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Old June 3, 2001, 04:41 PM   #1
Kernel
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From the Guns & Ammo web site.....

- Nurnberg Germany’s International Trade Fair for Hunting and Shooting Arms -

"Guns & Ammo’s Skip Johnson holds a unique Russian-made 12 gauge revolving shotgun. Looking like a giant revolver, the compact gun holds five 2-inch shells. Its maker, the Tula Armory, also offers traditional rifles and shotguns as well."

Different ... I wonder what the trigger pull is like? And how long before speed-loaders are available? -- Kernel
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Old June 3, 2001, 06:55 PM   #2
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...and how bad is the cylinder gap flash? That's what made early revolving rifles unpopular (that and possibility of chainfires).
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Old June 3, 2001, 07:26 PM   #3
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Yeah, interesting thought, but worthless in the long run. If it's an inexpensive gun, a much more functional pump shotgun would work so much better. And that little chain fires problem that the good man spoke of. Sounds like a gun that's worthless for practical purposes, but if you were a collector of shotguns, it might be interesting to have.
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Old June 3, 2001, 07:50 PM   #4
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Chain fire is unlikely outside of non-cartridge revolvers but cylinder gap flash remains.
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Old June 4, 2001, 01:51 AM   #5
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It might cam the cylinder forwards to seal the flash gap in a fashion similar to the 1895 Nagant revolver. There appears to be a protrusion around the barrel which supports this. Only speculation on my part, though.
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Old June 4, 2001, 02:09 AM   #6
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How is it cycled? I hope the trigger pull doesn't have anything to do with it.

Might be interesting as a shorty. But we can't have shorties.
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Old June 4, 2001, 05:33 AM   #7
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A solution to a non existant problem?

And how pray tell is this design an inprovement over a pump? It's a novelty AFAI can tell. More moving parts = more chance for something to go wrong. Double width shell storage makes for a wider body. My 870 appears to have more metal around the working parts than this design. On the surface, that would mean a stronger design for the pump. Stronger=longer life.

Note: I don't fault em for doing it, I'm just saying anyone in the world is welcome to cut in line in front of me to actually buy one. It IS nice to see someone, he11, anyone doing something different for a change instead of this weeks flavor of polymer or (ugh!)Tactical.
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Old June 5, 2001, 01:03 PM   #8
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Reminds me of that POS "Thunder Five" handgun. The major advantage I can see is the short action length. Compaired to a pump or a semiauto you could have a repeater that is a full 3 1/2 inches shorter. Put a pistol grip on it and a 18" barrel and you'd have a 5 shot 12ga not much longer than 2 feet.

So you have the short lenght of a single or double, and the capacity of a standard pump. Plus it's easy (and safer) to load and unload... just like a revolver. And like a revolver it wouldn't spray empty casings everywhere, which is nice if you reload or don't want to litter (or advertise you favorite hunting spots). The downside is what I imagine is a god-awful double-action trigger pull. -- Kernel
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Old June 5, 2001, 01:17 PM   #9
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If they did it right...

The trigger pull would be long, but smooth. Of course, for a crisp trigger pull, hopefully you could thumb-cock the hammer.
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Old June 5, 2001, 01:22 PM   #10
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Hey, I give them points for trying! Personally I think guns that are just "different" are good. I put this in the same class as the Mateba auto-revolver. Sure something else might work better, but there is something kind of cool about having something that nobody else at the range has ever seen.
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Old June 5, 2001, 02:01 PM   #11
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I guess I'm in the minority...

But I'd jump on this, provided the technical kinks mentioned have been resolved...I think it's a brilliant concept
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Old June 5, 2001, 02:47 PM   #12
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Just wait until HKS makes a speedloader for it...
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Old June 5, 2001, 04:47 PM   #13
Dave McC
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Has anyone besides me noted that it's for 2" shells only?
These are still sold in Europe, but scarce here.

