopped
Four garlic cloves, minced
Two celery sticks, chopped
One quarter pound butter, (one stick)
Some flour, about a tablespoon
One half cup sliced mushrooms
One half cup red wine
Salt, pepper, cayenne to taste
Diced parsely and scallions to top meat with

Method:
Melt butter in a heavy pan

Fry meat on medium heat until browned

Add vegetables and saute until they become soft

Add the wine and the mushrooms,

Cover, and simmer on low heat until the meat is tender, add water if needed
to keep meat covered with liquid

Remove meat, and some of the liquid. Add flour to the liquid to make a
paste. Add this paste back to the pot, stirring until the resulting gravy
is smooth. Add water if needed. Add salt, pepper and spices.

Arrange sliced meat on a platter, cover with gravy, top with parsly and
scallions

serve with blackeyed peas, collards and cornbread. Pass the buttermilk!!!

[mattd]

eating Rats? I know, I know, it's NOT A Rat! But now, I've seen everything...sounds delicious, but the thought of eating a rat is, well, gross. Anyways, I talked to this guy on base in the barber shop today. He said much of the same, and that I may not need a hunting license because the state of LA has deemed these things a 'nuisance'. So, if I can go find me a little bolt-action .22 for a good price, I might be hunting Nutria's this weekend. Well see...

[swampgator]

as posted by Mannlicher

I just happened to have a fairly good recipe for 'smothered Nutria'. Not a bad way at all to cook the critters.

I just know this will set off a storm of competing Nutria recipies.


And to think you used to manage a resturant.:D
BTW isn't that your recipe for smothered possum, coon, and 'dillo? :)

The importance of the regulated harvest of nutria cannot be overstated: between 1962-1981 over one million nutria were harvested each year in Louisiana. During this time there was no damage to coastal wetlands. When changing market prices result in lower nutria harvests, coastal wetland damage from nutria becomes a problem. Alternatives to using regulated trappers to control nutria can be costly (if even practical) to society.

The above taken from: Trapping and Furbearer Management in North American Wildlife Conservation.

20 million nutria harvested. That's a lot of rodents! We have them here in North Florida. A buddy who works at a dairy has been told by the manager's to eradicate all the nutrias on the property do to damage to the land.

[Zorro]

Well having not ever eaten Nutria it might not be bad!

Can't be tougher, or taste worse than Mourning Dove can it?

[Dave McC]

Here in Md they're considered vermin, tho I admit there's a few folks around that eat them. Recipes for muskrat and coon seem to work.

Word has it that Nutes are not entirely herbivorous. While not predators per se, they do eat eggs and fledgling birds.

The Traditional Bowhunters of Md have a Nute hunt every year,going after them with recurves, longbows, and broadheads.

One friend from the area takes them with a 357. Feeds them to his dog.

[Kharn]

they prefered Black rifles, AKs & .308 veprs
that made them blow up good... reeeal good

LMAO! Last time I checked, Nutrias were .22 rimfire only in the great state of MD. But then, I doubt many cops are gonna wade out into the marsh to check your Ar15 to see if its shooting .223 or has a .22lr kit installed.

Kharn

[Dr.Rob]

"Yeah and sewer rat might taste like pumpkin pie , but I'll never know 'cause I wouldn't eat the flithy &^%$#*(@!"

I think Samuel L. Jackson summed that up well.

Then again, if you are hungry enough you can eat anything, if you HAVE to.

I recall a Nutria Rat Shooters Militia (now defunct) that featured these guys in camo with serious hardware, (Ak's, AR's, Benellis etc) declaring war on the vermin. It was a very silly site.

[dZ]

heres de olde link:
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=16685

[Southla1]

Seriously guys, if you shoot the younguns (4-5 pounds or so) and smother the down with onions they taste JUST like rabbit...............no kidding guys.

[swampgator]

I'm gonna have to trust you on that one!


Kinda off topic, has anyone ever had any run ins with a Capabear? There have been a few killed here in North Florida in recent years, but I've never seen alive in the wild.

I did see a show on Discovery about them, and my first thought was that they were like very large nutria.

