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Old October 19, 2013, 07:58 PM   #1
blackwaterstout
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First conceal carry pistol. Need some info

I know there are plenty of conceal carry threads but was hoping to get a bit of insight in regards to my situation. A little bit of my background with guns. I've been a long time shotgun and rifle owner as I'm an avid hunter. I only own one handgun which is a CZ-75BD Police 9mm. The gun is perfect for me and I couldn't be happier with it. It's built well, feels great in my hand, and has never misfired. I trust it to protect my family and it's the gun I keep in my nightstand with Hornady Home Defense rounds.

I've recently taken a conceal carry class and submitted the paperwork at my local sheriffs office. Should be legal to carry in 2-3 weeks. I'm looking at getting another handgun that will be a little more practical to carry instead of my CZ. I do have fairly large hands but I'd like something smaller that is easier to conceal. I've read a lot of conceal carry threads and online articles related to favorite CC guns. I know this is highly subjective because everyone has their own allegiances and preferences. But I've kind of picked out 4 guns I'd like some comments on.

Honestly I'm leaning toward another 9mm but maybe even a .380. I'm not worried about big bore guns. I just want something comfortable, reliable, and reasonably priced. I've held all 4 guns I'll list but have never fired any of them. All of these felt good in my hand.

Springfield XD-S in 9mm - This gun really felt good in my hand and considering it's popularity its easy to find holsters and accessories. I did read where there was a recall on some of the older models but I assume and new one I'd purchase would not have the issue related to the recall.
S&W M&P9c in 9mm - This gun also has a good feel to it. Sounds like it's good quality and have read lots of good comments on it.
S&W Bodyguard 380 - Had a pretty good feel to it. Kind of ugly but that really isn't important. The built in laser seems like a nice concept to help keep size down but not convinced it's that great of quality. The .380 is intriguing since it's something I don't don't currently have. I haven't read as much about this gun so I'm curious what everyones experience has been with it. Nicely priced as well so easy on the wallet.
Walther PPK .380 - I played with gun when I stopped at Cabelas and even with big hands it felt quite good in my hand. I have to admit a part of me is fascinated with this gun simply because I've been a James Bond fan my whole life. I know that's a silly reason to choose a handgun but from everything I've read this gun is a great shooter and a very reliable weapon. Would also be nice to have a stainless steel handgun.

Another thought of mine is that my wife way soon be learning to shoot and taking a gun safety course. She's shot my CZ before and it's a little too large in her hands. Any gun I decide on for CC may be used or passed on to my wife if it fits or feels good to her.

So if any of you have experience with some or all of these handguns I'd like your comments on the pros and cons of each gun and ultimately what you'd recommend. Thanks.
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Old October 19, 2013, 08:54 PM   #2
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If those are my 4 choices, I'm going with the Springfield XD-S9 - with little hesitation. I would have considered the Smith M&P9 except is has a mag safety - which I don't care for. And the Springfield has the striker indicator - which I really like.

My two pennies' worth.
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Old October 19, 2013, 09:20 PM   #3
ParabellumJ
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First conceal carry pistol. Need some info

Out of the four choices it's a no-brainier for me. The M&P 9c hands down.

My understanding is Springfield still hasn't figured out how to fix the XDs, and I am not a fan of the grip safety (i.e. I hate it).

No matter what anyone says, 380 isn't an effective self defense round. It's better than nothing but if you can carry a larger caliber you should.

The S&W M&P is a great gun. Reliable, affordable, feels great in your hand. My personal preference is Glock, but the M&P is a close second for me. Easy choice.
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Old October 19, 2013, 09:44 PM   #4
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Out of those choices i would go with the M&P 9c. If you like your CZ you might look at a CZ P-01 or PCR. My P-01 feels just as good as my full size CZ's but is a lot lighter and smaller to carry!
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Old October 19, 2013, 10:29 PM   #5
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Okay another subjective opinion. Completely disregard any thoughts of .380 doing anything for you. I carry M&P 45c and DO trust my life to it, so my recommendation among your options is M&P 9c.

