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Old January 16, 2014, 09:28 PM   #1
Double Naught Spy
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New Gun Designed for Indian Women

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-25727080

"Fearless" (translation)

Named for a gang-rape victim killed in India last year, this is the first gun designed specifically for Indian women. It is "small" and lightweight (just over a pound) and is a .32.

It has to be the largest small caliber woman's defense gun I have seen in quite some time. It may be light, but it is something of a monster in size. It also seems to have a very high bore axis, making the smaller .32 caliber a better choice because of recoil issues.

I like the concept of popularizing self defense for women, but I think the design may have missed the mark. I doubt much time was spent with the target demographic in determining what they wanted in a firearm.
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Old January 16, 2014, 09:33 PM   #2
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I applaud that India actually allows its citizens to own and carry firearms, and that the general reaction in the country has been positive. While this revolver is awkwardly-shaped and expensive, if it has a very light trigger pull it could still work well. Let's hope gun attitudes in India continue to shift and the areas they are allowed to carry increase.
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Old January 16, 2014, 09:34 PM   #3
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Looks like the Webley clone they've been making in India for some time now. It's just being marketed differently.
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Old January 16, 2014, 10:12 PM   #4
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I applaud that India actually allows its citizens to own and carry firearms, and that the general reaction in the country has been positive.
Their laws are actually pretty tough, and I'm not sure how many folks see the application process all the way through.
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Old January 17, 2014, 01:08 AM   #5
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Indian women accessorise!

There has finally been some action in trying to address what is an appalling violence record against women in India.

As such it seems there is now a firm has decide to address with a "gun for ladies".

Well the weight and calibre are lady-friendly (.32 and 500gr/1lb), but not sure about the looks. The top-break revolver looks like a webley to my untrained eye.

I guess that importing foreign made arms would be highly regulated so the likes of S&W would never get to most people, so local industry has done what it did with Royal Enfield and re-used an old design.

Gun trivia: if readers scroll down the linked page they can see some gun stats about India. They seem to have a tiny issue with unregistered firearms. Also note the questionable gun-handling half-way down!

PS I am not losing my marbles: this is a merged post from another thread!
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Old January 17, 2014, 03:13 AM   #6
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I would also suspect that at a cost of almost $2K American it is out of the reach of the class (or caste) of women who would most need it.
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Old January 17, 2014, 06:52 AM   #7
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Seems like S&W or Ruger could make a killing (no pun intended) if they could introduce LCRs or J-frames into that HUGE market at a lot less than $2K.
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Old January 17, 2014, 06:54 AM   #8
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The man in the video seems to be having some trouble with the trigger
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Old January 17, 2014, 07:20 AM   #9
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I am pretty sure (heard from a semi-reliable source)that the largest caliber a "civilian" can own in India is a .32, which is probably the rational behind the caliber choice

Still, it seems like a step in the right direction assuming that Indian laws won't persecute anyone who actually uses one of these for legitimate self-defense.

A .32 LCP would be an excellent choice it seems, for the Indian woman who needs simple protection she can take anywhere, and I bet Ruger could get the Indian people a much much lower price point than 2K.
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Old January 17, 2014, 09:14 AM   #10
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Agree with Buzz, it is a local copy of the Webley Mk IV Pocket .32.
Ironic that the Raj is still producing them but they are not at all legal in England.
Manufactured goods tend to be more expensive in the rest of the world, why would they inflate the cost even more with titanium? The steel gun only weighs 22 oz.

Yes, Ruger could do it, some years ago they sold India some Service Sixes in .380/200 (.38 S&W.) Tariff on American products is probably out of sight to protect local companies, though.
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Old January 17, 2014, 10:51 AM   #11
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My fear would be, that altho the gun may protect them from being raped, it could also be used against them during the rape and after to eliminate the victim. Add to the fact that Indian woman have little or no rights, the word of one women against 5 men, that she killed one of her attackers outta self defense will hold little weight. What India needs is to educate the population that women have rights too and that rape/gang rape is wrong. The country and it's culture has a long and grim history of abusing girls and women. In most gang rapes, bystanders do not help the victim, but more often than not, join in the festivities. Women are viewed as objects and not people. India is home to the one of the largest Sex Slave industries in the world, with over a third of those held against their will being under the age of 18. Indian men prefer those girls with ethnic backgrounds different from their own and having sex with under aged girls against their will is an accepted practice. Hopefully till this changes, having a gun will make a difference.
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Old January 17, 2014, 11:27 AM   #12
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"I am horrified, shocked and angered," says Binalakshmi Nepram, founder of the Women Gun Survivors Network in the north-eastern state of Manipur, who says it's the government's responsibility to ensure the security of its citizens
I wonder if he's more horrified at the thought of a woman defending herself than the woman being raped?


Like there can be a cop in your pocket or purse whenever you need one .....


Hell, there's never one a block away when you need one ......

Quote:
My fear would be, that altho the gun may protect them from being raped, it could also be used against them during the rape and after to eliminate the victim.
As if they'd be any deader being shot than curb stomped or strangled? Once the victim is overpowered, whether they are killed or not is entirely dependent upon the whim of the attacker(s). Having a gun may deter the physical part of the confrontation from even occurring..... and if not, then nothing says "No!" more emphatically than well directed transonic jacketed hollow points.


