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Old June 13, 2001, 10:56 AM   #1
Dave3006
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New taser technology - worth checking out

You have to see the new taser technology that is available at www.etaser.com. Look at the real life videos. This thing has more stopping power than a handgun.

I live in Kali, so I can't get a CCW. I just bought one to keep in my car. This miles ahead of what they zapped Rodney with. It is worth checking out.

Dave
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Old June 13, 2001, 11:13 PM   #2
PreserveFreedom
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I don't think it's something that I'll run out and buy. Even with the yellow option, some rookie cop is bound to shoot you saying it looked like agun from a distance. If they made one that was more rectangular, like traditional stun guns, it would be more interesting.
 
Old June 14, 2001, 09:51 AM   #3
Dave3006
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In California, it is this or nothing. I don't expect a cop to be within 5 miles when I need this someday. The role I see it fitting is one where some jerk gets ****** off and wants to fight while driving. Typical road rage scenario. I have 10 years of Shotokan and 5 years of BJJ. But, if I don't have to fight, all the better.
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Old June 14, 2001, 12:08 PM   #4
Matt VDW
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I think the correct link is http://www.airtaser.com .
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Old June 18, 2001, 04:43 PM   #5
Vern Brink
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The M26 for LE only is an outstanding less lethal tool. We (my squad) have about 15 or so deployments using both w/the probes and the touch stun application. An earlier battery issue that's been corrected caused a minor failure, but the new NiMh are very nice. If you don't already have the rechargeables, get them and follow the charging advice on the web site.

Erick - I agree in principal w/o knowing the details Less lethal should typically be deployed w/lethal cover.
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Old June 18, 2001, 05:00 PM   #6
Dave3006
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I tried both the NiMh batteries and the plain duracels. I agree NiMh is much better. With the duracells, you could hear the repetition rate slow down during the 5 second burst. With the NiMh, it kept going strong.

Vern - On the street, did you see a willingness of the bad guy to continue fighting after you turned off the juice? That is my concern about this weapon. What does a civilian do with the bad guy when you decide to turn off the power???

Thanks,
Dave
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Old June 18, 2001, 05:18 PM   #7
Vern Brink
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Only once. Suicidal subject on crystal meth. He had already cut his wrists, but was still pretty amped up. The (old) batteries began to fail on the second 5 second cycle. He was able and willing to fight after each cycle ended. He was completely incapacitated during. I wonder if the NiMh would have made a difference.

I think it will depend on the mindset of the subject. With all of the deployments the subjects were extremely compliant, especially after two 5 sec cycles. We recently put two sets of probes into a 6'9" 350 lb subject. He was exhausted afterwards and completely cooperative. I've found that most people will immediately do what you tell them to if they are physically able to. In post deployment interviews all they wanted was not to get juiced again.

Couple things - I don't know how different the M18 "feels" compared to an M26. I suspect they both work well. What you do after a deployment is going to depend on a lot of factors. I believe you only have the 15 foot cartridge? You are going to be fairly close. What are your options? Are you armed? With family? Can you safely escape? If you need to deliver an additional cycle, by all means do so. You'll be good for about 60 I think w/the good batteries Seriously though, if you are still at risk or cannot gain compliance, hit it again. Carry a spare cartridge. They have a battery floorplate that you can snap one on to. Bottom line - I "think" two cycle's (10 sec) would be more than enough.
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Old June 19, 2001, 10:21 AM   #8
Dave3006
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Vern, thanks for the real life data. The only difference between the M26 and M18 is the pulse repetition rate. The M26 fires 15 pulses per second of about 1.8J of energy. The M18 fires 10 pulses per second of 1.8J of energy. To me, that would make the NiMh batteries on the civilian model crucial since I could see the duracells slow down on my M18 towards the end of the 5 second cycle.

I tried the M18 on myself as a contact weapon. It jolted me hard enough to make me drop the taser (I decided to lay on the carpet to try this). It was not exactly a 5 second cycle. But it did give me some confidence in it. The reason I did this was because I gave pepper spray to my wife as protection and I never tested it. Based on what I have seen lately, Pepper spray can not be depended on. I think I have seen enough to depend on the taser within limits.
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Old June 19, 2001, 07:25 PM   #9
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well, the department I work for got these, so during the training session to introduce all of the officers to them, I agreed to get tazed as a demonstration. All I can say is that is was was extremely incapacitating while I was being jolted, however, after the cycle stop, I recovered quickly so I agree that this device must be deployed under lethal cover. I thought the tazer was a great tool though and offers a reliable less than lethal option for police officers. It's been 4 months and I still have a scar from the points where the probes were.
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Old June 19, 2001, 09:48 PM   #10
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AAChang- That is good feedback. How long did you take the jolt for? The full five seconds? How combative do you think you would have been if you would have taken two full five second bursts?

As a side note, I have practiced Judo and Brazilian Jiu Jitsu. I have been choked completely out. Although I was only unconscious for a few seconds, I really did not feel to combat ready for several minutes afterwards. Do you think there could be a similiar effect with the taser?

Dave
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Old June 20, 2001, 06:29 PM   #11
AAChang
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Dave3006, I did not take the full 5 second burst, and the jolt definately would make me rethinking trying to be combative in any way shape or form. During the shock the pain was pretty intense, think if you had you nipple rings and someone was trying to twist and rip them out at the contact points, however, after the jolt I only felt a slight burning at point, kind of like a bee sting. The most important thing was that while the jolt was being applied, I had no motor control. I tried to just take a step forward but I only fell. This would mean that any suspect that this system was being deployed against would be unable to act against the officer while being shocked. After immediately afterward I was right back on my feet. I've also training in Brazilian Jiu Jitsu and the jolt had no where near the long term effects of being choked. I did not have the shortness of breath, naeusa, headache and disorientation after the tazer.
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Old June 20, 2001, 06:39 PM   #12
Dave3006
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Thanks. It looks like the plan would be to hit them a couple times with the juice. If that does not work, brake their arm or choke them out.
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Old June 22, 2001, 05:36 PM   #13
mooser
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The Taser is a wonderful tool. It gives us leo's another tool for the tool box. It will save some lives, both officers as well as those that it is used on. I have taken three doses from the M26 and have not seen any type of stopping power that strong in any other tools that we have available. So far I have not seen anyone that it hasn't worked on, but I'm sure that person is probably out there. I don't have to get close enough to employ oc spray or use a baton. The Taser does not replace the deadly force use of firearms, and if used in situaitons where a person is armed or very agressive then good tactics must be used first and foremost. We have put the Taser on the pain level of force in our use of force spectrum, the same level as oc spray. So far the Taser has been working for our officers with good results. Again it is a tool like everything else that we have available, including verbal and your mind.

Sully www.defensive-edge.net
Taser Master Instructor
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