The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Handguns: General Handgun Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old December 12, 2013, 07:29 AM   #1
mes228
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 19, 2005
Posts: 611
Speer Gold Dot -Police, For Practice Only

I have a couple of large (I think 350 round in each box) of Speer Gold Dot .40 cal ammo purchased at a gun show. It is labeled "for Practice Only - Not For Carry". Why would it be labeled that way? I can see no difference between that ammo and my carry Gold Dots. It's very accurate, functions flawless - and I can tell no difference in firing.I have no chrono so do not know if it's loaded weak. Would appreciate any info about this ammo.
mes228 is offline  
Old December 12, 2013, 09:13 AM   #2
Destructo6
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 18, 1999
Location: Nogales, AZ USA
Posts: 3,808
It may have been tested and rejected for duty carry by Speer or the ordering agency. Maybe it's perfect, or maybe there was 1 failure in 1000.
__________________
God gave you a soul.
Your parents, a body.
Your country, a rifle.

Keep all of them clean.
Destructo6 is offline  
Old December 12, 2013, 09:59 AM   #3
Archie
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 26, 2000
Location: Hastings, Nebrasksa - the Hear
Posts: 2,100
In the Marine Corps..

Any lot of ammunition with more than a certain number of misfires or failures to fire per a number of rounds (somehow, three misfires in a 1000 rounds sticks in my head, but that seems rather high) results in that lot of ammunition being withdrawn from serious use and reserved for training.

Nothing 'dangerous' in the sense of blowing up, it just doesn't work enough.

At one time there were accuracy standards as well, but most of those were dropped during the Vietnam War. I haven't kept up to know if they were reinstated. That could apply to police departments, but typically handgun ammunition is fired at a close enough range where accuracy standards are fairly generous.

So shoot up the ammo, just don't rely on it for self-defense. Maybe put a box away somewhere safe and dig it out in twenty years to see if a collector is interested.
__________________
There ain't no free lunch, except Jesus.
Archie

Check out updated journal at http://oldmanmontgomery.wordpress.com/
Archie is offline  
Old December 13, 2013, 08:47 PM   #4
NYPD13
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 10, 2008
Posts: 345
In my agency, during requalification we administratively unload prior to gun check by the armorer. After removing our magazines we rack and lock the slide letting the chambered rounds fall to the ground.
These loose duty rounds are collected by the range for practice/testing/etc. I suspect this is how your perfectly fine "practice" Gold Dots were aquired.
I can see them being labeled as such since they are not from the same lot and may have been exposed to the elements, so there dependability may not be as guaranteed as originally boxed by the manufacturer.
__________________
"THE CONSTITUTION ONLY GIVES PEOPLE THE RIGHT TO PURSUE HAPPINESS, YOU HAVE TO CATCH IT YOURSELF." ~BENJAMIN FRANKLIN.

Last edited by NYPD13; December 13, 2013 at 08:58 PM.
NYPD13 is offline  
Old December 14, 2013, 01:49 AM   #5
5Wire
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 13, 2008
Posts: 256
That stuff was selling around her for $36 for a (repackaged) box of 250 rounds years ago. I don't remember exactly but evidently there was a lot-measured failure of some ridiculously low number (1 in 40,000 sticks in my mind) and the contract run was rejected, I bought fifteen or twenty boxes of it, shot it up and had no failures at all.
__________________
5Wire
(Bob)

We must all hang together, or assuredly we shall all hang separately.
5Wire is offline  
Old December 23, 2013, 10:55 PM   #6
rock185
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 2, 2001
Location: Out West
Posts: 284
mes, I'm a little late on this, but will share what I know. I used a few thousand rounds of the 9MM +P version, packaged loose in 250 round boxes. I never experienced an issue or failure of any kind while using this in different pistols, revolvers and cabines. Wish I'd bought a ton more of the stuff. I chronographed it, and found it displayed the same ballistics as any of the regular production Speer 124 Gold dot +P ammo. I researched it at the the time and, IIRC, during manufacture, a slightly different primer was integrated into production. While there were no known failures, when discovered, Speer realized they could not warrant the ammo to LE as performing as with the previous primers. They then packaged it in bulk, with the not for LE use disclaimer, and sold it as practice ammo. It was not scavenged duty rounds, etc. All I bought was was as clean, bright, factory fresh as any purchased in the regular 20 or 50 round boxes would be. While all of mine was the 9MM +P version, I remember seeing the .40 S&W and Non+P 9MM versions being available at the same time...
__________________
COTEP 640, NRA Life
rock185 is offline  
Old December 23, 2013, 11:14 PM   #7
Hook686
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 22, 2005
Location: USA The Great State of California
Posts: 1,945
Gold Dot bullets do not make Speer manufactured ammunition. Who manufactured the rounds?
__________________
Hook686

When the number of people in institutions reaches 51%, we change sides.
Hook686 is offline  
Old December 24, 2013, 12:43 AM   #8
5Wire
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 13, 2008
Posts: 256
Other way around, Speer makes God Dot and made the ammo discussed in this thread.
__________________
5Wire
(Bob)

We must all hang together, or assuredly we shall all hang separately.
5Wire is offline  
Old December 24, 2013, 12:54 AM   #9
Water-Man
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 23, 2008
Location: N. Georgia
Posts: 1,575
Sounds like Lawman ammo.
__________________
PROUD TO BE A VETERAN
Water-Man is offline  
Old December 24, 2013, 01:03 AM   #10
James K
Staff
 
Join Date: March 17, 1999
Posts: 19,658
For obvious reasons, ammunition manufacturers do not test fire every round they make. They do spot check each lot (a quantity defined by the manufacturer) and if they find some specified number or percentage of failures*, the whole lot is condemned. But the ammunition already made represents a lot of money, so unless the ammunition is dangerous, it is not destroyed, it is sold off as for range use only, boxed and labelled as such. In spite of that, the actual failure rate will be very low.

*Tests involve breaking down the test ammo, so rejection might not involve actual failure to fire; it might involve a light powder charge, improperly sealed bullets, etc.

Jim
__________________
Jim K
James K is offline  
Old December 26, 2013, 08:35 AM   #11
biohazard313
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 16, 2013
Posts: 128
^^^ this
biohazard313 is offline  
Old December 26, 2013, 03:23 PM   #12
jmr40
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 15, 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 6,023
That ammo was all over the place a few years ago. I cannot verify this, but was told it was part of a large LE contract. The ammo for some reason did not meet specs. Nothing wrong with it, just not made to the specs the customer ordered. Or so I was told.

I bought these several years ago dirt cheap. forgot the price, but they shoot great for me. I've shot about 1/2 so far with zero malfunctions and I get about 1250 fps from my G-19. I shot up a box of the 40's a few years ago too. No chronograph at the time so I don't know the actual speed.

jmr40 is offline  
Old January 9, 2014, 01:27 AM   #13
armsmaster270
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 25, 2008
Location: California
Posts: 1,948
I bought 1,000 rounds of 357sig ammunition like that, no missfires.
__________________
http://www.armsmaster.net-a.googlepages.com
http://s239.photobucket.com/albums/f...aster270/Guns/
Retired LE, M.P., Sr. M.P. Investigator F.B.I. Trained Rangemaster/Firearms Instructor & Armorer, Presently Forensic Document Examiner for D.H.S.
armsmaster270 is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:23 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.11995 seconds with 7 queries