[Art Eatman]

Capybara? Who turned those loose in Florida? Them thar is Amazon-jungle critters, according to National Geographic, etc. Jaguars luvvum. (Dunno 'bout Ferraris.)

:), Art

[Mannlicher]

Ole Swampgator says: And to think you used to manage a resturant.
BTW isn't that your recipe for smothered possum, coon, and 'dillo?


Yes, those years of honing my culinary skills were not wasted Swampgator!! ................and you CAN use this recipe to prepare other denizens of the swamp.

BTW, it is always a treat to see you here. Hope the family is doing well. My regards :)

[Double Naught Spy]

"Word has it that Nutes are not entirely herbivorous. While not predators per se, they do eat eggs and fledgling birds." - David McC


Generalized classifications such as carnivore and herbivore are simply a way to make a generalized statement about an animal's preferred or most common food regime - even through Carnivora is a Order of the mammals as is Rodentia. Few would doubt the status of a bear being a carnivore, but they really consume more in vegetation than they do in animal products. It would not be surprising to find nutria feeding on animal products.

Many rodents have a diet more diversified than just plants. Eating animal products is usually an opportunistic endeavor, such as when coming across a nest of eggs or maybe an animal carcass. Some are carnivorous only under certain conditions. For example, pregnant or lactating female squirrels will scavenge carcass or raid birds' nests for eggs or chicks for the sole purpose of satisfying their nutritional distress brought on by pregnancy or lactating.

At other times, rodents will eat animal products when their normal food reserves are gone. Have you seen any of the footage from Australia when they have the rodent population explosions? Everything from other mice to livestock gets attacked.

Here in the states, the grasshopper mouse is primarily carnivorous and eats insects, scorpions, other mice, nesting birds, and eggs. They have been reported to actually hunt in packs, like a mini pack of wolves and even have a howl or whistle.

Most rodents are NOT good predators, but if the have a success rate with less than 90% failure, then they will actually have a success rate higher than cheetahs whose predatory status is unquestioned.

[redneck]

I don't think they're real tough to kill, probably the perfect varmint to have fun with your .22 or .22mag with, the new .17HMR might be pretty cool too. I read an article ( its been quite awhile, couldn't find it again) by a couple guys that hunted nutrias with magnum air rifles. One had a springer, TX200 or something like that and the other had a real hot rod precharged outfit. Didn't make it sound like they were nearly as tough as racoons, possums, etc.

[mattd]

Well, I bought a little .22 bolt action today and went on my first real Nutria hunt. I stopped at a pawn shop here in town and scoped out the .22s for a while. I finally settled on a JC Higgins .22 bolt action rifle with a clip. I think I got a pretty good deal at $70. Then we drove out to the swamps (still not sure if we found an official swamp) and hiked around for a while trying to find the elusive Nutria (pronounced 'Nutra' in these parts). Alas, after three hours of tramping around, all we found was a lost dog who followed us home. However, I'm planning on doing more of the same tomorrow night, possibly with a flashlight. I guess swamps are a little harder to come by here than I'd expected. But I had a blast on my first day hunting in my entire life.

[redneck]

The guys in the article I read had gone around to area farmers and asked for permission to varmint hunt on their land. Sounded like irrigation ponds and things like that were a good place to find them. They also shot crows and stuff, win win situation for the hunters and the farmers.

[Double Naught Spy]

Shooting nutrias might be okay, but I believe shooting crows is definitely against federal law. They are considered indigenous migratory birds and hence are protected.

[Southla1]

They may be federally protected but they are dead meat down here........................for them I do not have a recipe though :D!

[swampgator]

as posted by Double Naught Spy

I believe shooting crows is definitely against federal law. They are considered indigenous migratory birds and hence are protected.
Not so:

Per the Florida 2002-2003 Hunting Regulations handbook:

"Migratory nongame birds that are causing damage to trees, crops, livestock or wildlife, or that are concentrated in such numbers that they are a nuisance, may be taken under permit issued by U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service. Blackbirds, grackles, cowbirds, and crows may be taken without permit when they are causing such damage." (Emphasis mine)

Also: FWC Website (http://wld.fwc.state.fl.us/hunting/mig_bird_season.htm)
Crow
Season: November 9 - January 19.
May 10 - November 2 (Saturdays and Sundays only)
Shooting Hours: One-half hour before sunrise to sunset
Bag Limit: No bag or possession limits.

as posted by Southla1
They may be federally protected but they are dead meat down here........................for them I do not have a recipe though!
I did have a crow recipe at one time. There's a website dedicated to crow shooters and it was listed on it. Never had the
"pleasure(?)" of trying it though.

as posted by Art Eatman
Capybara? Who turned those loose in Florida? Them thar is Amazon-jungle critters, according to National Geographic, etc. Jaguars luvvum. (Dunno 'bout Ferraris.)

