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Old July 6, 2013, 10:30 PM   #1
Gbnk82
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U.s milsurp guns

I have never had much intrested in older or surplus guns until the last year or so i have gotten myself an sks and am looking at a mosin 91/30 right now..my question is what kind of surplus is there up for grabs that is u.s made?? I know of the M1 but iother got thinking other than that i couldnt think of anything..does anyone have a list of u.s milsurp guns that are still available at reasonable orprices atleast affordable prices??
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Old July 6, 2013, 11:13 PM   #2
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it despends on your definition of reasonable.
springfield 1903s, 1903A1/A2/A3 all sell for around $500-800 depending on condition. 1903A4 snipers sell for much more, sometimes to the tune of $5000 in perfect condition.

there is the 1917, which used to be the cheaper alternative to the 1903 that now sells for around the same price, despite being made in larger quantities during WWI. I'm still looking for one but milsurps in my area are not very common.

there is the M1 garand which is available for $650 in decent condition from CMP but there are lots of hoops you have to jump through compared to normal gun purchasing protocols. generally gun show pricing runs from $800-1100 depending on how much vendors think they can get out of them.

M1 carbines are a big iffy one. they are everywhere but there are so many repros and fakes that I wont even touch the things. they are usually over $1000

1911s are usually pretty spendy as military surplus and vary widely in value depending on condition so I won't quote price on them.

for the most part US surplus is much spendier than others like british, russian, italian, french and japanese stuff but it's still cheaper than your average german stuff.
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Old July 6, 2013, 11:31 PM   #3
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Most of the 1903's are probably more than i could spend..i looked on cmp i will most likely pick up a M1 from there eventually..its really a shame there isnt more avaiable here in the u.s with our great history in firearms
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Old July 7, 2013, 12:13 AM   #4
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Reasonably priced nice Krags are off the market, but there are still some around that have not been chopped up if one is willing to accept lesser condition.

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Old July 7, 2013, 10:00 AM   #5
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You could find a decent bubba'd 1903 that they changed the stock on and replace it with a vintage or replacement stock. These run around 450 and add in 150 for a new stock. Just make sure they didn't cut off the original sights.
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Old July 7, 2013, 11:40 AM   #6
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^^^Or drill and tap for scope mount, or bend the bolt to clear a scope, or chop the barrel down to a shorter length, or replace the safety with one designed to clear a scope, or that was rechambered.

bubba guns are not a good place to go if you want original for a good price. there are any number of ways that a rifle can be altered that would reduce value permanently and and $450 is an awful high quote price, average is $250-350. even then, a new stock+stock bands, bayonet lug, band retainer bar, stacking swivel, and sling swivel plus assorted small screws comes to much more than $100, the small parts alone are $50 if you go with new repro, probably close to $100 if you go with USGI parts. so you are looking at around $600 for a gun that assuming you got a good deal and the only thing wrong with it was the stock that you could easily buy in original condition for the same price without having to scrounge Ebay for parts.
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Old July 7, 2013, 11:44 AM   #7
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That was why I said a decent bubba'd one. I have found a few older ones that only had the stock replaced. It can be a cheaper route if you find one that just has a new stock but you have to know what you are looking for.
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Old July 7, 2013, 12:06 PM   #8
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unless you get that decent gun for $250, it is not going to be a cheaper route. as I just itemized, especially with a replaced stock, you will have a number of small parts to replace along with the wood that if you are lucky, only sells for $100. those put the actual cost of the stock replacement at nearly what you pay for the rifle, especially if you are forced to buy parts one at a time from different vendors and have to pay shipping on all of them.

I once got a 1903A4 barreled action for $150, I ended up spending over $1000 to get it back looking like original condition and it had a lot of repro parts. it is much easier and in most cases, cheaper to just get on in original condition than it is to rescue a bubba gun.
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Old July 7, 2013, 11:20 PM   #9
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i think if it came down to itid rather hold out for a deal on a original unaltered gun but if the right deal came around i might jump on a bubba'd gun if it was in good condition...i know i definetly want a M1 but i dont believe in buying guns to be safe queens is there any modern ammo that is produced that can be shot for the M1 without damaging it?
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Old July 7, 2013, 11:48 PM   #10
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hornady makes M1 safe ammo but it's kindof spendy.

you can always reload. it's a little spendy to get a reloading bench going but once you've invested in a few different calibers the savings and utility start to outweigh costs.

for the mean time CMP also sells surplus HXP M2 ball that is non corrosive and reloadable(though a primer pocket reamer is recommended) for fairly cheap.
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Old July 8, 2013, 09:37 AM   #11
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You can also put in an adjustable gas plug and that will allow you to shoot any factory ammo out of a Garand. If I didn't reload this would probably be the route I would go just make sure you keep the factory gas plug so you can set it back to it's original configuration.

Stu
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Old July 9, 2013, 07:27 AM   #12
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Gbnk82,
Check out this link. This has some great information regarding modern ammo for the M1. You can shoot commercial ammo but you need to be careful what your shooting. Will your Garand blow up using some hot ammo? Maybe, maybe not. For sure, it will NOT be good for it or the op rod (and those get expensive to replace). Before I knew anything about Garands and what to feed them I put any 30.06 round I could find in it. It took it all and came back for more. Now I know better and wouldn't do that.

