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Old October 7, 2013, 10:03 PM   #26
Venom1956
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I've seen the gun.

There is definitely something outta spec. No AK I've ever tried charging with the safety on has cause the safety lever to hop the bolt and go up and over like you would to disassemble it... Even with the dust cover off mine doesn't do that. What jams this rifle up after it does that is the ambisafety on the left side gets caught and binds the safety and bolt.

A new dust cover with the stepped out portion should fix the problem... but it still stands that that shouldnt be needed. the safety seems to be cut in this / shape on his while mine is more of a (
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Old October 7, 2013, 10:19 PM   #27
Darker Loaf
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RE dvdcrr: Nope, I tried it. It's that whole milled vs. stamped problem. Otherwise, I'd have bought one in a hurry. I just don't want to drop $$$'s for something that would do the same thing as the one I have (with the milled ones that appear to be offered).
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Old October 8, 2013, 01:43 PM   #28
Venom1956
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This is a quote from Johnska on Loafs original thread. Probably the best way to word the issue.

Quote:
I think what he's saying is that if you pull back on the charging handle with the safety on, it jams the safety lever upward instead of the safety lever blocking the charging handle from moving fully rearward.
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Old October 9, 2013, 11:16 AM   #29
seanc
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I double-checked mine (VEPR) and took the top cover off and was able to manipulate the safety all the way up as you describe (can't do that with the top cover on). When I put it back down, it jazzed up the trigger springs and I had to fiddle with that to get it to function properly again. So, yes, I think that they mated yours with the wrong top cover.

As far as the selector being bent in and being harder to manipulate, I had to do the opposite and bend mine out to loosen up my selector some.
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Old October 9, 2013, 07:54 PM   #30
Darker Loaf
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RE Seanc: Yeah, that's how I feel. Arsenal says they replaced the safety on the first fix, and they said it has nothing to do with the top cover. So, I'm afraid if I send it back to them, they'll just dutifully replace the safety, and I'll be in the same boat.
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Old October 9, 2013, 07:57 PM   #31
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Arsenal: "Ok, I went back and looked at your e-mails and saw your video. I just want to make sure I am clear when I talk to the repair department, that it is not fixed. The dust cover has nothing to do with the safety and it’s action. I can see from their notes that they replaced the safety selection mechanism."
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Old October 10, 2013, 04:30 AM   #32
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I wish I'd seen this thread earlier. The cover for the milled receiver AK should definitely have an overhang that covers the top of the receiver by 3-5 mm all the way around (including the entire left side), except over the bolt and where there is a cutout for the safety, which rides in flush against the cover and is prevented from going up higher. It seem pretty obvious that Arsenal gave you the wrong cover. Minus the cover, the safety lever will continue to rotate 20-30 degrees on up. At least that's how it works on my milled Lancaster.

I don't get this whole "send it in for any problem" mentality. I think it pays to take a few minutes (or a day) to study the issue and understand what is actually wrong first. It's a whole lot easier to make a call and let them know you got the wrong cover (if you did), and ask for a replacement, than send in the whole rifle. That said, I would also say that it appears that you somehow bent the safety lever, allowing it to move past the lip on the cover. It's also possible that your top cover is not stamped to spec at that point and allows the extra rotation.

Quote:
the <end of the> safety <lever> seems to be cut in this / shape on his while mine is more of a (
also a valid possibility (and a problem if so, mine is also a ( to catch the bolt handle), but even so the cover should prevent the additional rotation.

Last edited by spacecoast; October 10, 2013 at 04:42 AM.
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Old October 11, 2013, 08:04 PM   #33
Darker Loaf
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RE spacecoast: Space Ghost, Coast-To-Coast

So far you are the only person (other than Venom 1956) who will entertain the idea that I have the wrong top cover. Thank you for making me feel less crazy.

I immediately thought it was the top cover, but Arsenal disagrees. I sent them video and pictures of the problem, as well as explaining it. I sent it in reflexively because I wanted to be made whole by the manufacturer, and I placed too heavy a respect on Arsenal. I think the turn around on my gun was too quick, like their repair department never looked at it said: "It's never the top cover!" or something, slapped a new safety in and called it good.

They still say it's not the top cover, and they think it's just a safety issue, so it makes me afraid that if I just send it back in, the same thing will happen and it will come back to me broken still.

What milled top cover could I try? I've had a hard time finding one. I've found plenty of stamped ones online, but very few milled that looked worth trying. Please link, if possible.
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Old October 12, 2013, 04:03 AM   #34
Darker Loaf
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Top cover solution?

