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Old September 2, 2013, 02:25 PM   #26
allaroundhunter
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Best Home Defense Shotty?

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Originally Posted by Theohazard View Post
I've never owned a 930, but from talking to those who have I hear it's plenty reliable as long as you clean it regularly and don't use super-light loads. Besides, is there a better semi-auto HD shotgun anywhere near his price range?
I see more malfunctions and problems with Mossberg 930 shotguns than any other semi automatic shotgun. I run one in competition (930 JM Pro Series), and even I run into more problems than most while keeping the gun clean and using proper ammo.

For a defensive gun, I would get a used Remington 1100 for the price of the 930 or a Remington 870 or Mossberg 500/590 well before I used any 930 variant.
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Old September 2, 2013, 02:25 PM   #27
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Besides, is there a better semi-auto HD shotgun anywhere near his price range?
Well..."better semi-auto HD shotgun" would most likely be just an opinion but as already been said, there are many shotguns, especially used that would fit the bill well. In semi-auto and pump.
IMO,with the OP's price range of $500, he has a fairly wide range of selection if he considers used. Then he can be more selective on which he is more comfortable/ handles/likes better.
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Old September 2, 2013, 02:53 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allaroundhunter
I see more malfunctions and problems with Mossberg 930 shotguns than any other semi automatic shotgun. I run one in competition (930 JM Pro Series), and even I run into more problems than most while keeping the gun clean and using proper ammo.
Good to know. I've heard mostly good things about 930s, but it seems like you have more experience with them than most people. Are you mostly talking about your 930 or have you seen firsthand the same problems in other people's 930s as well? I was thinking about picking one up, but now I want to find one to borrow so I can try it out first. Thanks for the info.
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Old September 2, 2013, 03:01 PM   #29
allaroundhunter
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Best Home Defense Shotty?

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Originally Posted by Theohazard View Post
Good to know. I've heard mostly good things about 930s, but it seems like you have more experience with them than most people. Are you mostly talking about your 930 or have you seen firsthand the same problems in other people's 930s as well? I was thinking about picking one up, but now I want to find one to borrow so I can try it out first. Thanks for the info.
I honestly have never seen a 930 go through a full 3 gun match consisting of more than 40 rounds without a malfunction (and I have seen quite a few try). I then watch Benelli M2s, FN SLPs, and Remington VersaMaxs handle all of it without a problem.

Add to that the many QC problems that have been immediately evident upon unboxing Mossberg shotguns and I have little faith in the manufacturer.
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Old September 2, 2013, 03:42 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allaroundhunter
I honestly have never seen a 930 go through a full 3 gun match consisting of more than 40 rounds without a malfunction
Wow. That's not exactly comforting in a home-defense shotgun...
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Old September 2, 2013, 04:47 PM   #31
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All the snarkiness aside, I think the OP now understands that his wants and his budget are not in agreement, so he needs to alter one or both to achieve his desire to own a shotGUN for home defense.

OP, double the budget and you double your choices
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Old September 3, 2013, 12:57 AM   #32
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Doubling a budget can be hard to do. I personally would just drop the semi requirement and go with a reliable pump. People have given good options there already. I'd probably go with a mossberg 590 or rem 870 to start with.

Personally, I would prefer a bullpup as well, the KSG being at the top of the list. I'd heard many of the initial problems are gone with them, but there's still the price and availability. Incidentally, there's a conversion for the 870, but it looks ugly (built around the reliability of the 870, though). For me, I opted to just rely on my pistol until more affordable reliable bullpups became available.

As to kitting it out, do what you want with it, but keep it as light and maneuverable as possible. I would personally need a pistol grip as I can't stand/use a regular shotgun grip. A light may be handy (since you can't have 1 hand free for a flashlight). Instead of 2 sights, maybe look into some more basic night iron sights (tritium, etc). Save a little weight and still be practical. You're not gonna be speed clearing rooms, so you don't *need* a red dot. Keep it non-electronic and you won't need a backup, either. That's probably all I'd put on it.

Last edited by Rikakiah; September 3, 2013 at 01:15 AM.
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Old September 3, 2013, 02:12 AM   #33
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Quote:
double the budget and you double your choices
Or go used.
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Old September 3, 2013, 04:52 AM   #34
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I'm familiar with the 870, in fact it's the only shotgun I've fired. But some questions about it...

Slugs. From what I've seen they are awesome penetrators(punches thru bulletproof glass), and you can get rifled barrels for the 870 to fire slugs accurately, would an 870 shotgun with rifled barrel firing slugs no longer be considered a shotgun? But a large bore rifle? What kind of effective range would an 870 with the shortest legal rifled barrel and slugs have?