Art, dunno who released them, but they are here. Surprisingly they aren't too much of a problem yet. Several have been spotted in the area of the Suwannee and Santa Fe Rivers in North Central Florida (ie down the road from the house).

The first case I remember hearing of was back in 1995 a fellow was fishing from the bank of the Suwannee when a Capybara accosted him. Not recongnizing what it was, but recongnizing that it didn't belong, he shot it, (Smart guy actually) and brought the carcass to the Commission. So yeah, they're here.


as posted by Mannlicher
Yes, those years of honing my culinary skills were not wasted Swampgator!! ................and you CAN use this recipe to prepare other denizens of the swamp.

BTW, it is always a treat to see you here. Hope the family is doing well.

Just glad I never took you up on the free meal offer! :D
Everything's cool up here, literally, we set a new record low temp the other night!

Rob fell while cleaning the bullet traps and separated his shoulder plus has a nasty, I mean really nasty bruise on his hip. But other than that everybodies good.

[Al Thompson]

Hmmm I thought Nutria and capybera were about the same thing.. Off track?

[mattd]

Just got back from my second Nutria hunt, and the score is:
Nutrias: 2
Matt: ZERO

I actually found a swamp this time, just didn't see anything in it. I do like the .22 though. It's so quiet. I got in a little target practice while I was waiting for the ever elusive Nutrias. Anybody know if Nutrias are afraid of humans? Would they run if they saw me or just mind their own? Anyway, maybe I'll try again next weekend...gotta find a better swamp though.

[swampgator]

Gizmo,

Both are semi-aquatic rodents.

Nutrias are smaller 22-25 inches long, 12-17 inch tail, 15-20 pounds in weight.

Capybara are: "Largest rodent alive with body length of 42 to 53 inches and height at shoulder 20 to 24 inches; weight of male is 77 to 140 pounds, of female 80 to 145 pounds."


BTW Mega Cool points awarded to the first person to post a Capy recipe!

[scotjute]

They're not particularly bright. I've even caught a couple of youngsters (2-3 lbs.)by hand once. Their diet is herbivorous, and they're no more dangerous than an armadillo is, unless you try to catch one, they do have big nasty teeth. They are however a pest. I normally shoot them when I have a chance. Would think a .22lr scoped would be good, shotgun would be better, but shells cost more. Be careful when shooting on surface of water lest your bullet skip!

[Mouskie]

Southern shipyard workers brought along a supply of nutria (to go with their collard greens) during WWII; they (the nutria) got loose and now inhabit the last 100 miles or so of the Columbia River, as well as most of the Willamette Valley here in Oregon. I have seen them entering/exiting drainage pipes in suburban Portland. I duck hunt with a friend in the big marshes athwart the Columbia near Astoria and the bane of his existence are the nutria for which his black lab Ebby has an irresistable affinity. The battles between Ebby and an adult nutria (she inevitably runs across one while retrieving distant crippled ducks) are something to see and hear, as is the screaming and raving of her owner. Ebby always loses; her ears resemble the fringes on a buckskin shirt. She can kill the babies and juveniles, but an adult will draw blood and whup her ass every time. My wife's uncle (her family's from Metairie, La) has a friend with a custom dental bridge that includes a nutria tooth ground down to fit. Says he can crack Lake Ponchartrain oyster shells with it.

[tex_n_cal]

Nutria have made it as far north as Dallas, I know, as I bumped into one once on the Grand Prarie Muni golf course. Walking around a pond with rushes, I first saw him perhaps fifteen feet away. Startling to meet a 15 pound rat without warning.:eek: I was glad for my 3 iron and wishing for a 1911!

