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Old December 17, 2013, 07:55 PM   #26
Garycw
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SR420 View Post
Nothing says 7.62 x 39 Semi Automatic Rifle better than AK47

That is one mean looking AK, SR20! The AK's are more versatile and light, but i still think of the four OP listed, SKS is best value.
This SKS paratrooper and AK47 are about the same size, but a big difference in weight.

Paratrooper:


AK47:
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Old December 17, 2013, 08:07 PM   #27
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The VZ is a great gun, but it's just too weird to be practical. The Czechs intentionally designed it to be completely incompatible with the AK, save for the round it fires, as an act of defiance against the Soviet regime.
You're probably thinking of the Polish Tantal, a weird abortion that's identical to an AK except nothing fits . The VZ is a totally different platform and action, which is superior to the AK in every way other than the cost of giving them away to satellite countries for free. The Czechs weren't being defiant (though they probably were that, too), they had a long history of making the world's best guns, and made something for themselves better than the AKs they were given. Sorry for the minor thread departure, but the VZ is totally practical; just ask any Canadian who's not allowed to own AKs but can freely obtain a VZ conversion which is more practical up there

The VZ has a milled receiver and weighs a pound less than an AK unloaded. The gas-system of the VZ is a good 3" shorter than the AK. It's mags are similar to the AK (but with a bolt hold-open track that makes them AK-incompatible) but made from aluminum and are very well built. The factory folding stock is among the most solid-locking side folding stock designs I've seen. The VZ is striker fired, and has a trigger with much take up, but little resistance or roughness. There are companies making everything from furniture, to 922r parts, to AK47 drum conversions, to railed top covers and other scope mounts for the VZ. I'll actually be working on a belt-fed conversion at some point



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Old December 17, 2013, 08:32 PM   #28
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1. Mini 30 Best rifle overall. A modern day SKS, but I'm not sure it's worth two SKS's though.

2. SKS If you take your time and find a good example of the SKS it is unquestionably the best value. I'd prefer the type 56( Chinese ) over the Yugo. The type 56 is generally lighter and I've found them to be more accurate.

3. AK My number one choice if money was no object. In my opinion any AK worth buying will cost you as much as a Mini 30 and a SKS combined. The low end $5-700 Ak's I've shot were inferior to my $300 SKS in both accuracy and reliability. If you get a quality AK though they are one of the most reliable weapons ever built.

I have no experience with the VZ-58.

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Old December 18, 2013, 11:11 AM   #29
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Mini 30 Best rifle overall.
I know this is all opinion, but I'm not sure how one can make this claim, when by his own admission, he has no experience with the VZ-58 (a well-made well-designed, accurate and very well-finished rifle) or an AK that wasn't "low end". There is a vast range of AKs out there, and the MAK-90 is considered by many to be one of the better ones.
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Old December 18, 2013, 07:26 PM   #30
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Sig 556r is the nicest 762 x 39 platform I have used. I have a MAK90 and an SKS. I have also shot many other aks like century and arsenal.

I like the arsenal slightly better than the MAK90 even though I don't own one.

I cannot comment on the new minis. The old ones were reliable but were inside 100 yard rifles. Maybe inside 75 yard rifles.

The sig is very accurate. And the gen2 is very reliable.

The reality is you really cant go wrong. 7.62 x 39 is so cheap and ABUNDANT. Good luck and BTW this is my ranking...

1 - sig 556r
2 - VZ or arsenal (higher end ak)
3 - MAK90 (mid range ak)
4 - Mini 30
5 - SKS
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Old December 18, 2013, 09:42 PM   #31
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...hard to 'scope a vz-58?



5.56mm vz-58 with CzechpointUSA side rail, available for vz-58s in both flavors.

7.62x39mm with red dot forward mounted, very easy to use.

