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View Poll Results: Plastic gun files: any real interest in downloading them?
Of course and I already built and fired it or plan to 1 1.22%
Only downloaded it in case I want to play later 8 9.76%
No but my neighbor, dog or someone using a computer I've seen did 5 6.10%
No, it's a .380, I don't do .380 5 6.10%
No interest in the gun or download 63 76.83%
Voters: 82. You may not vote on this poll

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Old May 11, 2013, 09:59 PM   #1
TXAZ
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Poll: Did you download the plastic Liberator handgun files? why?

While I don't expect anyone has a Stratasys 3D printer just sitting around, I'm more curious if there is any serious interest in printing your .380.

While the primary site has been shut down, as some say "once on the Internet,"... So is there any interest on your part?
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Old May 11, 2013, 10:24 PM   #2
tomrkba
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It's neat, but I don't have too much interest in it.
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Old May 11, 2013, 10:41 PM   #3
Hawg
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No interest at all.
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Old May 11, 2013, 11:39 PM   #4
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Been considering it but haven't
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Old May 11, 2013, 11:50 PM   #5
myusername
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I have a machine shop, and I've never owned a Glock, so why would I want a plastic gun now?
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Old May 12, 2013, 08:44 AM   #6
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None of the above.

Maybe I downloaded it, and maybe I didn't.
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Old May 12, 2013, 09:16 AM   #7
Kreyzhorse
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No 3D printer, no interest in printing a gun.
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Old May 12, 2013, 09:54 AM   #8
B.N.Real
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No interest in it.
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Old May 12, 2013, 12:21 PM   #9
Tom Servo
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I've spoken to many people who've downloaded it (and a few who've hosted it) simply to ensure that it's out there. There are certainly some 1st Amendment issues afoot, and simply having or distributing is an act of civil disobedience for some.

I won't advocate doing either, but I do find the whole situation somewhat amusing.
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Old May 12, 2013, 12:25 PM   #10
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1. Didn't know/care about it
2. Don't have a printer, won't have access to one, etc.
3. And I don't care about .380
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Old May 14, 2013, 01:33 PM   #11
lcpiper
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It's just a new manufacturing technique.

Yes you can argue it makes firearms manufacture easy for almost anyone. But so far I see less quality and usefulness in these then I do in a Black-Powder kit and I'd take a good crossbow over a plastic 3D printed pistol any day.

I spent almost an hour the other day trying to decide what I had in my house that i would use a 3D printer for other then a gun. Nothing actually useful came to mind that would justify a $100 purchase much less a $3,000 one. the only thing I could think of was 3D printed versions of gaming miniatures for games like D&D, Warhammer 40K, and BattleTech and I stopped playing those over 20 years ago.

Tell me I can print a new kit for replacing the parts in my toilet and I'll give it some thought.
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Old May 14, 2013, 02:44 PM   #12
444
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I didn't download the file.

However, I thought about it in order to boost the number of downloads to make it look scarier. I am pretty sure I will never own a 3D printer, I don't have much interest in the gun itself other than a political statement. My download would have been a political statement.

FWIW: this is the reason I originally got a CCW. I basically worked all the time and couldn't carry at work. The rest of the time I was asleep. But I took a CCW course as a means of casting a vote in favor of CCW. One guy doing something is no big deal, but when people see hundreds of thousands of people doing something, they take notice.
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Old May 14, 2013, 03:18 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Servo
...but I do find the whole situation somewhat amusing.
I find it more than amusing - more like hilarious! Especially if some federal agency is actually involved in getting the plans off the internet! Gee, I hope there are no plans on the net on how to build a nuke!!!

Until Kinko's gets a 3D Xerox machine & someone posts plans for a Ruger #1, I won't be doing any downloading. LOL

...bug
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Old May 14, 2013, 04:53 PM   #14
lcpiper
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Quote:
But I took a CCW course as a means of casting a vote in favor of CCW.
444, I live in AZ and don't need a CC permit but I never thought of it this way before, that there could be a reason better then not having to fill out another form for a background check for getting my CCW permit.

Thanx, I am going to go get mine as soon as I can now.
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Old May 14, 2013, 05:10 PM   #15
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Didnt download it but even if i did i wouldnt post on the internet saying i did,i have a feeling someone is interested in those that did. Besides not wanting anymore grief from big brother i have no use for that,dont have a 3d printer and wont be buying one,i get enough enjoyment out of building up parts kits.
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Old May 14, 2013, 06:00 PM   #16
Dr Big Bird PhD
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Like anyone on TFL is going to admit they downloaded it and fired the gun already.
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Old May 14, 2013, 09:34 PM   #17
TXAZ
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Tough luck Bumblebug! The credible info is out there

Bumblebug (erroneously) hoped...
Quote:
Gee, I hope there are no plans on the net on how to build a nuke!!!
(Not trying to hijack the thread I started, but...) I wrote my thesis on the ability of a terrorist to design, build and construct a gun-type nuclear weapon based upon publicly available information strictly from the Internet and published books.

