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Old November 12, 2013, 07:31 AM   #26
HALL,AUSTIN
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I feel like if 6 .357 isn't enough either I missed or I was way too outnumbered.
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Old November 12, 2013, 08:05 AM   #27
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How many shots, of what, is enough for concealed carry self defense? What say you and why?
There's no one-size-fits-all answer.

For me, even five in a j-frame revolver is enough. But I'm not wealthy, a celebrity, or a public figure. I'm not involved in law enforcement or other risky business. I don't dress like I'm rich or drive a new expensive vehicle. And I'm bigger than the average guy. All that makes me an unlikely target, so an attacker would most probably see me as a "target of opportunity" and not someone he's been planning to mug. No group of gangbangers will be coming after me for my goods. I feel comfortable with as few as five 38spl rounds.

Everyone needs to do an assessment of their situation and prepare accordingly.
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Old November 12, 2013, 08:16 AM   #28
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We were advised to get CHLs because of a stalker at the time. We were advised to be ready to empty the mag, reload and empty another mag if necessary due to the stalker's motivation and penchant to vicodin addiction. So in our instance, 30 is enough.
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Old November 12, 2013, 10:43 AM   #29
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American citizen living in Guatemala City, Guatemala, Central America:

1. I CC a SW442 (in repair due to a squib) which carries five rounds of .38 Special along with one speed strip and one speedloader.

2. The B-T.380 with 5+1 in the gun with two extra magazines each with 5 rounds.

3. The CD M-5 in .45 with 10+1 in the gun and an extra magazine with 10 rounds.

4. The DP-51 is carried with 10+1 in the gun along with an extra magazine with 10 or two magazines with 10 each.

Having listed all this, the answer to your question, I believe, is simple; gun carry rotation and situation will determine what is enough.

BTW: nice thread topic.
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Old November 12, 2013, 12:36 PM   #30
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Currently I carry an 11 shot 45 on my right hip and an extra mag on my left. I don't think I need that much but I really like the pistol and it happens to hold 10+1. The mag on the other side just makes weight feel more balanced (Yes, OCD is hard to live with). But I never felt the least bit undergunned when I was carrying a 5 shot .357 for many years. Strange I never had to carry a reload in the left pocket. The only time I ever felt undergunned was when facing a rather ugly pitbull and all I had between it and my great dane was a keltec .32 and that had nothing to do with number of shots.
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Old November 12, 2013, 01:03 PM   #31
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5 or 7 depending on which gun I carry. You can pretty much forget surviving a fire fight with a handgun. If there are more than 2 bad guys you're most like a goner.
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Old November 12, 2013, 02:00 PM   #32
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Posted by RBid: A 5 shot J-Frame is plenty for the average DGU. A person could carry one and be well prepared for most cases.
Are you referring to the mean, mode, or median?

Encounters involving two or more violent criminal actors are probably more likely than those involving one; one shop stops are not something on which to bet; and shooting at rapidly moving targets is difficult.

Using JohnKSa's assumptions, that J-Frame gives one three chances out of one hundred to prevail, and that may be best case.

John's analysis led me to retire my J-Frame from primary carry the summer before last.
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Old November 12, 2013, 02:03 PM   #33
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I agree with the opinion of our own Art Eatman:

Quote:
If you ever have a real need for more than a couple of magazines, your problem is not a shortage of magazines. It's a shortage of people on your side of the argument.

Personally, I typically carry no reloads. Occasionally, for no reason whatsoever except that I feel like it, I carry one spare mag. NY compliant Glock 33
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Old November 12, 2013, 02:47 PM   #34
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How many shots is enough?

However many end up being enough. *shrug*

For most of us on a day-to-day basis, the answer is zero.

There is no real upward limit to the possibility, although the higher the number, the more absurd the situation you would need that number for becomes.
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Old November 12, 2013, 03:15 PM   #35
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For me....99% of the time I carry a 1911 in .45 acp ....( with 8 + 1 )....so 9 rounds is plenty ....and once in a while I'll carry a Sig 239 in .40S&W ( with 7 + 1 ) ....and once in a while I'll carry a K frame revolver in .357 mag with 6 rounds...( so for me, 6 to 9 rounds is plenty )....

