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Old April 10, 2013, 10:33 PM   #1
ChaseReynolds
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Sniper School.

I have been looking into a civilian sniper course for this summer. I have found GPS Defense Sniper School. The course isn't so much the problem as is lodging, car rental, plane tickets, and food. All that on top of ammo allotment just is a little too much for me.

Has anyone here been to any sniper training other than military and would you recommend a friend?
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Old April 10, 2013, 11:04 PM   #2
swcc22
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Re: Sniper School.

Im sorry I went to Camp Atterbury Indiana. When I was in the navy.
Where are u located maybe I call a few of my guys I worked with that are still going down range.

Last edited by swcc22; April 10, 2013 at 11:16 PM.
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Old April 10, 2013, 11:31 PM   #3
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Maybe Front Sight?
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Old April 11, 2013, 01:27 AM   #4
thump_rrr
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I didn't now tat they taught civilians how to kill people from long distances

Dictionary Definition

sniper n : a marksman who shoots at people from a concealed place
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Old April 11, 2013, 01:44 AM   #5
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A key element to being a sniper, even more so than being a good shot, is having unlimited patience.
That being said, I would perhaps exercise some of it and continue to save until you can afford to go.
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Old April 11, 2013, 02:43 AM   #6
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By a "sniper" course, do you mean a precision or long range shooting course?
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Old April 11, 2013, 06:37 AM   #7
dahermit
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Quote:
I didn't now tat they taught civilians how to kill people from long distances
Dictionary Definition
sniper n : a marksman who shoots at people from a concealed place
"Civilan" = "Milita". "...well regulated Milita..." = A well trained Milita. In any modern conflict involving civilian fighters, it would seem prudent to have some with the skills of a trained sniper. Sniper training does not, teach a person to "kill people from long distances...", it teaches them the requisite skill to hit a target at long distances. As one of the "signatures" of a fellow posting here, "...during a gun fight is not the time to learn new skills..."
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Old April 11, 2013, 08:44 AM   #8
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Powderman - you beat me to it :-)

I was thinking the same thing - is there "civillian" sniper courses? Wonder if the hide site construction and occupation includes crawling up a water tower ladder?
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Old April 11, 2013, 08:58 AM   #9
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Where are you now in your skill development? Have you shot any CMP matches?
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Old April 11, 2013, 09:17 AM   #10
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Look up the project Appleseed people, they go around trying to train marksmanship
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Old April 11, 2013, 09:18 AM   #11
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Though I'm retired, I keep my LE Instructor Certification current. Part of that is I am a certified LE Instructor. I still conduct schools but mostly to smaller departments and officers who cant afford full blow SWAT style courses.

I do teach several types of rifle & pistol shooting but I wont conduct a civilian school and call it a "sniper school".

Having said that, I'll asked "what is a sniper school, and what needs to be taught and practiced to be a successful sniper?

It's much simpler the people think. Below is a quote from the USAMU Counter Sniper Guide put out for LE sniper/counter snipers.

Quote:
Chapter 5 General Notes:

1. ….. The counter-sniper is a hunter and must use any and all tricks of the trade to assure a proper hit. The lives of fellow officers and that of the general public are at stake. Time is extremely critical, therefore, he can expect to be required to make shots at varying angles and distances on a split second’s notice. The hunting of varmints such as woodchucks, prairie dogs, and crows provides outstanding training because the techniques involved are almost identical.
Think about it, the varmint hunter does essentially the same thing. He hunts from cover, uses camouflage, may use a spotter or may not (like the sniper). He probably only gets one shot before the quarry is gone.

Its the same thing without the stigma of the word "sniper" eliminating the "ninja" stereotype.

Want to learn sniper tactics, take up varmint hunting.
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Old April 11, 2013, 02:24 PM   #12
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Quote:
Want to learn sniper tactics, take up varmint hunting.
Bingo!
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Old April 11, 2013, 07:06 PM   #13
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Based off one documentary I saw a couple years ago (so I'm practically an expert) I was under the impression that the army's sniper school taught about as much about concealment as shooting.
I've actually always thought that a class on sneaking and hiding could be fun.
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Old April 12, 2013, 12:41 PM   #14
sfmedic
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Dayman - its called stalking :-) yea fun like in the hot sun beating down on you bugs crawling in your ear, crapping in a zip lock bag, poison ivy kinda fun :-)


two man teams sniper and observer - the services deploy them differently. even within the army they are used differently - field snipers / MOUT snipers / Snipers in support of CQB etc etc