An interesting piece, but my 870s have no reason to get nervous, or jealous...
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Old June 5, 2001, 07:08 PM   #14
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Aguila mini shells are 1.5 inches. I have used their slugs and they work just fine....less wad and enough powder for tacticle loads. No problem gettin them.

Cylinder walls don't look very thick, but I wanna know more bout it.

Sam
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Old June 5, 2001, 07:37 PM   #15
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Points

I'm sure they'll make one that can take standard 2.75" shells eventually, if they thing such a thing would sell in the US.

Now, to all you pump shotgun lovers, who claim that this will never replace this or isn't an improvement over that:

That's not the point.

You don't necessarily own a gun because it's the very best, the most advanced, or even the most effective. You own it because you like it. I doubt that Bakail is going to market this as a replacement for anybody's pump guns. It's just different. If American gun makers actually made something original and unique once in awhile they'd probably do better. Instead they just keep rehashing the tried and true over and over and over again. I mean, there's nothing wrong with a proven design, but a innovation is a good thing.

Now, the concept of a revolving long gun is SOUND, so long as you can conquer the cylinder gap problem. Out side of that, there's NO REASON it won't work. It works in revolvers, it'll work in a revolver with a long barrel and a stock.

That same company is also marketing a polymer framed, top-break revovler. How many TFLers said you couldn't make a top-break revolver with modern high pressure cartridges? How does anybody know? Did anybody actually try? And I've never heard of a polymer framed revolver before. I do, however, understand that when polymer framed pistols were first introduced, many scoffed, saying it'd never work.

So, let's no knock the Russians and their kooky revolver shotgun until we actually get to try it.
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Old June 5, 2001, 08:09 PM   #16
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I'd be willing to look at it, especially if the price is less than the Saiga-12, which I also want.

I would like to see a 16" Bled .454 Casull carbine, while they're being inventive...would be ideal for bear defense, says me.
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Old June 5, 2001, 09:11 PM   #17
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Aren't shotguns with "revolving chambers", like the Streetsweeper and Striker-12 classified by BATF as destructive devices? Granted, this gun doesn't LOOK like those, but will BATF pass up a chance to extend its reach?
 
Old June 5, 2001, 10:08 PM   #18
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I would like to see it in as a 7? or 8? shot .410. That would be sweet! I bet it could even handle 3" shells.

Fezwig
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Old June 5, 2001, 11:01 PM   #19
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slap on a pistol grip and a 8 inch barrel and you might have something!
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Old June 6, 2001, 02:03 AM   #20
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And the guy in the pic with the bad suit looks like a young Boris Yeltsin...that can't be Skip Johnson, not that I've ever seen mr. Johnson...
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Old August 10, 2001, 08:58 PM   #21
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Quote:
You don't necessarily own a gun because it's the very best, the most advanced, or even the most effective. You own it because you like it.

You know, Night, fer a young pup you sure hit the mark a lot.

I'd love to have one of these, jes' fer the fun of it. Like a .22 Gatling gun. No serious purpose - just fun.


That cylinder release sure has a S&W flavor to it, doesn't it?
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Old August 10, 2001, 11:32 PM   #22
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http://home.tula.net/tularms/hunt_sgen.htm

these guys make some impressive guns

check out the dual auto load drilling
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Old August 11, 2001, 12:35 AM   #23
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I'd buy one if it was affordable. Personally, I am a fan of the old "Cattleman's Carbine". I wish they would make a comeback. They would be especially nice if made for modern metallic cartridge ammo.
 
Old August 11, 2001, 10:38 AM   #24
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Romulus

I ran a search for "guns ammo skip johnson" on the new images.google.com image search engine, and found this link:

http://www.gunsandammomag.com/images/0319FA1C.jpg

AFAICT, that really is Mr. Johnson...
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Old August 12, 2001, 01:20 AM   #25
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it would be kinda cool as a 45/70
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