( and I shoot 10 - 12 boxes a week ...for Tactical practice / so I'm pretty confident in my ability to put shots on target - fairly quickly and "tactically accurate" which I think is center chest ( nipple to nipple -- and down to belly button in a rectangle )...

I practice mostly because I like shooting ...and maintaining my skills with handguns ...

In my opinion - its Defense !! .../ not a shootout at the OK Corral.../ statistically, it'll be over very quickly with only a few rounds fired.
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Old November 12, 2013, 03:36 PM   #36
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Normally I carry a double derringer in .38spc loaded with .38 s&w long, so it is easy to controle very precise. Sometimes I carry a Walther PPK in .32ACP if I wear a jacket.
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Old November 12, 2013, 04:13 PM   #37
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A few years back I went from a J-frame with a spare speed loader to a G26 with a spare 12-round mag in my pocket. My reasoning went like this: I read somewhere that cops had a hit rate of around 20%. (I know the figure is debatable, but I am telling you my reasoning at the time). That would mean that I should expect on average just one hit from my J-frame. But at the same time, we say that handgun rounds are not reliable one-stop shots. So on average, I couldn't expect to stop anyone by shooting the J-frame empty.

I know there are gaps in that logic, but even if I increase my hit rate substantially, or get a magic one-stop shot, I am not allowing for a second BG, and I am not allowing at all for being on the bad end of the bell curve with my hit rate or my stop rate. So I started carrying more rounds.

Is it enough? Not going to be sure until something happens, and that is the conundrum that is essential to these discussions. My current carry is comfortable, and I hope it to be adequate if a need arises. That is about as much as I can say.
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Old November 12, 2013, 04:35 PM   #38
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'Tis all a matter of which statistic we want to believe.

According to the NRA's Armed Citizen analysis, in 482 incidents, only 3 required reloads and one of those was to kill a lion with a .32 caliber revolver. The average and median number of shots fired was 2 and "When more than 2 shots were fired, it generally appeared that the defender's initial response was to fire until empty."

Logically, putting the "when more than 2 shots were required.." and "reloads were required in 3 incidents" statements together, the implication is that the reloads only happened when the defender fired until empty and the likelihood is high that the only times more than 2 shots were those 3 incidents.
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Old November 12, 2013, 04:52 PM   #39
Derbel McDillet
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It depends.

For example, if I'm going to a movie theater or shopping mall then I carry a Glock 19 or 27 with a standard capacity magazine and a Glock 17 magazine in a magazine carrier on my belt. The Glock 19 is my preferred general-purpose carry gun and I carry it whenever I can.

Other times, depending on the level of risk and/or a need for greater concealability, I carry a Kahr PM-9 (7 +1) or Seecamp 32 (6 +1) with a spare magazine.
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Old November 12, 2013, 04:53 PM   #40
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Depending on dress, weather, and situation, I have several guns of varying capacities and calibers that I classify as "carry guns." However, the majority of the time I carry, and feel quite comfortable, with a five-shot .38 Special revolver and an addition five rounds in a speed strip. Is it the ideal setup for fighting off multiple attackers? No, it probably isn't but then again if I'm attacked by multiple armed people willing to brave gunfire in order to accomplish their goal I will, in all probability, run out of time and distance long before I run out of ammunition regardless of the capacity of my handgun.

While capacity is certainly an attribute that should be considered, it isn't the only piece of the puzzle nor, in most cases, the most important piece of the puzzle. For me, the other positive attributes of a small revolver outweigh its limited capacity.
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Old November 12, 2013, 07:10 PM   #41
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Seriously?

When defending your life or that of your family should there be a set limit how many shots you can have. NYC's 7 shot limit is a slap in the face to the people who live there and the Bill Of Rights.
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Old November 12, 2013, 07:11 PM   #42
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When defending your life or that of your family should there be a set limit how many shots you can have.
NO!
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Seams like once we the people give what, at the time, seams like a reasonable inch and "they" take the unreasonable mile we can only get that mile back one inch at a time.