Just an idea, how about an 870 with red dot sight, extended mag tube, and short rifled barrel for home defense? Too extreme?
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Old September 3, 2013, 04:54 AM   #35
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Oh, and wouldn't firing 00buck through a rifled barrel damage the rifling? I'm sure it would so you couldn't alternate rounds. You'd have to use a smoothbore for that.

And sorry for all the questions, been shooting pistols all my life and looking to get more into it, make it a hobby, expand to shotguns and rifles. Thank you all for the replies so far.
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Last edited by Dragger34; September 3, 2013 at 05:24 AM.
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Old September 3, 2013, 07:38 AM   #36
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Best Home Defense Shotty?

How about you shoot slugs through a smoothbore barrel? For HD ranges there won't be much of a difference.
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Old September 3, 2013, 10:02 AM   #37
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Yeah, at ranges up to 50 yards or so, regular ole' slugs through a smooth bore barrel are plenty accurate.
Shot loads fired through a rifled barrel make really lousy patterns.
For home defense use, stay with the smooth bore.
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Old September 3, 2013, 10:06 AM   #38
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Quote:
Slugs. From what I've seen they are awesome penetrators(punches thru bulletproof glass), and you can get rifled barrels for the 870 to fire slugs accurately, would an 870 shotgun with rifled barrel firing slugs no longer be considered a shotgun?
Rifled bbl or smooth, shooting slugs or shot, it would still be considered a shotgun.
A very important thing to consider about using slugs for SD/HD is over- penetration. Don't want to be shooting through your walls into your neighbors house. And the 'kill range' of a "free flying', unobstructed slug can be several hundred yards.
You should survey your home/surroundings and then decide what load to use for SD/HD. Have never seen a pole on the topic but would guess that most people using a shotgun for SD/HD use some form of buckshot for two reasons:
1) buckshot does not penetrate as much as slugs but is still more then adequate enough for most SD/HD situations.
2) buckshot spreads giving it a better 'hit' ratio then a single slug.

Quote:
Just an idea, how about an 870 with red dot sight, extended mag tube, and short rifled barrel for home defense? Too extreme?
Would work just fine if you do your part and is not to extreme.

Quote:
Oh, and wouldn't firing 00buck through a rifled barrel damage the rifling?
No it will not. The shot is softer then the bbl. It WILL lead up the bbl rifling so shooting any lead projectile out of a rifled bbl. will require cleaning with a 'lead removing' solvent.

Bottom line: on shooting buckshot out of a rifled or smooth bbl for SD/HD would again, first include surveying the area you are trying to protect, IE: furthest distance you would be shooting in your home, and pattern your shotgun at that distance with different loads till you find a load that gets most shot center mass on your target, will do the job and not over-penetrate.

FWIW...Kudo's to you for asking the questions you have. Many don't and it show's much responsibility on your part.

Last edited by shortwave; September 3, 2013 at 10:18 AM.
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Old September 3, 2013, 11:21 AM   #39
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Thank you all for the awesome responses.
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Old September 3, 2013, 02:04 PM   #40
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I recommend a Remington 870 12 ga smooth bore. I have five 870's, they are very reliable, and easy to maintain. Sights are virtually irrelevant at home defense distances inside the dwelling. An extended magazine may be valuable in an extreme situation and - like insurance - is probably worth the cost. I recommend No. 1 buckshot - definitely not slugs - for home defense. Home defense shotgun loads have been addressed several times here on TFL. For example, see this thread and the reference in the quote:

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=510474

Quote:
12 ga. 2 3/4 " #1 buck is the best for home defense.

See: http://www.firearmstactical.com/briefs10.htm
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Old September 3, 2013, 02:38 PM   #41
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Quote:
Just an idea, how about an 870 with red dot sight, extended mag tube, and short rifled barrel for home defense? Too extreme?
Go back and search discussions of home defense and a more often overlooked aspect is ease of maneuverability and avoidance of snagging when you need to access it quickly in the dark and in the confines of a closet, a space beneath the bed, or such. Also search red dot vs bead sights.
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Old September 3, 2013, 02:57 PM   #42
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One that you have practiced with and are familiar with.
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Old September 3, 2013, 04:17 PM   #43
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Quote:
Slugs. From what I've seen they are awesome penetrators(punches thru bulletproof glass), and you can get rifled barrels for the 870 to fire slugs accurately, would an 870 shotgun with rifled barrel firing slugs no longer be considered a shotgun? But a large bore rifle? What kind of effective range would an 870 with the shortest legal rifled barrel and slugs have?

