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Old November 24, 2013, 08:09 PM   #1
Duzell
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want some advice on semi auto building

odd title i realize, but a thought occurred to me to start building one of these m16 variants from the ground up.

all i need to purchase is the receiver and then i can go from there, i have heard people do this before but wanted advice and thoughts.

i was looking into the ar 10 which uses the 308, but im worried about jam or missfeed issues. and wanted some advice or caliber or models i should look into
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Old November 24, 2013, 08:31 PM   #2
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Wow. You really need to do some research. This question is so vague and uninformed that it cannot possibly be answered.

http://www.reddit.com/r/ar15/comment...valent_basics/

You really need to tell us what your plans are for the rifle, what your budget is, what components are important to you, etc. No one here reads minds.
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Old November 24, 2013, 09:23 PM   #3
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AR building is relatively easy and fun. Get a stripped lower. If you're wanting a .308 your pretty much limited to that. If you get a 5.56/.223 sized lower, you can go with multiple calibers by switching uppers later on.

To keep it simple, lets say you build an AR 15 in 5.56- get your lower, an LPK (lower parts kit) and an upper, or buy a rifle kit and your lower.
There are many good tutorials online about how to build your lower. It is easy to do with very few tools or even no tools like me if you've done a few.

As a beginner you could have one built in 30 minutes. If you buy a complete upper you just attach it when your lower is done.

You should not have any worries about jams, misfeeds, etc. as long as you have a comparable gas tube length and buffer and spring; ie. carbine length buffer/tube/spring, rifle length, mid-length, etc...

If you build an AR 10 for the .308 it's all the same but much more expensive.
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Old November 25, 2013, 01:24 AM   #4
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I guess the first question is: What do you want to use this gun for? Will it be for home defense? Bench shooting? Hunting? 3 gun? Plinking? Duty Rifle? This board will be able to give you lots of help, but due to the versitility of the AR platform, we need to know what you want to do with it, before we can help you.
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Old November 25, 2013, 01:40 AM   #5
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Quote:
kokopelli wrote:
AR building is relatively easy and fun. Get a stripped lower. If you're wanting a .308 your pretty much limited to that. If you get a 5.56/.223 sized lower, you can go with multiple calibers by switching uppers later on.
Actually you have lots of chambering choices if you use the larger receiver. You are only limited by the size of the magazine that will fit into the magazine well. The problem with the larger receiver is that there is no standard, so there is no guarantee that an upper from one manufacturer will fit on the lower from another manufacturer.

My recommendation is that you study up on the DIY section over at ar15.com, and once you have digested that information, ask your specific questions here. Another recommendation is that you buy parts from a supplier of known quality, like Palmetto State Armory, Bravo Company, or Stag Arms.

It's a fun project, and gives you an intimate understanding of how the platform works.
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Old November 25, 2013, 05:11 AM   #6
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whichever route you go. i wish i would have went withe the 80% reciever and done it myself. just something nice about having a legal untraceable ar. my distrust of the gov grows everyday. but its only viable if you have access to a drill press.
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Old November 26, 2013, 05:51 PM   #7
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I'm sorry I sound vague and general. I'll try to restate what I previously said in a more understanding manner.

I have semi autos and bolt rifles. I'm looking to start a build project of a new rifle from the ground up. The Ar variant is a stable and strong platform from which a person can build a gun from just the lowest components.
My favorite round to shoot is the 308 win. I do not have 223 but I have shot some, I would prefer a 308 caliber rifle as I don't want to have to swap parts around to get another bullet variant. From my understanding th Ar 10 is the version designed to handle the 308. Win. I amasking what is the name of the actual rifle part I must purchase from an ffl dealer. And from that were can I get the remaining parts to assemble and build the Ar 10.

What parts are recommended and what brands are available to choose from. Or am I in error and there is another semi auto I can buy and build that will fit this caliber. I'm planning for it to be semi auto and go out 100-300 yards.
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Old November 26, 2013, 06:21 PM   #8
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I would look into the new Colt 308 personally. since you can install the normal AR15 uppers into it as well if u choose later. not really building but just a suggestion.