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Old December 19, 2013, 07:04 AM   #32
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I like the 7.62x39 round , it was cheap . You could get a SKS a for 150 or less , ammo was 50 bucks for a sealed 1000 rounds ... Those were the days of cheap fun .
I have the SKS in Chinese , Yugo and Russian are nice firearms for what they are , Russian are a nicer firearm .
I had a 7.62x39 upper on one of my AR15 and it was ok but just a odd duck , my favorite is the Robinson Arms VEPR ... Seems everyone selling a AK adds the vepr title of there gun sales ... Most are junk .
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Old December 19, 2013, 11:05 AM   #33
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Quote:
- SKS -Yugo
I'd rate the SKS at the top. I love my SKS. very reliable, has yet to choke up on me, and extremely accurate for an old warhorse using poor ammo. it also feels the most like a rifle in my hands.

Quote:
- VZ-58/VZ-2008
the VZ58 has a cult following around the US. I've shot a couple 58s and handled a 2008 recently. my concensus is that they are about as innaccurate as most AKs, minute of man but definitely nothing to brag about. the side folder stocks that they are so fond up just magnify the light recoil of 7.62x39 into something that I would compare to a sporterized M44 with the metal buttplate still installed. the controls are a lot better than on the AK though but the ergos still need a lot of work.

Quote:
- AK47 (MAK90 Pre-Ban 1994)
I owned an AK for 3 years... tried my damnest too like the piece of garbage but despite everything I did too it to make it more comfortable or more accurate it was always subpar. I sold it for a loss 3 months before the buying frenzy last winter... talkabout a hasty decision. Mak90s have a better reputation but without any real trigger time on one myself I don't feel like upping it's standing in my list.

Quote:
- New Ruger Mini 30
I have no experience with it so I default to last place.
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Old December 19, 2013, 12:06 PM   #34
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I like the gas system and lighter weight of the AK's but the SKS is the overall winner IMO.
I have several variations in stock and modified. Built like a tank/ tough as nails. I just wish I would have taken a good friends advice about them in the '80's. I like most looked at then like cheap surplus junk. Couldn't be more wrong. Except the inexpensive part. They're not cheap. To make a new gun today of same quality would be at least $700 range.
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Old December 19, 2013, 02:08 PM   #35
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In my opinion, it depends on whether you're a "good shot". If you are and you expect to hit what you aim at, don't expect to be happy with the average mil-surp(Combloc type) semiauto. If you're only a mediocre shot, you may get hits that would have missed with a reasonably accurate rifle since the wibbles and wobbles counteract each other.
In other words, those commie designs are intended to provide a lot of outgoing bullets from poor shots-some of which might hit the enemy. If you get hit, it makes little difference whether the shooter was actually aiming at you or not.
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Old December 19, 2013, 10:40 PM   #36
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I know this is all opinion, but I'm not sure how one can make this claim, when by his own admission, he has no experience with the VZ-58 (a well-made well-designed, accurate and very well-finished rifle)or an AK that wasn't "low end". There is a vast range of AKs out there, and the MAK-90 is considered by many to be one of the better ones.
Hence why I said I have no experience with the VZ-58.

The MAK-90 is equal or inferior to the SKS in almost every way and cost twice as much money. Why pay more and not get more?


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Old December 20, 2013, 02:10 AM   #37
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The ones in my family were a used ('03) Mini 30, common Chinese SKS and recently a Yugo M59 SKS in excellent condition-has No gr. launcher.
The only ammo has been Wolf and Monarch. The SKS ergonomics appeal to me much more than any AK clone.

Maybe the new Mini 30s have more luck using Russian ammo. Every forty or so rds. a second pin strike was needed. It also had a misfeed about every 40-60 rds., but these were polymer Promags. Various Mini 14 and 30 magazine issues are covered at "Perfectunion".

If you somehow decide on the SKS type, you might find the Yugo's 59 series preferable to the longer, very common 59/66. "SKSboards" is a primary source.

Last edited by Ignition Override; December 21, 2013 at 01:33 AM.
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Old December 20, 2013, 03:54 AM   #38
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Old December 15, 2013, 11:59 PM #5
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As he stated, I love my AR in 7.62X39.