There is no reason I can think of, no practical reason and no technical reason, to carry a wimp-ass cartridge. Carry something that has demonstrated sufficient oomph in real scenarios, or in scenarios you believe to be real. In my mind witha world full of hopped-up tweakers and folks who could give a rat's $$$ if you live or die, 9mm is the absolute minimum and ypu better have a bunch of 'em.

Go real or go home. 9mm is barely making it in my book and my personal comfort level is that 40SW is just good enough. What I know from 10,000 rds of shooting is that the M&P series consistently gets 'er done. If you're comfortable with 9, then go 9. If you're comfortable with 380, I think you have a research problem.

Your adversary is not going to be You. It's going to be someone who is utterly unlike you. In really unimaginable ways. I carry 10mm because I believe I know who these people are--in many cases I've seen here where I live, they are not fitting into the category of 'people' at all.
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Old October 19, 2013, 11:34 PM   #6
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I agree that 9mm is the right choice (I don't agree that it is a bare minimum choice, but that's an argument for another thread). Of the items listed I'd go with the M&P.

If you're open to more suggestions I'd lookup a walther PPS.
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Old October 19, 2013, 11:38 PM   #7
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Not to get into the caliber wars, so I will stick to the ones you listed.
For 9 mm try handling a Sig P938 and for .380 try the Sig P238. See if you know anyone that have these and will let put a few rounds thru them so you can see how they feel & shoot in your hands.
Both are smallish slim comfortable CC pistols. And both have a wide variety of holster styles and Manufacturers.
But as a 1911 snob, my opinion may be biased.
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Old October 20, 2013, 12:02 AM   #8
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You should look at 380 also. Their many people that carry them and was pretty common in old days late 1900's for carry and self defense. I carry 380 a lot also 9mm and 45 . 380 over 100 yrs old must worked at some time or another At least before the internet started any way. Don't tell any one ,but a great many people in this country carry a 32 auto .They just don't want to admit it.
Their 9mm and 45 are either in car or at home.
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Old October 20, 2013, 06:36 AM   #9
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Look at the M&P Shield as well


Its an awesome CCW piece
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Old October 20, 2013, 09:09 AM   #10
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Thanks so much for the replies. Thats good stuff. I looked up 2 additional guns that were mentioned in this thread. The Walther PPS and the M&P Shield. Both look very nice. Since I haven't handled either of those how would they feel when compared to say the XD-s or the M&P9c? From the specs the Shield is obviously smaller and has a smaller capacity. I really like the looks of the loaded chamber indicator available on the Shield.

That PPS looks really cool too. I hadn't read too much about it so it's new to me. Definitely fits the description of what I'm looking for.

Kind of surprised no one had any comments on the PPK. The one thing I like about it is the DA instead of the striker fire. I've never owned a striker fire gun. I realize all the others I mentioned are Striker fire and I guess thats a sign of the times.

One thing I do not want in my next gun is a decocker. I want something with a true safety
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Old October 20, 2013, 09:20 AM   #11
ParabellumJ
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First conceal carry pistol. Need some info

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackwaterstout View Post
Thanks so much for the replies. Thats good stuff. I looked up 2 additional guns that were mentioned in this thread. The Walther PPS and the M&P Shield. Both look very nice. Since I haven't handled either of those how would they feel when compared to say the XD-s or the M&P9c? From the specs the Shield is obviously smaller and has a smaller capacity. I really like the looks of the loaded chamber indicator available on the Shield.

That PPS looks really cool too. I hadn't read too much about it so it's new to me. Definitely fits the description of what I'm looking for.

Kind of surprised no one had any comments on the PPK. The one thing I like about it is the DA instead of the striker fire. I've never owned a striker fire gun. I realize all the others I mentioned are Striker fire and I guess thats a sign of the times.

One thing I do not want in my next gun is a decocker. I want something with a true safety
The PPK is a dinosaur. In my opinion, if it weren't for the James Bond movies it wouldn't even be in production. Nothing more than a collectors piece.

Watch this video. This guy knows more about firearms and self defense than most of us ever will...

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=O2TAu1D...%3DO2TAu1DD3Us
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Old October 20, 2013, 09:48 AM   #12
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First, please do not take this as disrespectful, but I would make a bigger commitment to myself than carrying a 380. 9mm is pretty marginal. What is your 40 in a 9mm sized gun experience? Ok, let's assume you go 9mm.