whats always perplexed me was the balance between long distance shooting and stalking - if your sooooooo heavy on the stalking cant you get in closer than 800 yards for a head shot :-)
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Old April 12, 2013, 01:31 PM   #15
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I've actually always thought that a class on sneaking and hiding could be fun.
The class, maybe. Actually putting it into practice, no. Simply reading Marine Sniper took that question away for me.
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Old April 12, 2013, 02:35 PM   #16
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The one sniper school graduate I met in the Reserves empahsized that Army Sniper School does not teach to you shoot-if you can't do that, they won't accept you.
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Old April 12, 2013, 04:17 PM   #17
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I have no misconception that I'm a sniper, or what they do would actually be fun. But, like other people have said, it does seem a lot like hunting. "Stalking" is even an interchangeable term.

As far as the OP goes, it might be easier to find a good hunting guide/course than find a "sniper" course. Plus, long range hunting has the added benefit of being legal to actually practice.
If you can effectively stalk and take turkeys with a rifle, you're probably well on your way to where you want to be.
Another idea - if stalking experience what you're looking for rather than the long range shooting side of things - is wildlife photography. During the off season you don't have to worry about other hunters, and if you can sneak up on critters and take their pictures, you can certainly sneak up on them with a rifle.
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Old April 12, 2013, 04:51 PM   #18
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Quote:
Want to learn sniper tactics, take up varmint hunting.
When you can stalk a turkey, you will realize you are there. Taught to me by my American Indian cousins we played sneak up all our life, sneak up on each other, try it, it is a lot of fun. Wear thin mocs tho so you can feel the ground.

My nephew wrote me they wanted him to go to sniper in the corp, he read up on it and passed. He could shoot well enough it was the "other" things he didnt want to expierience.
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Old April 12, 2013, 05:10 PM   #19
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Sniper School.

Well put Kraigwy
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Old April 13, 2013, 04:44 AM   #20
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For civilians, GunSite "long Range" is superb. No stalking, in the course but I have been taught by a graduate from that Course and all I can say is ....impressive. Their "Precision Rifle" is highly rated in many communities. I do think, however, that it takes many years of experience to get to a high level of skill. These courses will teach you to hit , and shoot very well, but the other stuff - map reading for example- needs a solid military/outdoor background.
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Old April 13, 2013, 01:32 PM   #21
sfmedic
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sigshr

????The one sniper school graduate I met in the Reserves empahsized that Army Sniper School does not teach to you shoot-if you can't do that, they won't accept you. ?????

of course they do - what army sniper school???

I know he isnt talking about SOTIC out of USAJFKSWCS

Maybe he meant the dont only teach you to shoot. there is a whole lot more that goes into being a "sniper" than just being able to shoot long distances - im going to think thats what he meant.
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Old April 13, 2013, 02:10 PM   #22
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To be accepted to sniper school you have to already be a good shot.
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Old April 13, 2013, 02:49 PM   #23
sfmedic
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I kinda get the nuance

but a whole lot of time is still spent teaching how to shoot. correct you do need to be a good shot but that's the ground floor basic skill set. Thats not the standard. If that's the case why waste time on the ranges during the course ? i bet the vast majority of posters on this forum are excellent shots. I would further bet that the vast majority would not pass the final graded shoots at the SOTIC course either.

I guess its a matter of degree .
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Old April 13, 2013, 03:15 PM   #24
SIGSHR
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I knew that sniper school graduate when I was in the NJNG over 30 years ago, so my info may be a little out of date.
One thing we should remember is that when military snipers are deployed-the Other Guy has his out there as well. Plus his artillery, (maybe) air support and even some of his rank and file may be pretty good shots. Not to mention he won't just stand there and take it. In all of the accounts I have read from Vietnam it seems the sniper teams got off at best 4-5 good shots, then they had to move-fast!
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Old April 14, 2013, 08:42 AM   #25
sfmedic
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without being up on the RVN stats That sounds about right . Carlos Hathcock did a lot of counter sniper work too in VN because they sent a lot of snipers after him (ref the end part of your post)

some teams are deployed heavily for the observer side of the equation. (In support of the CQB / Hostage rescue mission for example) They work closely with the door kickers and sometimes they do sniper initiated assaults that actually coordinate the entry count down between the breaching team and sniper teams. Trail sitters may be out for days simply observing and not actually intending an interdiction.

Urban Snipers (think Vasily Zaitsev) work a lot closer in then field snipers and require a whole different tool box of skills that their counterparts dont use.

so yea its kinda like varmit hunting but then its not
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