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Old October 31, 2013, 10:59 AM   #51
tirod
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And the caveat to cover garments is that they generally aren't the typical tight styling which comes just past the belt line. Therefore, the chances of getting made are about the same. Guys wearing loose fitting jacket's and shirts down to their knees aren't common in western society. The 6" guideline becomes a fashion faux pas.

It's not a easy situation. Exactly what pushed holster makers into IWB, a further escalation in carry to hide more of the gun higher on the body. The offsetting disadvantage is a bigger waistline in fitted pants like denims, cargos, etc.

Some have moved to the adjustable waistline slack, but that's not an option for others. So, if IWB is chosen, you are prompted to keep carrying just to take the slack out. That may not be what the user wants or needs, it tends to limit their options. Semi unintended consequences.

There's no easy answer if the user intends to get the firearm quickly into play. That brings up a lot of other issues, like the actual odds of that, confrontational awareness, etc. Hence the use of off body carry, too.

We tend to copy the style used by the most appreciated role group, but if they are duty gun carriers, it can tilt the playing field with their different set of assumptions. They don't get arrested for inadvertently flashing a gun, they get promoted for judicious display arresting a perp. Our role models in concealed carry may not be our best choices. Therefore, what is marketed to them for duty carry may not even be suitable for concealed carry in a civilian world.

An HVAC repairman or auto parts counterman would be forced into deep carry methods in order to prevent alarming their primary customers, or a corporate ban on carry at all. Plus the work requirements in lifting, crawling, etc make it difficult, too. A copier repairman will get short shrift showing up with an exposed shoulder holster in a bank administrative area. What works in a suit coat sometimes won't work with just a thin white poplin shirt. And yet leaving the customer's downtown location after dark isn't all that safe.

What some can get away with is another's critical loss of job for another. Sometimes the bar is a lot higher. The Secret Service might get away with carrying an Uzi in a shoulder holster walking a parade route, for others, it would be a call out and throw down. Lots of women don't have the capability to conceal a Flashbang holster, others are amply endowed.

There's no one answer or rules drawing a line in the sand. You do whatever it takes to make it work, and that takes resourcefulness and imagination. Not the conservative mindset that forces conformity.
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Old October 31, 2013, 11:52 AM   #52
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I have flashed my CCW more times than I can count.
Bending over, reaching up or to the side, windy day, ect....
I would have to say that 98% of the people around me were oblivious to it.
I carry IWB and with my 45acp OWB and the only people that every said anything or gave me a look were other CCW carriers.
(You know them when ya see them: long shirts, slight printing, bulging pocket)
IMHO folks are just to caught up being the next victim (lack of situational awareness) to notice.
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Old November 7, 2013, 04:50 AM   #53
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Sitting outside our local Supermarket, yesterday. I saw my Sons Wife (plus 3 year old, 1 year old) arrive and park. Big Jeep, she had to first pull the baby carriage out of the back, then lift the baby out, fasten him in, then the 3 year old.

Extremely vulnerable at this time, back to the world as she did all this lifting and tugging. A young guy walked up to her, and asked her something, she shook her head, and headed for the store.

When she had her cart (with two steering wheels!) and was starting her walk around, my Wife and I met up with them. Lots of hugs and kisses!

I asked her what the guy said to her, she said he wanted money. She is Brazilian, so she answered him in loud Portuguese, he walked away!

She felt better when we showed up, I always carry. Tee shirt, Florida shirt hanging out side (Retired mode!) one of the big young guys will walk her out.
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Old December 20, 2013, 07:13 AM   #54
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I automatically assume any adult with their shirttails out are carrying, and most especially if it's a large loose fitting shirt

That's the standard "uniform" of most of the undercover cops I've seen in the past 20 years
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Old December 20, 2013, 08:38 AM   #55
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I am sure most bad guys know the look also. That is the reason there is not more confrontations.


Doug
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Old December 21, 2013, 11:07 PM   #56
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I automatically assume any adult with their shirttails out are carrying, and most especially if it's a large loose fitting shirt
Actually, it is rare that I see a young man (under the age of 30) with his shirt tucked in... Untucked shirt seems to be the fashion de rigueur for the under-30 set.
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Old December 22, 2013, 11:14 PM   #57
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When I started this thread, I was really hoping to hear from the folks who carry full size pistols and revolvers in belt holsters.... I know there are a lot who claim to do so.