I had a Ruger Mini-30, and it was junk. Now please understand, I love the fit, feel, and function of the Mini-14/30 series rifles, BUT the accuracy was terrible. I buy a rifle for accuracy. When a rifle has worse accuracy than a 12 guage rifled slug, its not worth keeping. I had the opportunity to sell my Moni-30 for 3 times what I paid for it, and sold it. I still have a Mini-14 and will keep it because of how it handles. Accuracy at its best is about 5 inches at 100 yards (I've had it since 1976).

My AR in 7.62X39 is very accurate even with the surplus Wolf ammo, mainly I feel because it has a 0.310" diameter bore which is properly sized for the Russian ammo. I have over 7000 rounds of ammo originally purchased for $67/1000, sure wish I had purchased a semi load at that price.

If you were only shooting the Americanized version of 7.62X39 ammo with a 0.308" diameter projectile, a different properly sized barrel would be required.
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Old December 20, 2013, 02:25 PM   #39
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1. AK47 Polytech, Pre-89 (true pre-ban)
2. New Ruger Mini 30
3. VZ-58/VZ-2008
4. MAK90 Pre-Ban 1994
5. SKS -Yugo

That's about how I'd rank them.
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Old December 20, 2013, 08:51 PM   #40
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i'd say if you want a 7.62x39 the AK is the best option out of anything as everyone already knows how well they are built, operate in any condition and pretty much unbreakable.

I have a bushmaster AR in this chamber which has been very good to me and has never given me any problems. Now that its been out for a few years now, they are getting the magazine situation figured out
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Old December 21, 2013, 12:28 AM   #41
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i liked my sks as it was unstoppable like a steam roller.

I have an AR upper in 7.62x39 and I like it as well.
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Old December 21, 2013, 01:38 AM   #42
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YankeeIronSights:
On second thought, if your firm objective is to own a rifle in this chambering, but perhaps don't already have a heap, my advice is to order a case(s) of ammo before even buying the rifle.

Based on info at "Gunbot", some prices for Russian ammo today are similar to what they were in Sept/October '08. Many of us will never need to 'sweat' the next sudden panic.

Last edited by Ignition Override; December 21, 2013 at 01:48 AM.
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Old December 21, 2013, 12:42 PM   #43
bjw741
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Why not include a Saiga Sporting Rifle on your list?

[IMG][/IMG]

Typically less expensive that the cheaper AK variants and can easily be converted to an AK style later if you want.
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Old December 21, 2013, 03:49 PM   #44
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Having had an SKS (and have recommended them to many others) and owned a Norinco preban AK47 (which I regret selling), My opinion is the only 7.62x39 semi auto worth owning now is the SIG, second generation 556R.
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Old December 21, 2013, 07:32 PM   #45
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I had a Yugo SKS and Saiga conversion. If I had to do it over again it would be a VEPR or VZ. I eventually wized up and got an AR.

Why?

I can reload for it and don't have to rely on imported ammo which may or may not eventually turn the gun into a paperweight once the ammo gets banned.
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Old December 22, 2013, 11:16 AM   #46
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Quote:
The MAK-90 is equal or inferior to the SKS in almost every way
Um yeah. Whatever you say.
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Old December 22, 2013, 01:37 PM   #47
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Why not include a Saiga Sporting Rifle on your list?
The reason it's not on my list is because its receiver is only 1mm thick. Rinky-dink compared to Polytech's stamped receivers that won't crush, bend, break, warp or holes enlarge.
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Old December 22, 2013, 01:52 PM   #48
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Norinco & Poly Tech stamped receivers are stout.
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Old December 22, 2013, 06:16 PM   #49
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Um yeah. Whatever you say.
What exactly would you say it does better for over twice the money?

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Old December 22, 2013, 09:02 PM   #50
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I went with the CZ VZ58. It locks open on the last round, is light weight and very reliable. It's the only 7.62x39 I own.
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