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Old November 12, 2013, 07:17 PM   #43
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When defending your life or that of your family should there be a set limit how many shots you can have. NYC's 7 shot limit is a slap in the face to the people who live there and the Bill Of Rights.
It's a state law and the question as presented has precisely -ZERO- to do with that law or any legal limits of any kind.
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Old November 12, 2013, 07:21 PM   #44
Glenn E. Meyer
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If it is single mugger day who flees at the gun - 0 rounds.

If the Black Swan drops you into a Mumbai or Navy Yard - then you might want some more.

Practically - a semi and one extra mag should cover enough of the incident intensity distribution but you never know.

As pointed out, many gun folk think the mean is what always happens.
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Old November 12, 2013, 07:55 PM   #45
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Capacity

I'm no expert in firearms or combat arts. But do have (worthless) opinions. Seems to me in perceived life and death confrontations, the Police have been known to fire an incredible number of rounds. Sometime with very few hits. Not all Policemen are horrible marksman. So I suspect something else enters the equation. Perhaps it's Adrenalin stress and fear, leading to firing quickly and point shooting. I doubt most of us would do any better if our lives were on the line. I've killed about 40 deer and have gotten pretty keyed up in that non life threatening situation. It's all supposition until the balloon goes up. I personally prefer higher capacity to lower capacity. That's why I do not carry a 1911. I carry a 16 round .40 caliber.
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Old November 12, 2013, 08:05 PM   #46
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I recall a teacher of mine, who happened to be a Captain of Detectives, talking about how many rounds do you fire..."As many as it takes to stop the threat." Arm yourself with something you're prepared to shoot with and do so accurately.

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Old November 12, 2013, 08:34 PM   #47
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Having a gun is the most important thing.
92% of defensive gun uses end without a single shot fired. A large majority of the other 8% use 3 shots or less.

If you're going to carry a derringer 100% of the time, that's a good gun. If you're going to carry a 6 shot revolver, even better. If you're going to carry a "baby" Glock with a small magazine, it'll get the job done. But I see no reason not to keep a 33 round happy stick in your car too

But I say the 5 shot snubby you carry 100% of the time is better than the full size double stack 9mm you carry 80% of the time. So it's a personal balance. Some people will carry the full size every day, and more power to them.
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Old November 12, 2013, 09:09 PM   #48
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I must think that the answer is 7+1 and 8 on standby, since that is the personal norm.

Rapid deployment and marksmanship would be huge factors in answering the primary question of what is needed to stop an attack. I suspect some of the CHL holders I know would be under gunned with a couple of 33 round magazines or even an M61 Vulcan. Do they really expect to hit a "target" when they shoot a pistol once or twice a year on good years when Jupiter aligns with Mars? I digress.

There are some times, when work sends me into less desirable environs, that normal carry is swapped out to 9mm XDm with 19+1 and a backup magazine.
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Old November 12, 2013, 10:37 PM   #49
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I thought about this after reading the thread. I think you never know. You never know what situation you might find yourself in. I think as many as you can carry is what you should have. 2 scenarios -
1. Suppose you are a woman and walking alone at night going to your car in the public garage and say 6 men surround you with bad intentions - how many cartridges you think you would need?
suppose you only had a revolver with 6 cartridges, would you say that would be enough for the lady?
2. let us take the example of the Indian girl who boarded the 'rape bus' with her boyfriend at night and the bus had what? 5 or 6 bad guys who attacked her and her boyfriend. Forget the cartridges, she did not even had a gun.
Now how many cartridges would you say she might have needed to stop the attackers, supposing she had a gun?
I think you never know and you should have as many as you can carry. But it also depends on how good you can shoot, shoot good under stress.
that is my humble opinion.
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Old November 12, 2013, 11:01 PM   #50
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Honestly in those two scenarios if the attackers are dead set on pressing on after the first shot it isn't going to matter much how many shots the lady has. Short of Bruce Willis there aren't many folks out there with the skills to take down 6 attackers.
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