Instead we mostly heard from people who carry small pistols and snub 38s, either IWB or in a pocket.

So how about the guys who use a sig 220, or Glock 21, or 1911, or SW 686 as their daily carry? how do you maintain an active life with frequent bending, crawling, climbing, in the wind and rain, and still avoid flashing ?
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Old December 22, 2013, 11:50 PM   #58
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So how about the guys who use a sig 220, or Glock 21, or 1911, or SW 686 as their daily carry? how do you maintain an active life with frequent bending, crawling, climbing, in the wind and rain, and still avoid flashing ?
I don't personally know anyone who carries a full-sized gun. But then I live in TX where intentionally failing to conceal is not legal.

From what I can gather based on the comments I have read here and on other forums, the people who carry full-sized pistols fall into one of 3 categories.

The smallest category is made up of those who carry a full-sized gun and make a real effort to conceal.

Probably the largest category consists of those who conceal a full-sized gun but don't really care if they print badly or occasionally expose the gun. Primarily folks who live in areas where open carry is legal.

Then there are the folks who simply carry openly.
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Old December 23, 2013, 08:05 AM   #59
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When I started this thread, I was really hoping to hear from the folks who carry full size pistols and revolvers in belt holsters.... I know there are a lot who claim to do so.
I carry that full size all steel 1911 and from 1 to 3 extra mags (depending on destination, . . . how much extra ammo).

When I decided to carry, . . . I had to alter my wardrobe, . . . alter my style of dress. So does just about everyone else.

I live in central Ohio, . . . similar weather to Mo. . . . which allows me about 10 months out of the year to wear a long tailed shirt, . . . vest, . . . sweatshirt, . . . light jacket, . . . sport coat, . . . or some other "cover garment" and not look out of place. The other two months are polo shirts, . . . alligator shirts, . . . double tee shirts (one tucked in, . . . one hanging out).

I also occasionally wear a shoulder holster, . . . under a short sleeve shirt with snap front.

I also occasionally wear an IWB cross draw, . . . tucked inside my shirt.

Dedicate yourself to doing it, . . . and you will do it. I believe it was old Will Rogers who said something to the effect: If you believe you can or if you believe you can not, . . . you are right.

Go to the Salvation Army or Goodwill store, . . . buy some different clothes so you can practice without breaking the bank, . . . get a good full size mirror, . . . check it out, . . . you CAN do it.

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Old December 23, 2013, 10:15 AM   #60
Don P
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The smallest category is made up of those who carry a full-sized gun and make a real effort to conceal.

Probably the largest category consists of those who conceal a full-sized gun but don't really care if they print badly or occasionally expose the gun. Primarily folks who live in areas where open carry is legal.

Then there are the folks who simply carry openly.
Here in FLA accidental exposure is not an infraction of CCW law. Thankfully the law was added when we tried for open carry and that was the compromise.
I carry a 1911 either full size or commander size and do my best to keep it concealed and avoid the problems that could arise from a general complaint to LE from john Q citizen and being stopped and questioned. On occasion I carry a XD 4" barrel. All using OWB carry using a good firm gun belt and a quality leather holster
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Old December 23, 2013, 10:18 AM   #61
Constantine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by btmj View Post
When I started this thread, I was really hoping to hear from the folks who carry full size pistols and revolvers in belt holsters.... I know there are a lot who claim to do so.

Instead we mostly heard from people who carry small pistols and snub 38s, either IWB or in a pocket.

So how about the guys who use a sig 220, or Glock 21, or 1911, or SW 686 as their daily carry? how do you maintain an active life with frequent bending, crawling, climbing, in the wind and rain, and still avoid flashing ?
I've actually carried all the aforementioned with the exception of the 686.

Appendix inside the waistband.

