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Old September 4, 2013, 06:40 PM   #1
Justified
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Two Hammer Hits to Fire Cap?

TC New Englander takes two hammer hits to fire the #11 cap.
I place the cap on the nipple pushing firmly down, cock the hammer, pull the trigger...click. Cock the hammer again, pull the trigger...BANG!
Old nipple, new nipple, second new nipple...same thing, ***!
Two hits of the hammer every time. Over 20 rounds same thing, two hits.
Your thoughts?

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Old September 4, 2013, 06:45 PM   #2
noelf2
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Probably a weak hammer spring. Pull off your lock and check it out. Also look close up in the hammer to see if there's an old cap or fragments stuck in there.
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Old September 4, 2013, 06:46 PM   #3
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Caps not fully seated and the first strike is seating them.
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Old September 4, 2013, 06:48 PM   #4
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Can't Push Any Harder

Cap not seated? I can't push any harder... I know I pushing 50 but geesh!

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Old September 4, 2013, 06:50 PM   #5
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I thought that too Hawg, but he says he's firmly seating them. Maybe the nipple is bulged from dry firing or lots of use and they won't seat well even when firmly set. Maybe put on a new nipple, but I'd check and clean up the lock first. If all looks well, maybe you got some #10 caps in your tin.
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Old September 4, 2013, 06:52 PM   #6
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Put a cap on it. Pull the trigger. If it doesn't fire see how hard it is to get the cap back off.
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Old September 4, 2013, 07:04 PM   #7
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Hammer cup/face alignment

Assuming you have the right caps and they are firmly seated. After you make your first try or you can deactivate a cap, check the print that your hammer face is leaving on the cap. You should be seeing at least a 50% print area. It's possible that your hammer face or bottom of the cup is not aligned or even touching the top of the nipple cone. Also, your spring may be weak but have never seen a coil spring do that, on these, unless someone messed with it. ....

Also, make sure you haven't stacked spent caps in your cup. ...

Be Safe !!!
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Old September 4, 2013, 07:42 PM   #8
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At the range two weeks ago as a RO, I was involved in a similar situation.

Had a couple shooting a stainless, laminated stock, break open action in-line cap gun using no.11 caps. Don't know the make of the gun.

The caps were very easy to push onto the nipple and they were consistently having to hit it twice to fire it.

I suggested and showed them how to pinch the cap so that it was a tight fit on the nipple. The gun fired first time from then on.

My .02, JT
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Old September 4, 2013, 08:50 PM   #9
bedbugbilly
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I agree with Hawg . . . while you may be pushing it firmly on, is the profile of the nipple so that it doesn't bind before seating all the way? Hold a cap next to the nipple tube to where it should be when fully seated - mark the tube and then seat the cap as you normally do and see if it is really down all the way.

Second . . . while it could be a weak mainspring . . . . pull your lock and make sure that the tumbler or mainspring aren't binding somewhere against the lock mortise. If you don't have any inlet black, put a light coat of petroleum jelly (or similar) on the tumbler and the mainspring. Put the lock back in and secure it as you normally would and then cycle the lock several times. Remove the lock and check to see if there is any of the petroleum jelly on the areas in the lock mortise where it may be hampering movement of the tumbler or the mainspring. If not, then try the sear arm as well.

Sometimes just a change in the humidity can hamper a lock movement if the mortise isn't sufficient to allow free movement of the internals. Or, if you are removing and replacing the lock when you clean, etc., overtightening of the lock bolt can pull a lock further into the mortise causing binding.

As already mentioned, check the hammer nose cup and make sure that it is clean and there isn't a fragment caught - or that it isn't peened and out of shape which would result in not receiving a "flat" enough strick against the top of the capped nipple to cause discharge.

Those are just a few of the things to check first before looking at the mainspring as the culprit. Good luck and let us know how it works out for you.
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Old September 4, 2013, 09:54 PM   #10
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Just curious:
Did the previous owner have a scope mounted? Occasionally those that do have there hammer heated and bent.
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Old September 5, 2013, 05:09 AM   #11
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Thank you all.

Great feedback as always! Now that I have some direction and I will take another look at it this weekend. This is a second hand rifle but it fired fine the first 3 times I fired it.

Thanks for all of your suggestions, I will keep you posted on the progress.

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Old September 5, 2013, 05:23 AM   #12
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If it fired fine the first three times check and see if the nipple is peened.
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Old September 5, 2013, 08:37 AM   #13
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Wrong size cap. Probably need #11s not #10s.
Or turn down the nipple to accept the small nips.
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Old September 5, 2013, 04:16 PM   #14
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You could swap out its nipple with a Knight Red Hot 1/4 X 28 which sit a bit taller when mounted in a T/C snail than a T/C Hot Shot does. About an 1/8" difference may make all the difference concerning hammer strike force for your lock. Personally I've always used Knight Red Hots in all my T/C Hawken rifles. Never cared to use T/Cs Hot Shots for some reason or another. Nor encountered any miss fires or problems such as you experiencing either. But to each their own. Just passing on what I do is all.
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Old September 6, 2013, 05:02 PM   #15
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Something has changed with the #11 CCI caps. I 'never' had the problem with my ROA until last year when I started on a box of new caps. What I ended up having to do is firmly press home with a little wooden rod (lot more pressure). That does the trick now. Otherwise I could 'almost' count on having to roll through the cylinder before one would go bang (second strike). I bought some other #11 caps from a different place and experienced the same problem, so it isn't just that batch.... And not just one ROA, both of mine have the problem.
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Old September 7, 2013, 08:22 AM   #16
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r clark, sizes have always varied between makers.
Proper primer to nipple fit has always (I go back almost 45 years in this game) a frustrating issue. Find a nipple brand and cap brand that fits well and buy enough of both to last you years.
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