Just an idea, how about an 870 with red dot sight, extended mag tube, and short rifled barrel for home defense? Too extreme?
Where have you seen slugs penetrate bullet-proof glass? They have a hard time with large-bore metallic centerfires doing that.

The shortest barrel will still have more effective range than what would be considered self defense in 99.9999% of the scenarios

Putting all that extra weight and getting the gun over 10 pounds in doing so makes it impractical, unwieldy, and more hassle than it is worth.

Do what you want, but try real hard not to wind up like this guy:

[IMG][/IMG]....................
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Old September 3, 2013, 04:36 PM   #44
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I got a mossberg 20 ga deer and upland barrel for 250.00. The deer barrel is rifled so it can use sabots. That barrel is also bit shorter than the field barrel too.

Gun show could be your friend. Go, look, pick up, feel the weight, line up the sites. Dont get all wadded up over name brands and the absolute new thing. If you do shoot someone or something it wont matter the brand, just that you can hit the target.
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Old September 3, 2013, 05:11 PM   #45
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For home defense you will not need 13+ rounds of 12 gauge ammunition. You need to get a conventional time proven pump action shotgun, such as a Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, with a barrel no longer that 20" and with a capacity of no less than 4+1. Put a flashlight on it. Don't fret over a bead sight, no ghost rings or tacticool electro targeting computer laser dot scope needed Go out buy a couple 100 round value packs of field loads from wal-mart and shoot it, practice reloading, shoot it some more. Feed it some full power 2 3/4" 00 9 pellet buckshot. Make sure it functions. Leave the tube loaded with buckshot, with an empty chamber, with the safety OFF. All you have to do is pick up the shotgun and rack a round in the chamber and pull the trigger. If you have any kids around you shouldn't have ANY firearm out in the open anyway so you will have to get some kind of safe.

That buddy, is all you freaking need. Leave the space guns and Call of Duty tacticool crap to your fantasies.
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Old September 4, 2013, 01:41 AM   #46
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Leave the tube loaded with buckshot, with an empty chamber, with the safety OFF. All you have to do is pick up the shotgun and rack a round in the chamber and pull the trigger.
If it's an 870, you will have to press the action bar lock to chamber a round unless you drop the hammer on that empty chamber. What I do with mine is with the gun empty, both chamber and magazine, I pull the trigger to drop the hammer on the empty chamber and then load the magazine. Although we no longer have small children, I leave the safety on in case someone picks it up and racks a round before they realize what they know what they are doing. Just a preference of mine to leave the safety on.

Similar setup with the Mossberg 500.
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Old September 4, 2013, 02:02 AM   #47
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Any 18" to 20" pump gun, new or used, from Remington, Mossberg, Winchester, Ithaca, Benelli, or Browning will get the job done.

This is my truck gun/trailer gun, 200 dollar gunbroker buy:

This one, 600 bucks new, sits bedside:
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Old September 4, 2013, 05:56 AM   #48
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Re: Best Home Defense Shotty?

Quote:
Originally Posted by allaroundhunter View Post
I honestly have never seen a 930 go through a full 3 gun match consisting of more than 40 rounds without a malfunction (and I have seen quite a few try). I then watch Benelli M2s, FN SLPs, and Remington VersaMaxs handle all of it without a problem.

Add to that the many QC problems that have been immediately evident upon unboxing Mossberg shotguns and I have little faith in the manufacturer.
I picked up a Mossberg 930 with the short barrel, last year (got it new for $475). I've used it to shoot skeet multiple times, shooting 25 to 50 rounds of light 7.5 and 8 shot loads, and everyone fed and fired, without any issues. I also occasionally shoot buckshot out of it, from 2.75" reduced recoil 00 buckshot, to full bore 3" 00 buck loads, and all shot reliably.

And outside the military/police, who has shot up to 40 rounds in a single defense situation? With that said, I was going into combat with a shotgun, it would be a pump.

Oh and as to the QC problems, I would be more inclined to picked up new Mossberg over a new Remington. (I do have an old 870 that I love, and yes...if I had the money, I would consider looking at the VersaMax)

And just because I've seen Glocks jam or 1911s jam, means those are unreliable platforms.

OP - Get what fits you. If money is that tight, get a pump. Good luck with your quest.
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Old September 5, 2013, 06:48 PM   #49
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Thank you all again, I've decided when it comes time to get a shotgun, I'm going to get a Remy 870 12 ga. smoothbore with buck shot. It's the only shotgun I've ever shot, affordable, and reliable.

My goal is to have a full-size pistol, a short shotgun, and short rifle/carbine for home-defense. I want to start a gun collection and a little bit of everything to pass down to my children someday.
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Old September 5, 2013, 07:18 PM   #50
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Good decision to me...

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