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Old October 21, 2013, 09:50 AM   #1
IdahoCarry
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Open Carry vs Concealed Carry - a comprehensive response to critics

Open Carry vs Concealed Carry

I prefer to Open Carry because MOST studies show that criminals will avoid armed persons. I also Open Carry because it often generates positive constructive discussions wherever I go, which advances our mission to promote our 2nd Amendment rights and naturalize the presence of guns in our communities.

45 states allow Open Carry and every day, 10’s of thousands of Open Carriers are repelling bad guys across this nation and rarely if ever do you hear of those Open Carriers having to shoot anyone because criminals don’t attack citizens they know are armed.

I do not Open Carry where it is illegal or where my situational awareness is impaired, like movie theaters or concerts where there is continual close contact with other participants, and where seating is tight such as amphitheaters, sporting events, race tracks.

I would not Open Carry In high crime areas. A lion would not walk into a den of hyenas and I would never Open Carry in the high crime neighborhoods of Chicago, New Orleans, Detroit or Washington DC. I never want to challenge a criminal’s area of dominion; that task is for law enforcement officers.

Yielding to wisdom and prudence dictates whether I Open or Conceal Carry.

However, I am always uncomfortable Carrying Concealed because it presents to the criminal that I am unarmed, weak and vulnerable; attractive to the predator.

There is no deterrent value to my carrying concealed. I am just another gazelle in the eyes of the hyenas. My probability of being a victim of a crime is totally unchanged when I have a gun hidden beneath my shirt.

My Open Carrying gives the criminal the opportunity to make a well informed decision; an opportunity not provided by me when I Carry Concealed.

Robbers, rapists or carjackers might be dumb and opportunistic, but they all have the instinct for self preservation. Outside of his den, a hyena will not attack a lion. To the bad guy, Open Carry portrays you as the lion with very sharp teeth that the hyena wants to steer clear of.

I don’t want to be the victim who fought back and won. I don’t want to kill anyone. That is why I Open Carry. My goal is never to be a victim in the 1st place. I want to watch the 6 O’clock news and not be the topic of the news.

When I leave my home whether I’m Open or Concealed carrying, some of my primary goals are:
• To go about my tasks peaceably
• To not be a victim of any crime
• To avoid shooting anyone – ever – when possible

In a Concealed Carry state, the bad guys always have to be wary, their situational awareness is more highly motivated than yours so the likelihood of you getting the drop on them is slim. They weigh the odds and proceed and watch for those who might be Concealed Carrying.

Ask yourself this, if you are the target, when the bad guy’s attack you, will you have time to draw from your concealed position, maybe, but probably not.

ALL OF THE STUDIES show that criminals avoid armed people – so – do you want to appear armed or appear unarmed as Concealed Carriers do?

Remember, just like you, I don’t want to be a victim and I don’t want to shoot anyone, ever, if I don’t have to. And, not becoming a victim is exponentially more probable if I Open Carry by making it clear and obvious that I am armed.

When the bad guy sees something that can quickly and painfully change or terminate his life, his sense of self preservation tells him to move on.

It is a fact, Open Carriers create a circle of deterrence.

If you are a jogger or bicyclists on the greenway, and you are seen carrying by a bad guy, you not only protected yourself and those around you, you probably protected that path from that bad guy ever attacking anyone there because he will associate that path as dangerous to him.

Not only do we create a deterrent circle around ourselves, but around every person who is within that circle, within that restaurant or within that store. That circle of deterrence has a ripple effect on the bad guys too because they warn their buddies about those locations.

It is important to realize that violent crime does not begin at the moment a bad guy confronts you with a weapon.

Crime and violence take time to develop and there are five distinct stages: intent, interview, positioning, attack and reaction. The first three are most severely affected by those who Open Carry:
1. Intent, which develops when the criminal observes easy prey.
2. Interview , when he verifies the area is free of danger and creates plan.
3. Positioning, when he sets up for the attack.

If a bad guy sees an Open Carrier in any of the first three stages, in all probability, he will abort and find a weaker target unless it’s a drug crazed or mentally ill person.
Concealed Carry presumes it is better to wait until the opponent has drawn his gun in the attack stage and then try to “fix” the situation. It is foolish to think that it is better to stop a crime in the fourth stage than to prevent it in the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd stage.

Concealed Carry has no effect in the first 3 stages, but if an Open Carrier is seen by the bad guy in any of the first 3 stages, the crime is probably deterred.

