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Old September 27, 2013, 08:13 PM   #1
DasGuy
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Vertical track

Has anyone heard of this technique before? Any thoughts on it?

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Old September 27, 2013, 09:13 PM   #2
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I just watched that last night. Definitely seems like a valid variation of "2 in the chest 1 in the head". Not sure how many bad guys are really going to wear armor, but this seems to cover all the bases in case you encounter one that does. You're still getting rounds center mass, so it's not like it's hinging on getting the tricky headshot.

Not sure if it's THE technique, but does seem to be an effective option.
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Old September 28, 2013, 03:10 AM   #3
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A.K.A the mozambique drill. Can find alot more info on it if you search that
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Old September 28, 2013, 05:30 AM   #4
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In the video he specifically states and demonstrates how it is different from the Mozambique.

Instead of placing a controlled pair in the chest, and pausing to place one in the head; it has you using the recoil of the gun to aid in drawing a line of shots vertically up to the head.
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Old September 28, 2013, 11:21 AM   #5
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I think I would just try and get the hell out of there, and let the police handle it. That way I don't go to jail, and if I did have to shoot the guy/gal I only did so as a last resort to save my own life, not to defend my pride or ego.
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Old September 28, 2013, 03:48 PM   #6
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You're going to turn your back on someone shooting at you from close range while you're armed? If so, what is a "last resort" situation?
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Old September 28, 2013, 04:38 PM   #7
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The vertical track technique seems to be more in agreement with the shoot 'em until they're down concept than the failure to stop (Mozambique) drill.
Doesn't the hesitation in the FTS drill offer up an opportunity to get shot?
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Old September 29, 2013, 12:40 AM   #8
3.Shot.Group.
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You're going to turn your back on someone shooting at you from close range while you're armed? If so, what is a "last resort" situation?
If someone is shooting at me the first thing I'm going to do is take cover, the next thing I'm going to do is look for an egress and leave the area when/if I can.

Last resort is when there is no way out, and the shooter is coming for me, about to flank me where I won't have cover, then I'd have no choice but to shoot or be shot.

It's always better to leave than to stay and shoot it out, if you leave you likely won't get shot, if you stay and shoot it out there's a greater chance that you could get shot.

If you're running you're less likely to be hit than if you're standing/crouching still.

If you're behind cover you're less likely to get hit than if you're out in the open.

If you try to draw your SDW and take aim on a bad guy, you're both out in the open And standing still, and way more likely to get shot, than if you're running or hiding behind cover.

What would you do?
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Old September 29, 2013, 01:11 AM   #9
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Last resort is when there is no way out, and the shooter is coming for me, about to flank me where I won't have cover, then I'd have no choice but to shoot or be shot.
That's the whole point. You're already past the "let's find a way out of here" phase. At the point in time that you have to implement the 'vertical track', you're in "shoot or die" territory, with some one running right at you.
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Old September 29, 2013, 01:16 AM   #10
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If you're in an open area and he's already shooting (as in this video scenario), you're not gonna be running far...
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Old September 29, 2013, 07:30 AM   #11
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I have been practicing controlled pairs for some time now.

In a life or death situation I don't want my muscle memory confused by some idea of letting recoil help change my POA/POI. Seems like a good way to miss or accidentally limp wrist the gun.

I'll keep my controlled pairs, thankyouverymuch.
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Old September 29, 2013, 09:57 AM   #12
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Seems like a good way to miss or accidentally limp wrist the gun.
It's just changing point of aim not grip. The recoil naturally moves the muzzle in the direction of the climb. It's not changing muscle memory at all.

The ability to change point of aim quickly is necessary for real life active shooting. You don't change grip, just point of aim.
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Old September 29, 2013, 10:26 AM   #13
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That's the whole point. You're already past the "let's find a way out of here" phase. At the point in time that you have to implement the 'vertical track', you're in "shoot or die" territory, with some one running right at you.
Gunfights are dynamic, and no plan of action will stand up to reality, you have to ready to change your game plan second by second. So I'm not going to spend too much time working on a single course of action or trying to decide which one is the perfect one for an imaginary scenario. I'll develop a good technique and stick with it.

Anything is better than nothing, be a winner not a perfectionist, and you'll live longer.
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Old September 29, 2013, 11:31 AM   #14
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The vertical track technique seems to be more in agreement with the shoot 'em until they're down concept than the failure to stop(Mozambique) drill.
Vertical track adds something missing in some training, outside of the center mass shooting including head and neck. Shoot until down doesn't necessarily go outside center mass aim. Most people train or aim center mass and many (if not most) SD shootings revolve around the center mass aim (not necessarily hit).