Kahr: Have you looked at the Kahr P9 or C9? These carry easy, have good triggers and are easy to shoot fast due to a low bore axis.

S&W J frame: A J frame is a small package which can deliver 5 357 mag or 5 38 spcl. This gun, due to it's grip shape, especially with boot grips will disappear on most people.

Glock 19: While I find the triggers not great, most shoot well and are easy to shoot and carry. They definately need to be in a good holster. No holster buying short cuts allowed!

BTW, I would not buy any of the guns you listed as my CCW. If they were my only choice, maybe the M&P C?????
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Old October 20, 2013, 09:48 AM   #13
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the xds is a great choice. the mp9c is a fine weapon, but nowhere near as concealable as the xds.

while i haven't fired the 9mm, i have fired the 45. the 45 has nowhere near the recoil you would expect from a 45. the ergonomics are great even for someone with large hands. i am 6'6" 280 and have no problem comfortably firing this weapon with the medium or large mag. the small, flush mag makes it a little more uncomfortable to shoot since i can't get all my fingers on it.

i have the walther pps 9mm on my hip right now. it is practically the same gun as the xds, to the point that i'd swear SA stole walther's designs.

you may have realized i didn't mention your other choices. i'm just not a fan of 380 for self defense.
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Old October 20, 2013, 11:09 AM   #14
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Re: First conceal carry pistol. Need some info

Quote:
Originally Posted by loose_holster_dan View Post
the xds is a great choice. the mp9c is a fine weapon, but nowhere near as concealable as the xds.
Really? I thought they felt comparable but didnt handle them at the same time. What about the shield? Is it closer to the size of the xds?
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Old October 20, 2013, 11:26 AM   #15
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Quote:
There is no reason I can think of, no practical reason and no technical reason, to carry a wimp-ass cartridge.
I'll give you one of each:

Practical: Nobody in their right mind wants to be shot with ANYTHING. When the gun goes off and even if they did not get hit, they are not going to question the caliber. ....and if they are not in their right mind, and determined to attack you, no concealable pistol round is going to guarantee a stop. Having a gun is the first rule of a gunfight.

Technical: .380's can be made smaller than 9mm. Not a huge amount, but smaller is smaller. Smaller is more concealable, and more likely to be carried: the .380 he has is better than the duty sized 9mm in the safe.

That said, I carry a 9.
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Old October 20, 2013, 11:34 AM   #16
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A quetion to the OP:

Do you shoot better SA or DA?

I know the 75B can be carried C&L ...... dunno about the 75BD- it has a decocker, yes?

I shoot a SA trigger much better than DA ..... and so am a 1911 guy ...... the SIG 238 and 938 would be on my list to check out, were I in the market.

I also like the Ruger sR9c..... best trigger of any plastic striker fired gun I've shot.
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Old October 20, 2013, 01:11 PM   #17
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First, do not buy a new design for at least a year or two. As you may know, the XDS 45 has been recalled and Springfield had no fix for the gun. They finally have a fix. Other guns have had recalls when they were released. This does not do you much good if you don't have the gun for awhile.

A gun that is 5.4" tall is a full sized gun. It is more difficult to conceal, as you well know. The key to carrying this gun is a heavy gun belt, a holster with forward cant and two spare mags on the other side to balance the rig. I have found that the Glock 19 size is very versatile at 4.75" tall. The Glock 26 at 4.17" tall is very, very concealable and any gun with a similar height will be just as good. The Browning High Power in 9x19mm is also exceptionally concealable due to the shape of the grip. The single stack guns conceal better, but six or seven shots goes very, very quickly.

The problem with going too small is the guns become difficult to shoot due to short sight radius and shorter grip. Capacity is also limited. The effects of recoil can be exaggerated. I think you will find guns such as the Glock 26, Kahr K9, Walther PPS, S&W M&P C, and Ruger SR9 C are very concealable while allowing the shooter sufficient gun to shoot well. Also, many of these guns accept full sized magazines or have longer magazines. You can use some sort of spacer to support more of your hand. I recommend against the very small guns such as the Kahr PM9, SIG P238, Colt Mustang, Ruger LCP and all small revolvers. Even the SIG P938 may be a bit small.