Some critics of Open Carry claim that an Open Carrier will be the first one to be shot when a robber walks into a 7-11. There is no evidence that this has ever occurred; this is a red herring.

When a robber sees an Open Carrier, they change their plans. In most cases, he is not prepared to commit murder or jeopardize his life when all he wanted to do was to get some cash. Self preservation demands that he abort and find a less risky victim.

Another common criticism of Open Carry is that the firearm itself will be the target of theft, prompting a criminal attack simply to get your gun away from you. With only one exception in 2010 when an OCer failed to heed prudence and OC’d in a high crime area, there is no evidence that an Open Carrier has ever been targeted just to rob him of his gun; another red herring.

Very often someone critical of Open Carry will cite some example of a uniformed police officer whose gun was taken by a violent criminal and yes, that does happen, but more than likely it occurred either because the officer was targeted merely for being a police officer, not for his gun. Most often, when guns are taken from police officers, it occurs when they are struggling to restrain a criminal.

As to how the general public responds to Open Carry, 99% of the responses I’ve received have been positive and the other 1% were not negative, just skeptically inquisitive. This is the common experience with every Open Carrier who treats Open Carry as a personal responsibility to win the hearts and minds of those who are indecisive about the issue or slightly leaning in the other direction.

There are some who are just afraid of guns for a variety of personal reasons; however, fear is overcome by natural exposure in everyday situations. Fear diminishes when firearms are carried in a responsible and peaceable way by the average citizen and the fearful will recognize that their fear was based on emotion and not fact.

Open Carry is a very effectual way of helping people overcome fear of guns if done wisely with prudence. Arizonans don’t look twice at Open Carriers in their state and they are a great example of people becoming accustomed to guns and accepting them as a natural part of their society.

A common complaint is that Open Carry makes some people uncomfortable. Liberty trumps comfort and censuring freedom is the beginning of oppression, which leads to persecution.

Abraham Lincoln said, “Our defense is in the preservation of the spirit which prizes liberty as a heritage of all men, in all lands, everywhere. Destroy this spirit and you have planted the seeds of despotism around your own doors.”

The Open Carried gun is “Assault Prevention Insurance” and most people will eventually become comfortable with it when they realize that they are safer because of its practice.

There are some people I’ve spoken with who claim to want to have the tactical advantage of surprise.

Why would anyone want to try to fight their way out of a bad situation, jeopardizing themselves and anyone with them when the bad situation can be avoided entirely by Open Carrying?

Let me tell you, if anyone is going to be surprised, it is you.

The likelihood of you surprising a bad guy is very slim and the likelihood of the bad guy getting the drop on you is practically guaranteed.

You seldom know that you are going to be a victim until you are face to face with someone pointing a gun at you.

You will have no time to quick draw or do anything but comply with the bad guy’s demands.

Surprise as a defensive tactic is often based on unrealistic or ill thought out scenarios.

I’ve had 6 guns and a knife pulled on me when I was a process server and not in any of those incidents could I have defended myself.

Most criminals don’t draw their weapon until you are too close to do anything other than comply.

The simple truth is that while surprise is a superior tactical maneuver, it is exclusively an offensive action not a defensive one. Defensive surprise is no more than damage control, and a last ditch effort to fight your way back out of a dangerous situation.

If you shoot anyone - ever - you lose! Why?
• You too could be shot, maimed or killed.
• You will almost always lose financially, paying for defense lawyers and/or civil suits. You don’t want to be another George Zimmerman who has paid hundreds of thousands of dollars defending himself.
• Shooting someone or seeing them shot stays with you forever –
you never forget blood, guts & death. My time in Vietnam and on the LAPD has shown me that you remember every single dead or bloody body.

Surprising an attacker with a gun invites a gun fight. Quite frankly... I'd prefer the bad guy be "surprised" to see my openly carried gun and decide not to attack.

We want everyone to feel safe and comforted by our presence when we Open Carry, so dress nice, smile at everyone, be courteous and if questioned about your gun, be prepared with responses that are friendly and educational, i.e., “My family loves me and they want me to come home safely to them every night.”

Tailor your responses to your situation and personality but always remember that your goal is to win the hearts and minds of the persons you are talking to and anyone listening on the periphery. Never be angry or confrontational. Every Open Carrier should an ambassador for the 2nd Amendment!

The truth is that each day thousands of citizens in this nation Open Carry. They represent hundreds of thousands of man hours of peaceable, friendly, patriotic Open Carrying conducted continually in all but five states.