I'll eventually get one of these gas screws but until then it's HXP and some of the commercial that the site shows as "safe". Right now I reload for mine which I think is a lot of fun.

http://www.garandgear.com/index.php?...arand&catid=39
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Old July 9, 2013, 07:34 AM   #13
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Regarding the US Milsurps...what about the Savage Enfield? Do you count these as US or foreign milsurps? Seen a couple for a pretty decent price out there.
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Old July 9, 2013, 09:42 AM   #14
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I consider them foreign since we never used them, we just made them. if the criteria was that it just has to be made in the US then I guess we should add 1891 mosin nagants and pattern14 enfields to the list as well.
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Old July 9, 2013, 10:40 AM   #15
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I have seen the enfields before and am intrested in them but yeah i was more looking for service rifles like the garand and springfield..by the way thanks alot for that link conair when i pick up one of those M1's ill grab a little bit of that ammo to shoot until i get a gas plug for it..
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Old July 9, 2013, 08:21 PM   #16
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You can get a great M1 Garand from CMP for $625. I dont know what "hoops" the other poster is talking about. You only need to meet a few easy requirments to purchase from CMP. If you need any help PM me
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Old July 9, 2013, 08:36 PM   #17
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Orlando, we've been over this in the other thread in the semi auto forums can we please try not to derail 2 threads for the same topic?
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Old July 12, 2013, 07:13 PM   #18
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US made Mosin Nagant M1891s were indeed issued to US sailors (USS Olympia) and US soldiers (339th, I think) to fight the Bolsheviks at Arkhangelsk. In July 1918, the U. S. Army Ordnance Corps’ Engineering Division officially designated America’s new weapons the “Russian Three-line Rifle, Caliber 7.62 mm. (.3 inch)”, and had them marked with its “flaming bomb” insignia, an American eagle, and otherwise. Some collectors refer to the American Mosin-Nagants as the “Model 1916”, although that term was not used by either the Russians or the Americans. In its records the U.S. Army almost always referred to the guns simply as “Russian rifles”.
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Old July 12, 2013, 08:24 PM   #19
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Quote:
its really a shame there isnt more available here in the u.s with our great history in firearms
theres been lots and lots of mil-surp stuff... just not in the last 20yrs...
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Old July 12, 2013, 08:47 PM   #20
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tahunua001
The OP asked a question and I gave him good information. I am not derailing anything. Take your attacks elsewhere
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Old July 12, 2013, 11:59 PM   #21
tahunua001
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who's attacking? I'm simply trying to keep on the topic of US military surplus arms without it becoming a topic of CMP and their buying process.

perhaps I should just but out of conversations that include other members that I've disagreed with in the past.


DE Shooter, I didn't know that about US ordnance stamped 1891s, if I ever find one I sure hope the seller has no idea what he's hanging onto, I would love to have something that is such an oddity but I would hate to what must be pay a high premium for a mosin nagant.
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Old July 13, 2013, 06:48 AM   #22
Orlando
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No, perhaps you should just stop stiring the pot.
All I am doing is helping a fellow forum member. You are dragging in conflict.

To the OP, if you are interested or need help with purchasing from CMP, PM me
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Old July 16, 2013, 03:47 PM   #23
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A beautiful, correct, all original US rifle can go for as much as $1200. But, you can find the US, made for Russia rifles from ~$250 to $450, depending on how much US is left. The original black walnut wood is a big plus, especially if the Rem or NEW cartouche is still visible. The most common found rifles have been thru Finland. Usually, they are pretty good shooters.
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Old July 17, 2013, 02:21 PM   #24
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http://www.leverguns.com/articles/model_1895.htm

Or a Winchester 1895, made by Westinghouse for the Czar?

Firearms historians are still trying to clear up official US Army use of the Model 1895. I stated in my long post that the Army bought 10,000 carbines; I should have said 10,000 muskets - although some of the order may - I emphasize "may" - have been in carbine configuration. The order of 10,000 was made in 1898 at the behest of General Nelson Miles, then Commanding General of the Army, who wanted to get the maximum number of .30-40's into the hands of troops for the Spanish-American War. Regulars and the Rough Riders had Krags; most other Volunteer units still had the .45-70 Trapdoor Springfields. The 1895's were too late for the Santiago campaign, although a number of .30-40 carbines were in the hands of officers as their private weapons. (This was correctly shown in the 1997 film "The Rough Riders.")

Last edited by P5 Guy; July 17, 2013 at 02:24 PM. Reason: Add a quote from the article/web page.
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Old July 17, 2013, 02:51 PM   #25
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US guns are great but a little pricey vs imports.

Now with that said there are some great import Milsup rifles out there.

Mosin 91/30
Mosin M44
Lee Enfields - Which I love!!!
The 8mm Mauser and it's variants from other countries.
Steyr M95/34 8X56R
Swiss M1931 RIFLE 7.5X55MM
Swiss Schmidt-Rubin Rifle M1896 7.5x55mm

And this list goes on and on.

My point is do not miss the chance to own one of these old classic war weapons.
They shoot great, US brass manufactures are starting to produce reasonably priced brass.
And in MHO owning the history is well worth the investment.
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