AFAIK the AR10 isnt being made anymore and alot of the new 308/7.62 ARs are reworked and each have alot of proprietary parts or mags and what not. they are not as clean cut as AR15s in parts interchangeability.
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Old November 26, 2013, 08:05 PM   #9
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Duzell,
building an AR15/10 is a lot like big boy legos. there are a lot of different brands(lego, megablok, ETC) likewise there are a lot of AR makers(Colt, DPMS, ETC). I have two ARs that are both home builds. it can get a bit cunfusing but for the most part if you get decent parts from a reputable company you'll be golden. there are no real feed issues to worry about with the AR10, no chronic problems really. one thing I might point out though is that you are able to build more than just 308 AR10s. I know you have an M1A so it's probably a little more desirable but you can do anything that is based on the 308 case like 243 win, 260 rem, and 7mm-08. given the better ballistics of 6.5mms and 7mms over 7.62s I would love to get a 260 rem build going but that's just personal preference.

the big difference is DPMS style AR10s and armalite style AR10s. not all parts are interchangeable like the AR15. most out there are DPMS styled but that is probably because most are either remington, bushmaster or DPMS and all three companies build in the same factory. I believe Larue is also a DPMS styled AR10. DPMS would be your cheapest parts, larue would be your best quality. Remington and bushmaster are the same as DPMS but with name brand price hikes, I would stay away from them personally.

good luck in your build.
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Old November 26, 2013, 10:47 PM   #10
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- when you build an ar 10, the parts are not interchangeable between the companies? im not sure which company i should go with. is this different with the ar15. im really not familiar with the AR's at all , and im unsure of the variations i can get in calibers or how i can "swap" calibers as stated above

-i wanted 308 as its a round i have most abundant ammo for (surplus wise) , but i am not familiar with those variations of the cartridge


-so if i went the Ar15 route what calibers are available? i checked at my locl shop and they have a RGUNS AR-15 Stripped Lower Receiver OD Green Aluminum.
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Old November 26, 2013, 11:21 PM   #11
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it's not that every company makes a different kind of AR10 it's that DPMS had to change a few things to get around the armalite patents and most everyone else went with the DPMS design so they wouldn't have to pay royalties to armalite... or so I've been told, who knows if it's true. the big thing to remember is that the majority of parts available are only for DPMS pattern AR10s rather than armalite AR10s(DPMS has to call them LR308s legally).

ar15s are a completely different ballgame. unless you buy something that was cobbled together in someone's garage out of old beer cans and scrap steel then everything fits everything else, regardless of make. there are so many calibers available for AR15s it's not even funny but to name a few:
22lr
221 fireball
5.7x28FN
5.45x39mm
7.62x39mm
223 rem/5.56x45mm/223 wylde
300 whisper/AAC blackout
300 fireball
6mmTCU
6x45mm
6.5 grendel(next on my list if I ever decide to build another one)
6.8 SPC
7mmTCU
450 bushmaster
458 socom
50 beowulf
9mm luger
40 s&w
45ACP

and those are just the ones I can come up with off the top of my head. there are more than likely dozens more I forgot or have never heard of.

in most cases with ARs, you have two take down pins that hold the upper reciever assembly(which includes that barrel, handguard and bolt carrier group) to the lower reciever(which includes the trigger group, buffer group, pistol grip and buttstock). simply pull those two pins and strap an upper half to the lower receiver and you've effectively changed the caliber of the rifle. it would be a simple matter for me to change my 5.56mm AR15 to 5.7x28mm or even to 50 beowulf in a couple minutes assuming I had the upper halves for those laying around. not all calibers are that simple, pistol calibers like 9mm require some changes to the buffer, hammer and magazine well so it's best to have a dedicated rifle for calibers like those.
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Old November 26, 2013, 11:25 PM   #12
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First, understand that when you say "AR10", you are talking Armalite. "AR10" is Armalite's trade name. Armalite is still making AR10s. No one else makes a true "AR10" unless they license it from Armalite.

Second, because there is no military specification and general military issue of AR style rifles in 308 Win/7.62 NATO, various companies have taken liberties with the design details, such as how the upper and lower fit together, and the magazine well dimensions. In general, it is wise to buy your upper and lower from the same manufacturer to avoid any complications in this area. Also, you might want to do a little research on which magazines can be used in the lower receiver. For instance, Magpuls will not fit in the 308 RRA lowers. But the RRA lowers will take [slightly modified] FAL magazines, which is very appealing to someone like me who owns a truckload of FAL magazines.
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Old November 26, 2013, 11:30 PM   #13
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RRA is kindof goofy like that, their 7.62x39 AR15s also take AK47 mags... they look goofy as heck. they are kindof out there in terms of almost having an entirely different model from AR.
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Old November 27, 2013, 04:24 PM   #14
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ok so its vast and confusing , i think ill look into the 5.56x45mm as it will allow me to shoot the 223 as well correct?
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Old November 27, 2013, 04:43 PM   #15
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affirmative ghostrider. another plus for the AR15 is that it's a lot lighter than the AR10 as well.
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Old November 27, 2013, 04:57 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FALPhil
First, understand that when you say "AR10", you are talking Armalite. "AR10" is Armalite's trade name. Armalite is still making AR10s. No one else makes a true "AR10" unless they license it from Armalite.
Well, to be fair the term "AR-15" is still licensed to Colt: nobody else can use that name unless they license it from Colt.