Open Carry is a right, and it is lawfully exercised everyday by responsible gun owners. Remember this; “A right not practiced will be lost.”

Although I Open Carry as a deterrent and self defense, equally, if not a more important reason for me is to naturalize the presence of guns in our community and promote our rights under the 2nd Amendment.

Concealed Carrying does little to promote the 2nd Amendment when you are in public unless you start the conversation. OC almost always encourages pro-gun discussions.

Other than Boston in the 1770’s there has never been a time in this nation’s history when we have been confronted with so many in the government who want to take our guns. They are continually positioning themselves to limit or destroy our inalienable rights and Open Carry is a visible wall of resistance to them.

Open Carry sends a message to ant-gun elected officials and all of the anti-gun media and anti-gun groups that most Americans are patriotic pro-gun; pro-constitution and pro- 2nd Amendment – and our rights will not be infringed.

Open Carry is a symbol of freedom;

It is the American Flag.

It is kryptonite to the bad guys.

It is the first responder.

It is the bold, beautiful face of the 2nd Amendment.

Tony Snesko, Founder
Idaho Carry, Open & Concealed
Tony@IdahoCarry.org
(Some of the points in this paper were contributed by Mainsail and other proponents of Open Carry and firearm publications.)

Last edited by IdahoCarry; October 24, 2013 at 09:59 AM.
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Old October 21, 2013, 10:01 AM   #2
precision_shooter
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The good thing is, there is a choice to open carry or not.
Welcome to the forum!

You will get a host of opinions on the subject of open vs concealed carry, but you know what they say about opinions...
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Old October 21, 2013, 10:05 AM   #3
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I don't necessarily disagree with this. The element of surprise can give you a tactical advantage BUT one of the reasons this country is so gun ignorant is that law-abiding gun owners have hid in the shadows pretending no one owns or is carrying a gun. Now two generations later, carrying a gun seems eccentric or dangerous to most younger citizens. We became the new "don't ask, don't tell" minority. Being polite has gotten us no where. The loudest ones with the biggest megaphones seem to always win all the political battles.
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Old October 21, 2013, 10:15 AM   #4
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I support the right to open carry, but in my opinion it's a bad idea both tactically and socially. I think it hurts our cause and helps those who seek to take away our 2nd Amendment rights.

Tactically, I prefer not to draw attention to myself. Sure, there is definitely a deterrent effect, but there is also a target effect in the right situation. More importantly, concealed carry allows me to chose when (and if) I'm involved in a situation; if I'd rather try to escape than engage a threat I have more freedom to do so. When you're open carrying, you might not be able to make that choice so easily.

I grew up in a high-crime urban area. Avoiding being a victim of crime has very little to do with carrying a gun and everything to do with situational awareness and keeping a low profile. That's why I choose to carry concealed.

And I think open carry activists have drastically hurt our cause, especially in many of the more anti-2nd Amendment urban areas around the country. Rallies like the one at the Alamo and the Starbucks sit-ins just scared and angered many of the people that might otherwise not be against us.

I live in a mostly anti-2nd Amendment city in an open carry state. I can promise you that open carry activists as a whole are drastically hurting our cause. You can advocate open carry all you want - and you yourself might be a positive influence for 2nd Amendment rights - but the movement as a whole definitely isn't.
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Old October 21, 2013, 10:21 AM   #5
KMAX
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Kind of lengthy, but well worth the read. Very interesting points made here. I live in one of those 5 states that do not allow open carry. I wish they did if for no other reason than making it easier to dress for carrying and less problem of accidental exposure, not that it is something I worry a great deal about anyway. My concern is that there are some I fear that would strap on their guns and go to town like Wild Bill H. I know some people that ignorant. I agree that a person open carrying in a responsible manner could be a positive ambassador for our cause, but I also believe that fools open carrying could be very detrimental.
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Old October 21, 2013, 10:28 AM   #6
Frank Ettin
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You make a bunch of unsubstantiated claims. You really need to back up your claims with actual evidence. For example:

Quote:
Originally Posted by IdahoCarry
...EVERY study shows that criminals will avoid armed persons....
What studies are these? Where are they published? Who conducted them? How were they conducted?

Quote:
Originally Posted by IdahoCarry
...every day, 10’s of thousands of Open Carriers are repelling bad guys across this nation...
Evidence?

Quote:
Originally Posted by IdahoCarry
...ALL OF THE STUDIES show that criminals avoid armed people...
Again, exactly what studies, published where, conducted by whom and how?