Quote:
Doesn't the hesitation in the FTS drill offer up an opportunity to get shot?
Absolutely and the Vertical Track should have been the first choice with an active shooter IMO.

There is a reason why Vertical track is not taught all the time or as a first option for all scenarios, I am sure many can imagine why, possible legal repercussions and all. Using the VM effectively getting a head shot in a SD shooting of an unarmed assailant might be frowned upon and have you facing a jury. Especially if you were taught it and discussed in on a forum.
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Old September 29, 2013, 04:19 PM   #15
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I remember when the technique was called a Zipper. Then, it was later being discussed in training for instructors as 'vertical stringing', because nobody in their right mind wants to find themselves in front of a jury explaining why they were teaching a technique called a 'zipper'.

Intentionally stringing shots vertically is probably best left to something introduced to at least intermediate level & experienced shooters, if not advanced.

Learning to ride the recoil impulses, controlling recoil and not letting it control you, while maintaining a solid grip, sight alignment and trigger press is one thing. Another thing is how a dynamic threat target may be moving, and how the neck/head is a really narrow and small target. I've seen shooters trying for intentional head shots on stationary paper threat targets put hits off to one side or the other of the head, above the shoulder.

A moving paper target, even if the movement is occurring within a defined & expected manner (or path) really increases difficulty ... and that doesn't even take into consideration potential shooter movement in any given situation or set set of circumstances.

When I've introduced vertical stringing to an intermediate, interested & experienced shooter, I've usually done so as a teaching tool, to better assess a shooter's skillset and mastery of technique basics. For example, does the recoil control the shooter in a new situation, or can the shooter automatically adjust and control the recoil while making accurate hits? Then, I slowly introduce shooter movement (forward/rearward, diagonal and lateral - starting from both left & right directions) while performing the drill, and changing the number of rounds being fired.

This is when most shooters start to realize that accurate fire means aimed fire, especially out beyond 3 yds. When even moderately experienced shooters start missing COM hits between 5-9 yds, while they're moving but the threat target remains stationary, it usually gets their attention (and not in a good way).

I remember listening to a cop who had survived an on-duty shooting during which he'd been seriously injured. The shooting was later determined to have involved distances between the lone cop and armed suspect of 5-100 feet. The cop said that after he'd been seriously injured, and hadn't hit the attacker after having fired 22-23 rounds ... and was loading his last hi-cap mag into his .40 duty weapon ... he realized he had to stop 'shooting instinctively' and start aiming. He did just that, hitting and stopping his attacker.

I also remember showing this technique to an experienced instructor and cop who had been involved in 2 shootings of his own (successfully stopping both suspects without being injured himself). The first thing he said after practicing the technique was that he wished he'd have learned it sooner ... but he's a very experienced & skilled shooter.

FWIW, I remember some years ago when one of the larger state agencies reportedly did a study of their on-duty shooting incidents covering a number of years. They supposedly discovered that in just shy of 65% of the shootings reviewed, both the officer and the armed suspect were in constant motion.

Bottom line? The totality of circumstances involved in any particular shooting incident can't be predicted. There's a reason these incidents have been referred to as unexpected, dynamic, rapidly evolving and chaotic occurrences.

"Head shots", and the neck/cervical spine, are going to be extremely difficult to make on even a close stationary threat target. Being able to get an adequate flash sight acquisition and not jerk the trigger under fast shot strings seems pretty hard for many shooters of casual training and experience. People miss more than they expect even under controlled range conditions.

Learn, train and practice hard to master the basics, and then periodically test them under increasingly more demanding drill conditions (supervised by an instructor). Try some IDPA or similar local competition venues.

Don't try to run before you can consistently & successfully walk over difficult and uneven terrain.

Remember that each and every shot fired is going to hit something, and bear in mind where the responsibility for the consequences of that bullet impact may be found to rest.

Just some thoughts.
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Old September 29, 2013, 04:38 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3.Shot.Group
Gunfights are dynamic, and no plan of action will stand up to reality, you have to ready to change your game plan second by second. So I'm not going to spend too much time working on a single course of action or trying to decide which one is the perfect one for an imaginary scenario. I'll develop a good technique and stick with it.
The statements in bold are completely contradictory.
You're talking in circles.
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Old September 29, 2013, 05:31 PM   #17
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It's a technique, nothing more. It's likely less valid than some in some cases and more valid than some in others. However, like all techniques, it has to be the one you practice, not just "oh, I'll try that if something happens."