Lol you're funny.. I agree with you, I'm nowhere near a fan of carrying pocket pistols or anything smaller than a Glock 19.
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Old December 23, 2013, 10:29 AM   #62
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Dwight55: When I decided to carry, . . . I had to alter my wardrobe, . . . alter my style of dress. So does just about everyone else.
I agree. When I decided to get my CCW, I quickly realized I would have to alter what I wore, and how I wore it. I have been carrying now for over two years and have not had any problems. I carry pistols from Kahr CM9 to Ruger SR9c size and no problems showing. I feel confident now to carry my newly aquired Colt Combat Commander 1911. Just waiting to get enough rounds through it.

I'm also in Ohio and we have open carry. I'm not sure how much trouble an officer might cause me on a accidental showing call, but in this politically challanged world we presently live in, I believe we all should be as diligent as possible on covering are weapons as best as we can.

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Old January 7, 2014, 07:21 PM   #63
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I have tried numerous holsters and nothing has quite worked. I wear business casual daily and have resorted to stepping down from a .40 to a .380 on my ankle. The pants ride up every now and then but it seems most people are not looking at my ankles. I am experimenting now with an IWB from Theis holsters so I can go back to my .40. Can let you know how it works out after a complete break in. http://theisholsters.com/
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Old January 8, 2014, 09:52 AM   #64
Don P
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to a .380 on my ankle. The pants ride up every now and then but it seems most people are not looking at my ankles. I am experimenting now with an IWB from Theis holsters so I can go back to my .40. Can let you know how it works out after a complete break in. http://theisholsters.com/
IWB would be a much better choice over ankle carry. Curious if you have tried to draw from the ankle yet? Have you practiced drawing from the ankle? IMO its probably the most awkward place to draw from. All the above is just my .02 worth
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Old January 8, 2014, 03:17 PM   #65
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But ankle carry is often the most viable choice in a non-permissive environment....and one's ankle is a lot closer than one's car....
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Old January 8, 2014, 06:39 PM   #66
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When I first got into law enforcement in the mid 1980's we had a department policy that all officers would carry concealed when off-duty while in the city (of our jurisdiction) but to ALWAYS prevent accidental exposure of the weapon. To an officer, violating a department policy had serious consequences thus we regarded department policies as "that which must be obeyed". As a rookie cop I learned what a royal pain it was in the hot Texas summers to comply with the "always prevent exposure" part of that policy. Also our off duty gun had to be .380 or larger, so no pocket 22 magnums! Thus if I was out of the city, I rarely carried off duty except during the Thanksgiving to Christmas period when crimes against persons always increased. My off duty carry (and on duty backup carry) became a Walther PPK/S mostly carried in an ankle holster. That could only be worn with 5.11.type duty boots so that the muzzle rested on the top rim of the boot to prevent rubbing a hole in your leg. As a few years passed I ditched the ankle holster and carried the Walther between my shirt and my body armor in a thin IWB holster clipped to the large front elastic straps of the body armor, basically over my heart. That worked great as long as I was wearing body armor.
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Old January 8, 2014, 06:53 PM   #67
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I carry a glock 23 AIWB everywhere i go. Tshirt or polo in the summer loose fleece in the winter

I gave up on open front garment (other then suitcoats). Too many chances of exposing the gun
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Old January 8, 2014, 07:25 PM   #68
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It happened to me once. I carry my gun in the swell of my back (6 o'clock on the belt). A shirt that usually stays down wee road up over the gun once (after bending over in a store). pulled it back down & I don't think anyone noticed. Nice thing is in MN it is a permit to carry so the gun does not have to be concealed, it's just highly desireable (and recommended )
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Old January 9, 2014, 09:05 AM   #69
Don P
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But ankle carry is often the most viable choice in a non-permissive environment....and one's ankle is a lot closer than one's car....
Will not argue with the above view point. My point is one must practice drawing from the ankle if they intend to carry that way. Would be total hell if one finds the need for their firearm and have not practiced the draw and then learn at the most inopportune time that they are screwed and possibly dead from lack of technique and practice.
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Old January 9, 2014, 07:54 PM   #70
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Said it once and I'll say it again. These shirts (in both long and short sleeve) will hide my Glock 36 in an IWB OR my full sized 1911 OWB.