Quote:
Originally Posted by IdahoCarry
...When a robber sees an Open Carrier, they change their plans....
Evidence?

Quote:
Originally Posted by IdahoCarry
...As to how the general public responds to Open Carry, 99% of the responses I’ve received have been positive and the other 1% were not negative, just skeptically inquisitive...
How do you define "response received"? Do you mean an actual comment or question? If so, what evidence do you have of the attitudes of others who might observe you but don't say anything?

Quote:
Originally Posted by IdahoCarry
...This is the common experience with every Open Carrier who treats Open Carry as a personal responsibility to win the hearts and minds of those who are indecisive about the issue or slightly leaning in the other direction...
Provide actual evidence that this is the case. Provide actual evidence that the open carrying of firearms actually positively influences the public as a whole.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IdahoCarry
...Open Carry is a very effectual way of helping people overcome fear of guns if done wisely with prudence...
Provide actually evidence this is true.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IdahoCarry
...Arizonans don’t look twice at Open Carriers in their state and they are a great example of people becoming accustomed to guns and accepting them as a natural part of their society...
So what? Why can that be extrapolated to the entire nation?
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Old October 21, 2013, 10:37 AM   #7
aarondhgraham
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I just can't make myself do it,,,

I just can't make myself do it,,,
It's been legal in Oklahoma for almost a year.

The first day I strapped on a western rig,,,
I open carried to the Mini-Mart,,,
About a 10 minute walk.

I have never been so self-conscious in my life.

So later that week I tried open carry with a S&W Model 36,,,
I strapped it on and went to Wal Mart for my groceries,,,
Even though it was small and no one said anything,,,
I still felt very conspicuous and wasn't comfy.

I'm glad it's legal in my state,,,
Because accidental printing and brandishing citations,,,
Are now things of the past so I can conceal a bit more casually.

But I will continue to conceal,,,
I'm comfiest when I'm invisible.

Aarond

.
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Old October 21, 2013, 10:48 AM   #8
KMAX
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Quote:
The first day I strapped on a western rig,,,
I open carried to the Mini-Mart,,,
I could never do this.

Quote:
So later that week I tried open carry with a S&W Model 36,,,
I strapped it on and went to Wal-Mart for my groceries,,,
This I could probably do.

Quote:
I'm glad it's legal in my state,,,
Because accidental printing and brandishing citations,,,
Are now things of the past so I can conceal a bit more casually.
Exactly why I would like to see open carry legalized in TX.
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Old October 21, 2013, 10:56 AM   #9
Glenn E. Meyer
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Frank is a lawyer, I'm a trained social scientist. He hit it - claims without evidence do not advance our cause.

Concealed carry permits are supported by analyses such as those of Gary Kleck and other scholars. Without strong evidence, such claims aren't that useful.

I suggest the OP follow Frank's suggestion and return to the fray. If he does not and it is a one time post - and then a vanish from TFL, it isn't useful.
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Old October 21, 2013, 12:18 PM   #10
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Quote:
As to how the general public responds to Open Carry, 99% of the responses I’ve received have been positive and the other 1% were not negative, just skeptically inquisitive.
Frank touched on this, but I also need to set you straight here. There are many people who respond very negatively to open carry, but they're not going to say anything in your presence. Why? Because you're the guy with the gun.

What you hear is only part of the story. I've heard complaints about the practice, and quite a few from gun people. Just because nobody's said something to you doesn't mean they're not talking about it.

Quote:
A common complaint is that Open Carry makes some people uncomfortable. Liberty trumps comfort and censuring freedom is the beginning of oppression, which leads to persecution.
This is actually a counterproductive mindset. Make people uncomfortable enough, and liberties can be lost. Consider California. Or Starbucks.

Quote:
Other than Boston in the 1770’s there has never been a time in this nation’s history when we have been confronted with so many in the government who want to take our guns.
What about 1968? 1993? Trust me, it's been way worse than it is now.

Quote:
They are continually positioning themselves to limit or destroy our inalienable rights and Open Carry is a visible wall of resistance to them.
Again, I've seen no evidence of that. We have the rifle-toting crowd mill around our capitol building sometimes, and the feedback I've heard from legislators has been that they consider it quaint as best and proof of their contempt for guns at worst. I have never heard anyone, politician or citizen tell me that open carry convinced them of anything.