Seems like this would "over hang" the safety as I want it to. Thoughts? Get this and a krebs safety? Would that work?

http://www.texasweaponsystems.com/id1.html
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Old October 12, 2013, 04:21 AM   #35
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Also sad, the Arsenal website: http://www.arsenalinc.com/usa/SAM7SF.html has pictures with a ribbed, articulated top cover that seems to cover the safety. Blaaaaarg. I wrote Texas Weapon Systems to see if their top covers are compatible. Would a Krebs safety work with my gun?
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Old October 12, 2013, 04:23 AM   #36
Darker Loaf
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Large picture of potential Krebs safety: http://www.krebscustom.com/mediacent...kVISafety2.jpg

Link to description of safety:
http://www.krebscustom.com/products/...eceiver-Rifles

This is the one for milled guns. I'm not sure it'd be compatible with my ambidextrous safety or not. And I'm not sure if the side folder would bump into, preventing folding. The plus side being that it seems like it is notched to "catch the action." NOTE: I'm NOT talking about the notch for holding the action open. Instead I'm talking about the "(" shaped notch at the tip of the safety that would prevent the action from moving backwards with the safety on and the top cover off.
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Old October 12, 2013, 08:00 PM   #37
spacecoast
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I've been tempted to buy the Krebs safety for the hold-back feature but have never sprung for one.

I know I suggested (but am not convinced) that maybe there are different covers for milled and stamped guns. It would sure be nice to have a look at your gun and see what's what.
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Old October 12, 2013, 08:46 PM   #38
Venom1956
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I believe there is a difference since the milled is thicker i think its wider. least my russian top cover wouldn't fit his. I will say the ambi safety is a fantastic PITA to remove outta the gun, I haven't quite got the ambi part separated from the safety. Since its not mine I haven't taken it down that far.
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Old October 12, 2013, 09:19 PM   #39
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My WASR 10/63 doesn't do that.

Quote:
Now I'm torn with what to do? I've already written an angry email to Arsenal, but I feel like if they don't give me a new gun or pay for a gunsmith to fix it, they are going to send it back the same.
Calm down and buy a WASR.
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Old October 13, 2013, 02:35 AM   #40
Venom1956
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Quote:
Calm down and buy a WASR.
LOL. I wish I had room for that in my Sig.
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E-Shock rounds are engineered to expend maximum energy into soft targets, turning the density mass into an expanding rotational cone of NyTrilium matrix particles, causing neurological collapse to the central nervous system.- Yeah I can do that.
I guarantee you will know it if a bicyclist hits your house going 1000 mph.
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Old October 13, 2013, 10:14 AM   #41
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Old October 13, 2013, 11:06 AM   #42
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I would recommend against the wasr. I owned one for 3 years, it's the only guns I have never regretted selling.

1. it had chronic rust issues. it didn't matter if I cleaned it with hot boiling water, windex, CLP or hoppes. it didn't matter if I cleaned it two weeks after shooting or 2 minutes. it didn't matter if I was shooting corrosive or not corrosive ammo. it didn't even matter if it had been cleaned since the last time I shot it. 2 months in the safe and it was full of rust.

2. mag wobble. nobody told me that I needed to look out for such things so I just felt OK having an LGS order it from century. I ended up with a gun with so much mag wobble that it would not cycle from the steel mag that came with it or any steel mag ever tried in it. I had to use the thicker, more expensive, plastic crapco mags and promags.

3. canted front sight, another wasr issue I was never told to look for whichI got. it was so bad that I ran out of adjustment for the front sight before it was zeroed so I ended up having to resort to a red dot on the handguard rail. not a comfortable setup at all.

4. trigger was absolutely hot garbage, my SKS has a better trigger than the wasr ever did.

these are just my problems specific to the wasr, I won't post any of the reasons I hate the AK in general.
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Old October 13, 2013, 12:25 PM   #43
Darker Loaf
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On WASRs: funny.

WASR, no. I could go out and buy a cheapo Century AK from Fleet Farm, but they still run around $900. I'm happy I got my SAM7-SF, but it's just annoying that it has issues. I've had issues with about 50% of the guns I've ever bought. I'm an unlucky S.O.B.

That's why in the current Ruger 556 vs. DI gas guns, I have to chuckle, because the guy who is arguing is like: "Tell me why DI guns are better!!!!!" Well, mine runs right with no work. For me, at least, that a rarity.

I really like my SAM7-SF: the trigger is awesome (better than my AR-15). I like the side-folder. The milled receiver is beautiful. I really believe if I can get past the safety issues, I'll have a pretty damn cool rifle. Hopefully, accurate for the type, too.
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