But I understand what you're saying: with Armalite it's more than just a name copywrite issue, they still have patents on the AR-10 design, whereas Colt doesn't hold any patents on the AR-15 design as far as I know.
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Old November 27, 2013, 06:23 PM   #17
Duzell
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ok so far im leaning toward the ar 15 in 5.56/.223

i went to my local gunshop and played with a few lower ar 15 receivers. one had a DTI with a triangle and it looked a lot like the military version(black) 170$. whereas this other one i was handed to look at, had solid trigger guard and a beefier magazine lip (thicker) in metalick green(270$), i did not see this ones brand.

i was looking color wise @ either tan or black. i just want a low cost ,aluminum forged receiver , that does not have the trigger guard,and is reliable.

any suggestions?
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Old November 27, 2013, 06:48 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duzell
i just want a low cost ,aluminum forged receiver , that does not have the trigger guard,and is reliable.
For the most part, all forged lower receivers are pretty much the same. And as far as reliability, that's probably the LEAST important part of the rifle.

When I pick a lower receiver, I'm worried far more about color match; my latest build has a Mega lower and an LMT upper. Unfortunately I didn't notice that the lower is slightly darker than the upper; it really is noticeable under florescent lighting. But otherwise they work great together.
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Old November 27, 2013, 07:15 PM   #19
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if all you want is a decent low priced lower, I highly suggest palmetto state armory.
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Old November 30, 2013, 06:26 PM   #20
Duzell
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i was hoping to get a forged aluminum receiver in black, DTI wont ship to CA apparently. i was wanting one with the open trigger guard so i could put one in with a wider opening then the fixed ones.
which was why i was looking at dti.
lower


im a little annoyed, i was brushed off by a new salesman at my local store, when talking about buying a receiver. he sold the one i had on hold, as "it was the last one they had" to someone else even though it still had 5 hours on the hold(24 hour hold). needless to say im going elsewhere with my money.
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Old November 30, 2013, 07:26 PM   #21
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I'm going to pass on the good advice that I was given. Go to YouTube & type in "Building an AR 10". Then watch all the videos that interest you. Once you get into the thick of it, search this forum with your questions & if you don't find what you're looking for, post it. Shooters love their AR's & there is ottsa knowledge here & out on the web!

FWIW...

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Old December 1, 2013, 05:17 PM   #22
Duzell
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i also noted now that DTI does not ship to california

the gunshop is out of ar 15-10 lower receivers and wont order me one for some reason. new sales man in store, and i couldn't talk to my dads friend the manager, who hooked me up with the howa gk.

i also ran across something called the kel tek su-16 CA. its completed and can be bought for 554$, under rail front stock instead of the odd bipod id just get the stock front it has. im just really looking for a semi auto that is affordable and is CA approved, the push button on ar 15/10 is a little annoying and this gets around that
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Old December 2, 2013, 06:31 PM   #23
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anyone know anything on the su 16 from keltek, i note i can get a ar stock on it after i buy one and a alternative front rail , but any thoughtss on its performance and range?


also what companys make a good ar 15 lower that i should keep my eyes open for ?
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Old December 2, 2013, 07:19 PM   #24
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it doesn't have the greatest reputation. kel tecs often need a little bit of gimmickry and special attention to ensure that they work well out of the box, or at least their handguns do anyway. they leave lots of debris left over from the manufacturing process and mix it with their packing grease which makes for a nasty mess of reliability killers. accuracy is nothing to write home about with most. if you want a semi auto 223, the AR15 is the best way to go and there are a number of ways to make them cali legal, you just have to find a shop that gives a damn about their customers or a manufacturer that isn't afraid of california voodoo.
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Old December 3, 2013, 07:14 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tahunua001
if all you want is a decent low priced lower, I highly suggest palmetto state armory.
THIS ^ ^ ^ ^

Get on Palmetto State's emailing list for daily deals and you will find very good parts at highly competitive prices. My experience was they were a bit slow shipping BUT that was when the craziness hit us all so the fact I got stuff at all was amazing. Check it out... Palmetto State Armory.
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