Quote:
Open Carry sends a message to ant-gun elected officials and all of the anti-gun media and anti-gun groups that most Americans are patriotic pro-gun; pro-constitution and pro- 2nd Amendment – and our rights will not be infringed.
No, what sends the message is people who actually get involved. That means contacting legislators, organizing initiatives, writing letters, making phone calls...all the not-so-sexy stuff. That's where change comes from.
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Old October 21, 2013, 12:48 PM   #11
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Responding to your questions

I doubt seriously that anyone would have made it through my lengthy post had I added the references and explanations you are requesting. It may take a few days but I will begin taking bites from this elephant later this week after our Idaho Carry monthly meeting that will occupy most of my time through Thursday.

Thank you for the invitation to respond, I look forward to the debate.

Always Carry!

Tony Snesko, Founder
Idaho Carry, Open & Concealed
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Old October 21, 2013, 01:02 PM   #12
IdahoCarry
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I overlooked your last statement.

You said, "No, what sends the message is people who actually get involved. That means contacting legislators, organizing initiatives, writing letters, making phone calls...all the not-so-sexy stuff. That's where change comes from."

My new website, www.2ndAmendment2014, should give you some indication of how involved I am in Idaho gun issues.

I lived in Washington DC from 1995 to 2010 and then moved to Idaho. Discovering that we did not have a statewide gun organization, I founded Idaho Carry, Open & Concealed. We found that some of our counties and cities were enacting anti-gun policies and we confronted them and each and every one has either changed those laws or eliminated them. We actively promoted and saw passed legislation that took all rights from cities to regulate guns and left it entirely up to the state.

We have 5 pieces of pro-gun legislation that we are promoting this year with more on the way because it is our intention to see that Idaho becomes the most gun friendly state in the nation and that we elect only those who actively support the 2nd Amendment.
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Old October 21, 2013, 01:34 PM   #13
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Quote:
It is a fact, Open Carriers create a circle of deterrence.
Quote:
ALL OF THE STUDIES show that criminals avoid armed people – so – do you want to appear armed or appear unarmed as Concealed Carriers do?
Quote:
Some critics of Open Carry claim that an Open Carrier will be the first one to be shot when a robber walks into a 7-11. There is no evidence that this has ever occurred; this is a red herring.
Need evidence? Here is evidence the robber doesn’t even need his own gun in the first place...
Not one, but two murders committed by a gun snatched from an OC'er... neither of which would have taken place if it werent visible and an opportunity provided.
That particular episode speaks volumes for keeping your gun concealed.


Quote:
Open Carry sends a message to ant-gun elected officials and all of the anti-gun media and anti-gun groups that most Americans are patriotic pro-gun; pro-constitution and pro- 2nd Amendment – and our rights will not be infringed.
I totally disagree. It's very possible that OC'ing will encourage them to work harder to infringe upon 2A.

While I appreciate your participation and lengthy efforts in creating the OP, and I normally despise thread closures and deletions, even I cringe at the copious amounts of conjecture, assumptions and rhetoric passed off as fact in in this thread starter.
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Old October 21, 2013, 01:53 PM   #14
Glenn E. Meyer
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The studies should be in reputable criminological sources. Anecdotes will not cut it. Also, the number of incidents is as of yet very small.

The places where open carry is allowed may have demographics that preclude using OC as a casual factor.

We do know that in CA, OC led to a tightening of the laws.
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Old October 21, 2013, 02:30 PM   #15
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Quote:
Rallies like the one at the Alamo and the Starbucks sit-ins just scared and angered many of the people that might otherwise not be against us.
Those are probably the same people that would vote against us and write letters to the editor regardless.

As to the comments about looking at what CA has done, that's a spurious argument at best. CA is an aberration from the rest of the country's values and their actions shouldn't be held up as a model for anything.
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Old October 21, 2013, 02:36 PM   #16
Glenn E. Meyer
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So Idaho is thus a model for the whole country?
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Old October 21, 2013, 02:40 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Revoltella
Quote:
Rallies like the one at the Alamo and the Starbucks sit-ins just scared and angered many of the people that might otherwise not be against us.
Those are probably the same people that would vote against us and write letters to the editor regardless...
Provide evidence. In fact, that's not necessarily true.

The Open Carry demonstrations in California angered my wife. She is a shooter, a hunter, an NRA certified instructor and an NRA Life Member.

I continue to be dismayed by the failure of so many in the RKBA community to recognize the importance of positively influencing public opinion or to have any real clue about how to determine how to go about doing that.

During the course of my career I've had a pretty fair amount of experience working with business clients who needed to be able to influence public perception, understand how to make advertising effective and find the best ways to effectively communicate their messages. When a lot was at stake, they didn't just guess.