http://tacticalgear.com/mens-woolric...FYhcMgod3icAXA
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Old January 11, 2014, 09:30 AM   #71
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After reading these many posts, I am convinced more than ever my decision to use only a pocket pistol (LCP, AA PX22 Walther style, Beretta 21A) carried in my pocket. I'm not going to wear extra clothes in the summer and I wear shorts in warm weather. In Arkansas total concealment is the law. Although, I believe, it unlikely brief accidental exposure would result in arrest.
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Old January 11, 2014, 10:17 AM   #72
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IWB would be a much better choice over ankle carry. Curious if you have tried to draw from the ankle yet? Have you practiced drawing from the ankle? IMO its probably the most awkward place to draw from. All the above is just my .02 worth
Make it 4 cents.

Not only is it hard to get to, you can not get to it and move at the same time.

.....and you can not run well at all it the gun weighs more than a few ounces.

Moving (being a moving target) is my first option. That is more important than shooting. With an ankle holstered gun, you can do niether quickly.

With the myriad of tiny guns chambered for viable defense loadings out there, and the plethora of IWB holsters (and small makers that will make custom holsters for near anything you ask for) ..... you pretty much have to fail to make a serious effort to not find a concealable gun/rig......

There are 9mm guns out there that will add less weight to your middle than the Whopper with cheese "value" meal you had for lunch..... Seriously: Weigh them.
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Old January 13, 2014, 10:53 AM   #73
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So I have 3 different carrying styles I use depending on the day and how snug my pants are. I carry a Glock 32, so it's not quite "full size" but it isn't a pocket pistol neither.

I carry IWB when I have to tuck my shirt in, times when there won't be a whole bunch of running and jumping. For that I like my Galco Tuck at around 2, right in the crease of my right hip. It has a slot in the clip that allows you to tuck your shirt in around an IWB firearm and putting it in the front allows me to stay alert to printing.

For OWB, I use an old Uncle Mikes holster with some foam electrical taped around the clip (for comfort) at the 1 oclock position and wear a Duluth Trading long tailed T or a longer flannel shirt to cover it. At 6'2" it's not suspicious appearing in the least for me to wear a size tall or longer shirt. If I know I'm going to have to bend or kneel or the wind is really blowing I'll tuck the edge of the shirt under the edge of the holster or into my pocket. It does cause some printing but it keeps a full on "flash" from happening.

My favorite way to carry, and the way that I occasionally carry my full sized 1911 is in a shoulder holster underneath one of my many PFG's (fishing shirts) or a button up and light jacket in the fall. For me, the shoulder holster just works. I'm a fairly large fella so my arms drape over it naturally, it doesn't make my pants feel tight, doesn't pull them down, doesn't leave a huge print (unless you bend over and someone is directly behind you), doesn't get accidentally exposed, and I can bend, move, jump, and run without any concerns about where it is and if its showing. I've never been given a second look with my shoulder holster. I'm not sure if your shoulder injury precludes this but if you're already wearing a Hawaiian shirt, you may give it a short trial run and see what you think.
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Old January 16, 2014, 07:34 AM   #74
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Several folks from Texas have commented, mainly on the summer heat. My EDC is a Kahr PM9, which I pocket carry in the cargo shorts which are pretty much all I wear for 7-8 months of the year ... ah, retirement ... a loose t-shirt and a pocket holster make the gun disappear, weakside pocket holds a spare mag. When it's cold enough to wear a jacket or sweatshirt, I carry the same gun -- or one of my other carry choices -- in a kydex paddle holster. Not sure if anybody mentioned this, but I believe TX law now forgives accidental exposure of a concealed weapon by a CHL holder ...

I wouldn't try carrying a full-size gun, mainly due to weight and concealment issues. I consider the Kahr plenty of gun for dealing with emergencies.
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Old January 16, 2014, 08:45 AM   #75
Don P
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Wife beater underneath to keep the gun and holster off my skin. OWB carrying a 1911 Commander or Gov model covered by a T-shirt or button up. Wearing cargo pants makes pocket carry a snap with the following, S&W 649, Glock 26, 36, Sig 232.
Some have stated and its true, that most folks walk around in condition white ( paying no attention to there surroundings).
Just my .02 worth
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