If it's what you practice, then "muscle memory", "learning the recoil", etc is irrelevant because it's what you practiced.

If you're concerned about how your practiced technique makes you look in court, don't say "I used the SEAL Special Assassin method to neutralize the threat", but more along the lines of, "I was in fear for my life and used my gun to defend myself." The bullets made a perfect vertical line? Weird.
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Old September 29, 2013, 07:09 PM   #18
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The statements in bold are completely contradictory.
You're talking in circles.
Sorry if my post wasn't linear enough for you, but I know what I'm talking about.
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Old October 11, 2013, 05:35 AM   #19
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Vertical tracking

I first learned vertical tracking in a class I took from the Smith & Wesson Academy in the late 80s.

It is sometimes also called "the zipper".

It's application was if you were facing a single adversary and you had to burn him to the ground right now -- you began shooting as soon as you got sights on the target and then just rode the gun up in recoil along the center line of their body, hopefully delivering 3 to 5 rounds and ending (possibly) in a head shot.

It was hoped that all those shots along the center line would result in at least one hit to the CNS and stop the fight.

In my experience, it sounds really good and works on a static target on the range. If you try it in force on force with Simunitions or AirSoft you find that you're moving and the target is moving and it doesn't really work unless you're at VERY close range, and maybe not even then.

It's a neat theory, however
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Old October 11, 2013, 06:50 AM   #20
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In the video he specifically states and demonstrates how it is different from the Mozambique.

Instead of placing a controlled pair in the chest, and pausing to place one in the head; it has you using the recoil of the gun to aid in drawing a line of shots vertically up to the head.
Pause? What pause? If the head is there you shoot it. The only pause is the transition time in going from the chest to the head.

As for riding the recoil up. I prefer to control my gun a little better. I take it to the target and not the other way around.
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Old October 11, 2013, 06:23 PM   #21
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The guy that made that video must be shooting a 9mm or smaller. I shoot a .45 so any 3 rounds in close succession are going to track vertically with little effort from me other than pulling the trigger, but 3 shots with a .45 is what I'd call over kill.
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Old October 12, 2013, 07:35 AM   #22
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3.shot.group I'm not getting it either.
I haven't trained ENOUGH.
And my experience is limited.

BUT...
I'd credit surviving one or two situations with having a practiced plan in my mind that I was able to execute without giving any thought. I wouldn't say my default pattern of shooting ever important though. Moving was the important part.

Learn them all. Practice one and have it set in your mind as the default response so you don't have to think when the time comes. If you find yourself in a situation where you have time to think you can always grab one of the others out of your bag of tricks.

Very few of these drills really work that well on a moving target. Luckily, very few people are capable of moving anything but directly toward or away from a target and posing much danger at the same time.
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Old October 13, 2013, 12:36 AM   #23
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I remember when the technique was called a Zipper. Then, it was later being discussed in training for instructors as 'vertical stringing', because nobody in their right mind wants to find themselves in front of a jury explaining why they were teaching a technique called a 'zipper'.
If memory serves me correctly it (the Zipper) was derived from using the M16. The three round burst taught to save ammo and allow the climb to increase chances of a hit or kill in the eyes of the military. Though I don't know if it lead to the derogatory term "Zipper Head" or weather they were even related.

Anything past three rounds was seen as wastefull by the military, causng lack of accuracy, etc, etc. The desire for fire control lead to the developement of the dreaded M16A2 (I think in the 80's). Oh lovely choices from semi-auto and three round burst.
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Old October 13, 2013, 11:39 AM   #24
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The 3 round burst is most effective if you miss with the first round or there are plentiful targets.

The only way you can get it to track vertically is if you get lucky or you put a sand bag on top of the rifle to stabilize it.

We used to fire the M16(the fully automatic version)by making a loop in the sling, up towards the front sling eye, to hold onto, and using a bi-pod that clipped onto the barrel. You had to aim just like you would if you were firing on semi or you'd most likely miss with all 3 rounds, so the first round would hit the target, the other two would usually land 3 to 5 feet off to the sides or overshoot. At longer ranges anyway(200 meters and out).

Some of our weapons had a restriction device on them that prevented the selector switch from being placed on Auto, most guys would break them off, not because they wanted full auto capability, but because it would dig into your side while carrying the weapon slung on your shoulder or over your back.

Personally, I can fire one plenty fast enough on Semi, and a heck of a lot more accurately than I can on Auto.

But I digress,
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