They didn't assume that their audiences would think the ways they did or have the same values and perceptions. They consulted with psychologists and others who have studied human motivation and perception and beliefs. They thoroughly analyzed the demographics of the audiences and tried to understand what they cared about, what they were scared of, what made them happy or feel secure, what they believed and didn't believe.

They also tested their conclusions with surveys and focus groups. They paid attention to what was happening and made adjustments in their messages and techniques if things weren't working the way they wanted them to.

And I strongly suspect that our opposition is doing at least some of those things.
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Old October 21, 2013, 02:51 PM   #18
manta49
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I suppose it depends on where you live open carry here would just identify you as a target. I think in some circumstances it would just guarantee that you were the first to get a bullet. Take the mall shooting Kenya for example if as reported the shooters carried out surveillance before the attack all open carrying would have guaranteed is they would have being the first shot. Concealed carry would have given the person carrying a choice if to shoot or when to shoot.
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Old October 21, 2013, 03:09 PM   #19
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I'm sorry, but opinions on the best way to carry, from people that live where carry of any kind is a pipe dream isn't really helpful.

And just for the record, I don't open carry. But that's just a choice I've made that works for me, for now. I don't have the issues like many who conceal carry seem to ave with those that choose open carry. I thought the OP made some very valid points, lack of evidence notwithstanding.
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Old October 21, 2013, 03:14 PM   #20
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In ancient times when dinosaurs raomed the earth and I was a lad, it was extremely common to see people with long guns in pickups, in the woods-hunting, or out on the ranch where they were isolated. You never saw someone toting a shotgun in a store or such nonsense because they would be viewed as not right in the head and horribly rude.

With rights come responsiblity and we often see RKBAers forgetting that as much as the gimme crowd.
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Old October 21, 2013, 03:17 PM   #21
Glenn E. Meyer
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There is concealed carry in CA. Depends on locale.

I have deleted a personal attack. If the proponents of a position feel that they must resort to such, I will:

1. Close this thread
2. Ban the poster.
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Last edited by Glenn E. Meyer; October 21, 2013 at 03:50 PM.
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Old October 21, 2013, 03:43 PM   #22
manta49
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Quote:
I'm sorry, but opinions on the best way to carry, from people that live where carry of any kind is a pipe dream isn't really helpful.
Wrong do you think that its just America that people carry firearms. Its not a pipe dream plenty conceal carry here. And as I said open carry is not allowed simply because it would identify you as a target. That's here in America I would think it would be up to the individual what is best for them for their defence, and not to make a statement.
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Old October 21, 2013, 05:35 PM   #23
Frank Ettin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Revoltella View Post
I'm sorry, but opinions on the best way to carry, from people that live where carry of any kind is a pipe dream isn't really helpful. ....
On the other hand, an unsubstantiated opinion from an anonymous denizen of cyberspace whose background, training and experience are unknown is pretty meaningless.

Now if you want to know something about me, see my profile.

Also, I do carry a gun whenever I legally can, such as on my fairly frequent trips to Nevada. Or when I travel to Arizona to, for example, go to class at Gunsite or help Massad Ayoob teach a class.

Last edited by Frank Ettin; October 22, 2013 at 01:24 PM. Reason: Add links to articles and correct typo
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Old October 21, 2013, 05:39 PM   #24
Tom Servo
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Quote:
Those are probably the same people that would vote against us and write letters to the editor regardless.
Perhaps, but it doesn't help when we give them the impetus and motivation to go home and do so this afternoon.

The problem is this: open carry is hurting us on the public-relations front. Sure, some guys will say, "well, it was the guys who acted like jerks in one situation, but that's not us."

Wrong. It is us. It's all of us. Most of the population isn't all that involved in the gun issue. When they think of the gun people, they think of one monolithic group. They don't see the distinctions we make (sometimes to our detriment) between skeet shooters, hunters, competition shooters, or political advocates. To them, those are all the gun people.

This is why we have to police our own. The guy who shot up the stop sign on Route 4? The gun people. Those guys who shot the sacred white elk? The gun people. David Kokesh? The gun people.

They don't see a distinction between the guy strutting around Starbucks with an AK-47 and the well-mannered guy openly carrying at a political rally.

We'll either get this or we won't. The question is, how much damage will be done to our cause in the meantime?
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Old October 21, 2013, 06:29 PM   #25
Warrior1256
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I CC because I do not like the attention open carry gets.
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