I typically carry my Glock 26 with a short 12 round magazine in the gun and at least one spare Glock 19 magazine with A&G Grip Adapter. The gun works well for 90% of my carry needs. It carries well strong side, in the appendix position, in a large pocket, or with SmartCarry.

Last edited by tomrkba; October 20, 2013 at 01:26 PM.
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Old October 20, 2013, 01:31 PM   #18
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The 9c is a great firearm if you don't mind the size compared to the XDS 9. The shield would be a better comparison, and at 125 bucks less it fits your needs.

9c, 40c, 45c 26/27/30 and such are just too thick for my personal tastes. That's why I don't own my 9c anymore. Good for wintertime carry, but just to big and bulky for shorts and a tee IMHO.

The laser on button on my brother bodyguard is kind of flaky but that doesn't seem to bother him he carries it everyday. It just doesn't offer enough over my LCP for me to make the switch like he did.
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Old October 20, 2013, 02:04 PM   #19
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First conceal carry pistol. Need some info

The XDS and M&P Shield are more comparable. The XD compact is more along the lines of the M&P compact size wise. I carry a M&P 9c everyday in a Blue Ridge Holsters CAMO IWB holster. It carries very very well. I carry a spare mag in my pocket. I know the shield would carry better but as others have said, single stack guns are empty quick. When i can empty a magazine of 12 rounds in just over three seconds (effective fire) I really feel undergunned with 6 or 7 rounds in the shield.

It's a personal decision I made for me based on my level of need in my career and lifestyle. If you are comfortable with single stack capacity definitely go with the shield over the compact. It carries more comfortably.
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Old October 20, 2013, 04:41 PM   #20
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Re: First conceal carry pistol. Need some info

Today I shot a 3rd gen Glock 19 and an M&P9. I wish I could have shot the M&P9c but it wasn't available. The Glock felt decent in hand. Didn't think it felt great firing though. I did like the quick tear down. I think the M&P9 felt great in hand. I think the 9C might be better for me than the shield but I won't know until I can see the shield in person.

A guy recommended a CZ P07 to me today. What are your thoughts on it? Looked it up online and it looked pretty nice. I've had good luck with my 75bd police.
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Old October 20, 2013, 04:56 PM   #21
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Re: First conceal carry pistol. Need some info

Quote:
Originally Posted by loose_holster_dan View Post
i have the walther pps 9mm on my hip right now. it is practically the same gun as the xds, to the point that i'd swear SA stole walther's designs.
Are literally that close? Any chance they would have the same issues that the xds has in relation to the recall?

Ill have a chance to hold a lot of handguns later this week at Cabelas. Ill try to get a look at the PPS and shield.
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Old October 20, 2013, 05:16 PM   #22
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I would carry the Cz.
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Old October 20, 2013, 05:57 PM   #23
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Quote:
Are literally that close? Any chance they <Walther PPS> would have the same issues that the xds has in relation to the recall?
The Walther PPS is a pretty well proven design now -- its been out for about 5 years or so. There was some scuttlebutt about early pistols and the slide release spring causing problems in a few pistols; I never had that issue myself, but apparently the spring and lever was redesigned and that issue no longer occurs for anyone. Today I'd wager the PPS is dead nuts reliable.

Last edited by kinoons; October 20, 2013 at 06:36 PM.
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Old October 20, 2013, 06:03 PM   #24
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There is no reason I can think of, no practical reason and no technical reason, to carry a wimp-ass cartridge. Carry something that has demonstrated sufficient oomph in real scenarios, or in scenarios you believe to be real. In my mind witha world full of hopped-up tweakers and folks who could give a rat's $$$ if you live or die, 9mm is the absolute minimum and ypu better have a bunch of 'em.
Oh boy.....
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Old October 21, 2013, 09:50 AM   #25
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the walther pps has been great. the similarities are in ergonomics and size. the internals are most likely different. the pps 9mm and 40 came first. the xds 45 came first. i doubt they were actually copying each other, or the calibers released would have been in the same order. i was just saying that to define how similar in size and feel they are.
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