Somewhere I have a photo of three younguns we met while fishing on Lake Caddo - they were sitting on a floating log.

Alligators supposedly like Nutria, and I think the gator's comeback is partly due to the plentiful supply of slow swimming, easy to catch Nutrias. Guess that's not a bad thing:)

Now if someone could just figure out what animal could be introduced to California and put a dent in the liberal populations. Siberian Tigers? Jaguars? Black Mambas?:D

[short shot]

open season on crows here,no nutria's though ,have a pretty good amount of coon and possums to play with.

[Zorro]

The only problem with Alligators is that they sometimes hit Bass lures!

2 Foot or less I try to get the hook out, BIGGER than that and I just cut the line.

[Molly]

Nutria rats are fed to the Gators at the Alligator Farm in St. Augustine, FL. I've seen the show, and those gators jump almost full body out of the water and snap the rats from a rope. The gators snap their jaws down on the whole rat a few times before swallowing and you can hear the bones snapping from 100 feet away. The nutria they use are about as big as my 40 lb Bassett hound.

[Southla1]

"The only problem with Alligators is that they sometimes hit Bass lures!"

Oh yes they will! I have caught then on Crank Baits, Plastic Worms and live bait too.

Like Zorro the ones 2 foot or less get released back in the water. The ones over 3 feet get realeased into a skillet of hot cooking oil after being coated with batter and seasoning.

[MeekAndMild]

Nutes are dangerous when cornered! One attacked my dogs and cut the female on the nose...blood everywhere. I shot him with a .22 Beretta and that was the end of the nute. Otherwise I try to avoid them.

[Chuck Dye]

Nutria and other game recipes, may be found at

http://www.fooddownunder.com

[mattd]

Man, I've been out hunting for Nutria's and can't even seem to find one. I haven't exactly found your standard MK I swamp either, which is probably part of the problem. Everybody keeps saying there are so many of these little suckers...well not in North LA as far as I can tell. Anybody know the web address of the 'Southern North American Nutria Migration map'???

[mattd]

In south Louisiana, a dermatitis has been recognized called "nutria itch," "marsh itch," or "creeping eruption." The possible link between the large number of nutrias and the occurrence of a severe pruriginous rash hours after people have been in water or close to a swamp has been noted.1-3

A 12-year-old boy and his 68-year-old grandfather developed diarrhea and an intensely pruritic rash on their trunks and extremities after working in mud next to a marsh populated with nutrias. After 2 weeks of severe pruritus and no improvement, they sought medical attention. Results of their physical examination showed a maculopapular erythematous rash that involved the chest and extremities, but the grandfather's rash was more severe

(I got this off of a LA state Nutria article, from a state-level CDC type agency. Pretty wild huh?):barf:

[Southla1]

"mattd", most of them in the state prefer (or that's where the majority are found anyway) is the salt marshes in the southern part of the state. I KNOW there are some up north too but not nearly as many.

As far as that nutria itch I can believe it. There are a lot of different bacteria and virusus and other unsavory critters that love the wetlands. I don't know about this one but most of them though need an open sore or other break in the skin to get a foothold in the body.

[mattd]

Carol:

I've seen one. Brave little sucker too, crossed a two-lane highway with me going by at 70 mph. So, I know there's a few up here. My problem is finding swamps around here. Being a California native, my tourist perception of LA was that the whole state was swamps.:confused: Ha! I do love it here though. Anyway, I'll continue to look around.

In a separate incident, I took my first bead on a coyote on a beautiful moonlit night across 200 yds of open field a couple days ago. Wow. A little harder to tag than the Nutria I think. A lot smarter too. Needless to say, I missed by a mile. Beautiful creatures though. It took us almost three hours just to see one...:cool:

[TBAUS]

I've seen Nutria just south and east of Ft. Worth while canoeing down the Brazos River from Possum Kingdom ( no joke) State Park. It looked like a beaver while swimming to the bank. As it's fat butt went into a hole a little above the river line I saw the tail. Definitely looks like a rat tail. It was the early morning hours just after sunrise that I saw that one an a couple more.