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Old August 2, 2013, 05:21 PM   #26
fileophile
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1st: Identify situation

I think looking out to ID the situation was OK. You can't be calling the police on every girl scout selling cookies.

But once you see a stranger whacking your door then hit the alarms, dial 911, and get armed and dangerous.
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Old August 2, 2013, 05:49 PM   #27
357 Python
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I believe you have the right set of priorities. You first identified a threat, then realized you had little if any time to call 911 before entry was made. You then armed yourself with a good home defense weapon. You called 911 at the earliest time after you realized you were safe and the threat no longer existed. The only thing I could see that would have made it better is a blue tooth type of cell phone, but you would have had to already have it with you. You did just what I would have done, but the intruder would have seen the muzzle as I aimed at him ready to fire. As for replacing the 20 gauge, the 20 is just fine in that situation. I would load it with 00 or number 1 buckshot. If you do decide to change it out a 12 gauge with an 18 - 20 inch barrel from Remington, Mossberg, Benelli, Winchester or other high quality manufacturer will do the trick. I have experience with Remington, Mossberg, and Winchester and either one will handle the job nicely. Remington and Mossberg have models available for home defense or police service. Others may have to be adapted. You are here asking questions and seeking advice which is better than the alternative. Take care and stay safe.
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Old August 2, 2013, 09:49 PM   #28
Brit
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The bottom line, you are OK, he left, and you called the Police, this would cause a visit from a Patrol Car.

And if you saw enough of this individual, to give a description, no vehicle? So he would be most likely be still in the area.

All's well, you are safe.
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Old August 3, 2013, 08:15 AM   #29
Skadoosh
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fileophile wrote:
Quote:
I think looking out to ID the situation was OK. You can't be calling the police on every girl scout selling cookies.


When was the last time you had girl scouts kicking down your door?
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Old August 7, 2013, 11:28 PM   #30
tepin
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When someone knocks at my door or rings my doorbell (a very, very infrequent occurrence), the first thing I do is grab a gun and get to a position where I can cover the front and back doors:

1. I don't have friends that come over
2. I don't have kids
3. I never answer the door
4. Many home invasions start with a knock or ring

Anyone that kicks in my front or back door will be shot on sight.

1. The FBI states that 80% of the folks invading homes are high on drugs or alcohol (which means you cannot reason or easily control these people)
2. Anyone with the stones to invade someones home is most likely also prepared to "deal" (violently) with anyone in the home should he be confronted. This is especially true at night and on weekends when most folks are at home.

Calling 911 will happen after the danger has passed or if the opportunity to call 911 presents itself and I can make the call w/o too much distraction.

The cops cannot help you if you are dead... focus on the threat.
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Old August 8, 2013, 04:34 PM   #31
ClydeFrog
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Point #2...

I disagree with point #2(second section).
Most "B&Es" are considered by LE agencies to be burglars or theft.
They may have tools or equipment to gain entry but they are not out to harm or kill you unless they feel cornered or threatened.
Most crooks who are involved in residential burglaries are junkies looking for high value items to swipe so they can get drunk or high.
Most also have long criminal records & now how the game is played with judges/prosecutors/court justices.
They get busted, they plea out, they get 3 hots & cot and hot showers for a few weeks or months, then they are back on the street. Your tax $$$ at work, .
When things go "wrong" is when they do break-ins at night, try & gain entry to the second floor or bedrooms, have weapons/duct tape/plastic ties/handcuffs, hurt or kill pets, or stalk/surveillance/target a property.

Some criminals are unstable or unpredictable but if they flee or give-up & you shoot them(use lethal force) you can be in hot water!
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Old August 8, 2013, 05:45 PM   #32
jhenry
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I would consider anyone actually breaking into, or having broken into my home to be an imminent threat to my safety and the safety of my family. The state legislature agrees with this position.

I will use whatever level of force I need to use to stop that threat.
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Old August 9, 2013, 03:10 PM   #33
tepin
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@ClydeFrog : I agree that most daytime break-ins are resource predators looking for stuff. The problem is, you don't know their motive and it isn't our job to ask them what their motive is. If we did ask, they would just claim to be a locksmith here to repair the lock someone else just broke. Second, a resource predator can become a process predator after breaking in and meeting your 13 year old daughter home sick from school or meeting your wife that just got out of the shower. Before taking your blender, the resource predator might decide that the opportunity to have some "fun" has just presented itself and now their motive has shifted from needing "stuff" to needing your wife. Just because its between the hours of 10AM and 3PM doesn't seem to warrant giving a home invader the benefit of the doubt when it comes to what their motive is.

How long have we been hearing... "A home invasion between 10 & 3 is someone expecting no one to be home and they just want your stuff"?? Really??

I'll bet the first time I heard that line was 20 years ago standing around in some gun shop when I lived in Texas. I propose that this line of thinking is NO LONGER VALID. Why? We are in the computer age and MANY folks work from home now days, myself included. My wife sometimes. The NEW NORMAL for 2013 is: A home can always be occupied because many folks no longer drive into work. Maybe the perp that has been casing your home for 3 days knows your wife works from home and wants to visit her. If your wife assumes that the person that just kicked in the door wants the blender because its only 10:30 in the morning - she may end up dead, having this mindset.

When working from home I have my .45 on the desk next to me. When the doorbell rings, I look out the window for a UPS / FEDEX truck (regular mail goes to a PO BOX). If none to be found, I sit back down. A 2nd ring or knock, I trot downstairs with the .45 and take up a position of cover where I have line of fire to both front and back doors... and I wait.... No warning shots. No B.S. verbal commands to the FBI:80-percenter that is too high to even know what I am saying or too high to follow directions or too high to stop their forward motion after 4 COM hits with a .45ACP. It's just game-over when the doorjamb splinters.