A firearm is an equalizer, giving a single person a fighting chance against physically stronger and/or more numerous attackers.

Maybe the situation is tactically hopeless (more determined attackers than bullets?) ..... but I advocate fighting back .... it is morally preferable to submitting to the tender mercies of a rapist: there are worse thing than Death, because Death comes for us all, eventually .....

Quote:
Add to the fact that Indian woman have little or no rights, the word of one women against 5 men, that she killed one of her attackers outta self defense will hold little weight. What India needs is to educate the population that women have rights too and that rape/gang rape is wrong. The country and it's culture has a long and grim history of abusing girls and women. In most gang rapes, bystanders do not help the victim, but more often than not, join in the festivities. Women are viewed as objects and not people. India is home to the one of the largest Sex Slave industries in the world, with over a third of those held against their will being under the age of 18. Indian men prefer those girls with ethnic backgrounds different from their own and having sex with under aged girls against their will is an accepted practice. Hopefully till this changes, having a gun will make a difference.

All the more reason to STBDRT: "pour encourager les autres". If it happened every time, rape would become very rare indeed.
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Old January 17, 2014, 11:28 AM   #13
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Produce a gun intended for use by the masses of ordinary Indian womenfolk as protection against rapists, then proceed to price said gun out of their reach.

Brilliant marketing concept. Brilliant, I say!
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Old January 17, 2014, 12:14 PM   #14
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So the gun is a Webley knockoff. It is no more designed for women than any other Indian gun made. The only difference is that it is being marketed toward women, apparently wealthy ones at that. It is sold in a fancy box, sort of like putting pink grips on pistols here.
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Old January 17, 2014, 02:13 PM   #15
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Their laws are actually pretty tough, and I'm not sure how many folks see the application process all the way through.
All i can say is OH MY GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!! On the bright side it's in English
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Old January 17, 2014, 03:00 PM   #16
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What India needs is to educate the population that women have rights too
That could be said about any country in the world including the USA.

The threat of the law and the threat of becoming social pariahs, is more valuable than guns in the hands of rich women.
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Old January 17, 2014, 03:20 PM   #17
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Their version of a Ladysmith or Charter Arms Undercoverette.
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Old January 17, 2014, 04:26 PM   #18
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EPIC FAIL!

A licensed copy of a Keltec P32 would be much better. Way lighter, much cheaper to produce, easier to carry, and available in designer colors (polymers have and advantage here). And 32 ACP has a bit more horsepower than S&W long.

And in India they actually can go with bigger calibers. Some calibers are restricted like 9mm, 45 ACP, 455, and 38 S&W. But if want and can afford a 44 magnum you can do it. You can search here for more info: Indians For Guns
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Old January 17, 2014, 08:25 PM   #19
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"Indian men prefer those girls with ethnic backgrounds different from their own and having sex with under aged girls against their will is an accepted practice. Hopefully till this changes, having a gun will make a difference."

I am American and married into an Indian family. We have been married for 25 years. My experience is that having sex with underage girls against their will is not an accepted practice in India, whether they are Muslim or Hindu. I can not post what would happen in my family or the ones that I know personally if one of the girls were taken advantage of. Pre-marital sex is not even allowed. Anyway, the gun is way too expensive for the women who need it most. Small inexpensive knives for self defensive are popular in India.

Last edited by puppyface; January 17, 2014 at 08:51 PM.
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Old January 17, 2014, 10:53 PM   #20
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poster buck460XVR said:
Add to the fact that Indian woman have little or no rights, the word of one women against 5 men, that she killed one of her attackers outta self defense will hold little weight. What India needs is to educate the population that women have rights too and that rape/gang rape is wrong. The country and it's culture has a long and grim history of abusing girls and women. In most gang rapes, bystanders do not help the victim, but more often than not, join in the festivities. Women are viewed as objects and not people. India is home to the one of the largest Sex Slave industries in the world, with over a third of those held against their will being under the age of 18. Indian men prefer those girls with ethnic backgrounds different from their own and having sex with under aged girls against their will is an accepted practice. Hopefully till this changes, having a gun will make a difference.
---------------------------------------
buck460XVR you seem to know a whole lot about country of India. What about the Indian men in US? Do you think the India professors, doctors, people like that, are like that too?
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Old January 17, 2014, 11:07 PM   #21
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$1200 for a that revolver! Seriously?

I like the fact that it will prevent women being RAPED but they should not have to be ROBBED beforehand.
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Old January 18, 2014, 08:53 PM   #22
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Let's not wander too far into discussing cultural issues and problems we have with this or that culture. We may think there are better guns but it's a step forward for this gun to be produced and at least some women getting them.

They should sell them here too. A top break titanium in part 32 appeals to my sense of a just because weird gun.
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Old January 18, 2014, 09:26 PM   #23
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it would seem that the only women in India who can afford to get a ccw permit/license are the ones most likely to already have bodyguards.... so much for their hyped gun.
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Old January 20, 2014, 01:33 PM   #24
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buck460XVR - I wonder why you make such sweeping statements and now refuse to reply?
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Old January 20, 2014, 01:37 PM   #25
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Charlesc - I clearly said to drop the cultural discussion. I suggest you follow my advice. No more warnings and that goes for others.
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