Unfortunately the hopeful wish quoted above is a 'certified myth', where the information required is readily available. And in the greatest irony of all, the 'offender' who put the information necessary to build such a gun weapon was................ the US Federal Government, and one Vice President in particular. As such, the Fed's use of Defense Trade restrictions on the plastic gun referenced in this thread was a clever end-run around free speech, but in theory does not apply to transfer of the files / knowledge to "US Persons".


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Old May 15, 2013, 12:23 AM   #18
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I can't see things like this as anything other than a step in the right direction. Greater individual access to manufacturing capability, to whatever end, can lead to many unfortunate consequences... but far more often than not it can and I believe will lead to a technological renaissance where innovation is possible for anyone who's willing to take a risk on their dreams. That applies to all technological advances which trend towards empowering the individual over the collective. To name just one benefit, the more we disperse our technological base, the less likely it is that some manner of catastrophic failure of society/civilization will cause another Dark Age. Developments like affordable small-scale manufacturing make our entire way of life much more resilient.

And just for the record, mass-produced, cheaply made firearms which do not explode when used are something I see as a major net gain for human rights. It is exactly this sort of technology which breeds equality, in a way no law ever could. It means that a poor family living hand-to-mouth can have access to a means of self-defense which as of right now might otherwise cost several paychecks' worth of groceries. I support this new development as I do the efforts to deliver cheap educational materials, computers, and internet access to those who still have to make do without the modern conveniences we use every day to exercise our right to free speech. Every basic human right is and ought to be for everybody, not just the people who can afford to jump over hurdles to reach it.

I can't say I'd bother owning one except perhaps as a novelty... I've already got better. However, I wholeheartedly hope that the knowledge spreads beyond any one person, organization, or government's ability to censor it. In the end, freedom is what it's all about, and there is no freedom, no humanistic imperative I can imagine more basic and essential than the right of every single thinking, feeling being to preserve his or her own life and the ability to secure that life from the whims of those who would wish to dictate its course.
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Old May 15, 2013, 07:41 AM   #19
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I worked in aerospace a long time. I used to see parts that were produced 3d by devices very similar. They were used to test mockups and generally were of poor quality. I am sure the technology has improved but I have no interest in them.
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Old May 15, 2013, 08:49 AM   #20
TXAZ
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Good point geetarman.
If the speed, accuracy and quality was as good as contemporary processes, industry would dump billion dollar investments for these $8,000 machines.
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Old May 15, 2013, 09:03 AM   #21
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No, I don't much see the point. If I wanted to I could make a better gun in my shop far more cheaply with less resources without drawing attention to myself.
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Old May 15, 2013, 09:31 AM   #22
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Guys,

The prices are coming down on these printers. The plastic ones are actually affordable and the metal ones are getting there. Overall strength isn't great nor is durability, so I imagine they is why the design is only for .380 ACP.

The biggest threat is that "bad guys" could conceivably either buy (more likely steal) a 3D printer and create a weapon that is very cheap, disposable, and completely untraceable. There are no serial numbers to trace, not rifling to match ballistics if the gun is easily destroyed or melted down, and they can print more any time they want or need.

Most of us would consider it more of a novelty since we already have guns and most of us are law abiding citizens for the most part. We also care about the quality and reliability of our firearms. Imagine if there was no "cost" to print as many guns as you wanted and the materials needed to feed the printer were uncontrolled and very plentiful? There is a legitimate reason for concern in my opinion.
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Old May 15, 2013, 12:03 PM   #23
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Quote:
We also care about the quality and reliability of our firearms. Imagine if there was no "cost" to print as many guns as you wanted and the materials needed to feed the printer were uncontrolled and very plentiful?
Will not be. The materials are expensive. I can make several zip guns for less than half of what the cost of the printing stock would be.

Some time in the next ten years they might have a cheaper method in place, just not now.
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Old May 15, 2013, 02:28 PM   #24
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Stephen brings up a good point: A truly disposable weapon is at hand. Use once, light the integrated thermite block, drop it on site, violia, evidence (mostly) gone. If I were in law enforcement I'd be worried about the untraceable, undetectable weapons this puts in potential bad guys hands.
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Old May 15, 2013, 03:13 PM   #25
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Yeah I really don't care for it either. No need for it.
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