Now, I am not talking about an execution. The perp made a choice to invade an occupied home. If the perp hits the floor before I pull the trigger or he has turned to run before I have pulled the trigger, thank god because I really don't want to have to shoot anyone, especially given the fact that I have maple wood floors and blood would likely warp the boards. I digress. If the perp isn't fast enough, its most likely going to be a dirt-nap. The reason this would be so sad is because after the shooting we will all find out that the perp was just starting to turn their life around. As a matter of fact, we will discover that just 9 days prior to the event, the perp did an anti-crime public service announcement for MADDADS.

I'll never forget when I was 12 or 13 and living in Tulsa, OK... home sick from school, dad at work and mom out grocery shopping; I was watching TV in the living room, probably Price Is Right, and the doorbell rings. I didn't move because my brother and I were always taught to never answer the door. The doorbell rings again. I pop-up and peek through the curtain and see some guy standing on the porch... then he opens the screen door and tries the front door. I bolt to to my parents bedroom, grab dads Ruger Speed-Six .357 (which I had fired many times at the local dump) and stood in the living room with gun pointed at the front door. Long story short, my beagle jumped on the couch, ears back and let out a single bark. The punk robbed the home next door. If I had to guess I would say the guy was probably 18 to 23 years old. Too bad he'll never know his life was saved by the single bark of some homeowners dog... only 1.5 inches of wood between his body and a 158 grain jacketed hollow point. Maybe his intuition told him there was a predator already in the home. Who can say.

Reminds me of another story, in Tulsa and same neighborhood. My folks were on the community board and somehow I always got stuck delivering the monthly news bulletins - two to three sheets of paper, printed front and back and rolled up with rubber-band. I would ride my bike and deliver to about ~50 to ~75 homes.... The job was to ring the bell, announce "[name redacted] Newsletter". If no one answered, attach the document to the doorknob or do whatever worked. Never had any problems. Most folks knew me and knew what I was doing. There was one neighbor, Homer H., who folks talked about as being a "little off" (according to my parents). I always addressed Homer as Mr. H****** as 12 or 13 year old should address someone in their 60's, at least back then. Well, one night Homer got "upset" at/with his newspaper boy, stepped out on the porch and shot him. Paperboy dies. Homer went to prison. Seems he tried to claim self-defense (defense of dwelling?) because someone was breaking into his home. Not sure if Homer just hated the paperboy or just flipped his lid one night. I always wondered if, on any other day, that bullet could have been mine. Who can say.
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Last edited by tepin; August 9, 2013 at 03:17 PM.
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Old August 9, 2013, 03:52 PM   #34
ClydeFrog
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True...

I agree with the last remarks.
I read over a online news item of a slick burglar who posed as a "handyman" .
He'd set up a repair job in a residence then case the property, stealing any high value items he could.
The police caught up to the crook & were able to recover a lot of stolen loot.

This media story was in south Florida(Palm Beach County area) if you want any details.
CF
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Old August 9, 2013, 03:55 PM   #35
jad0110
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I think you did just fine. Since you have to replace the door, may as well use a beefier one with reinforced lock protection in the frame. Get good quality bump resistant locks, etc.

As for the 20 ga, I'd feel well armed with one assuming it was loaded with buckshot (preferably #1 or larger) or slugs.
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Old August 9, 2013, 04:05 PM   #36
tepin
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Steel frame and Medeco locks. Cannot beat it.
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Old August 9, 2013, 05:02 PM   #37
giaquir
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Up close, a 20 ga loaded with #4's is a formidable
weapon
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Old August 10, 2013, 05:40 PM   #38
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at distances normally associated with being indoors, a 20ga loaded with just about anything would be formidable. I would not use anything less than turkey load but I think you get my drift.
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Old August 11, 2013, 10:01 AM   #39
jhenry
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A 20 gauge with adequate loads is just fine, and in reality, perhaps a superior choice for smaller framed folks in that bantam sized pump action 20 gauge shotguns are easier to get into action for them and are made by Mossberg and Remington. Transition to the 12 gauge versions and visa versa would be just about seamless as well.
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Old August 11, 2013, 12:31 PM   #40
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If we are wandering into the 12 gauge pump as a wonder weapon, then we have gone down the clich├ęd path of all gun forums.

Have we covered all there is to say?
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Old August 11, 2013, 05:25 PM   #41
daddyo
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Quote:
$Hello All.

About 2 weeks ago I was home alone, Mrs. Nine was gone, and there were no cars at the house. I was in the hallway outside of my bed room when out of nowhere I hear a loud banging at the front door.

I move to investigate and see through the window of the door a guy whaling on my door, kicking I assume. The door, a 1 1/2 inch think piece of wood buckled. I moved to my bedroom and retrieved my Mossy 500C and returned to my earlier position.

Racking the slide and chambering a round I see the fellow look up, we locked eyes for but a moment before he hauled a$$. I didn'td get a good view at him, only the upper part of his face and his backside. Looking at the door I saw that maybe a few more good kicks and he'd have been inside.

So food for thought:

-Given my time constraint did I do the right thing? I didn't have time to call police.
-This fellow looked between 180 and 200 pounds, rather solid looking. I'm having second thoughts about the 20 Gauge's abilities, and I rifle would have been a terrible choice as my front door faces a road with houses on the other side.

Can anyone offer input or suggestions?
It seems to me that you acted appropriately and survived the attack. IMO the 20 gauge is just fine but I would add another layer before entry such as burglar bars. Deter the majority and give you more time to prepare for that rare determined foe.
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