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Old May 5, 2013, 04:30 PM   #1
Geordieman
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Another Newbie needs help

Would someone who has used the Nosler 230grain hollow point in 45ACP kindly suggest various powder charges to use to make a suitable defense load please. Many thanks indeed.

Last edited by Geordieman; May 7, 2013 at 06:35 AM.
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Old May 5, 2013, 04:57 PM   #2
Misssissippi Dave
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I think of bullets made for accuracy and not for self defense, when I think of Nosler brand bullets . There are several companies that make hollow point bullets with only accuracy in mind. Companies like Montana Gold and Precision Delta also come to mind. If you are going to load your own SD ammo, you probably would be better off with a bullet like Gold Dot or XTP Hollow points. They are designed to expand. You do need to make certain the bullet is traveling fast enough for it to expand properly even with bullets designed with expansion in mind.

Personally when it comes to SD hollow point ammo I prefer to just rely on factory ammo. If I feel the caliber I am carrying might not penetrate enough with HP bullets, I will opt for a soft point or flat point bullet. I have even carried range ammo when I had nothing better to use. Range ammo in a gun is much better than an empty one.
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Old May 5, 2013, 06:41 PM   #3
Geordieman
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My choice of words and my inexperience at reloading caused me to not fully explain myself properly in my first post. For that I apologize Dave.

I was looking for information to work up loads for the Nosler 230grain bullet because I have been unable to find any information or load data for this particular bullet online. I was hoping that someone who has loaded this in the past could make some suggestions. Many thanks.

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Old May 5, 2013, 08:17 PM   #4
Misssissippi Dave
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Probably the reason you are having problems finding published data is normally .45 apc is not loaded with bullets heavier than 230 grain. Often this is a light bullet for .45 Colt. This bullet is probably going to be a little longer than a 230 grain is. You probably could develop a decent load for it so long as you seat the bullet as long as you can with it still fitting in the magazine and when you put it into the barrel it isn't touching the rifling. I would not use any loads near the upper end. The chances of over pressure will develop sooner than they would with a 230 grain bullet. You didn't mention if this is a lead, plated or jacketed bullet. The Nosler bullets I have loaded have all been jacketed bullets. I'm guessing yours are as well.

If you wanted to experiment you could use load information for a 230 grain Nosler bullet and an OAL of 1.255 if it works for your gun. Start at the minimum load and work up slowly. I would probably not use the highest load or even .2 grains under the highest amount of powder.

It depends on if you are looking for a softer shooting load or something heavy for hunting purposes as to which powder to use. Fast burning powders tend to give you softer shooting loads. Slower powders will increase the speed the bullet can travel and stay in safer limits. A fast powder you probably could use is W231 and a slower powder would be WSF or AA5.

I have not tried to use such a heavy bullet for .45 apc yet so I can't give you any load information I have found to work. The best I can do is give you my thoughts as to how I would go about trying to work up a load to work if I had to do it.
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Old May 6, 2013, 04:22 PM   #5
Geordieman
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I will act on your recommendations and I am very appreciative of your input Dave. Many thanks.
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Old May 6, 2013, 06:58 PM   #6
Misssissippi Dave
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Probably 1.255" OAL is going to be a tad long for a JHP. You might have to go .015" shorter to get it to fit the magazine. If the longer length does work all the way to the bottom of the magazine and doesn't hit the rifling and will chamber please do load it longer.
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Old May 7, 2013, 07:47 AM   #7
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I assume Nosler offers data for their bullet.

For actual 'defense' ammo I recommend medium-burn-rate powders that offer lessened flash/noise signature, like Silhouette, AA5, HS6, and the Vihtavuori choices like N340, N350, and 3N37.
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Old May 7, 2013, 06:47 PM   #8
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"I have been unable to find any information or load data for this particular bullet online."

You don't need it. Loading data is generic by powder type and bullet weight no matter what bullet was used to develop the book info. Simply using a different firearm has a more significant potential for differences that the bullet you use. The .45 ACP is a highly tolerant low pressure pistol round anyway, use an OAL and 'crimp' that lets your ammo feed and chamber reliability, stick with book max charges or a bit less and you'll be fine.
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Old May 8, 2013, 01:16 AM   #9
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The Nosler 230gr JHP is a new product and I can't find any data for it specifically either. I would imagine you could use data for Nosler's 230gr FMJ interchangeably with it. All the other bullet maker's use the same data for all of their bullets of the same weight and caliber, whether FMJ, JHP, flat point or whatever; they just use a different OAL for each bullet. Nosler doesn't give OAL with their data, just min and max length. Seat them in this range to a length that will function in your gun and not long enough to contact the rifling and you'll be fine. Just start low and work up to find what shoots best in your gun. Accuarate has data online for the Nosler 230gr FMJ. You could also start with published data using a different 230gr jacketed bullet and work up carefully. Of course Nosler's manual would have good data too, probably worth picking one of those up. You can never have too many manuals. A One Book, One Caliber pamphlet for 45 Auto would also include Nosler's, as well as everyone else's, data. Good for easy cross referencing, and cheap too.

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Old May 8, 2013, 06:03 AM   #10
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this is patently untrue

Quote:
...Loading data is generic by powder type and bullet weight no matter what bullet was used to develop the book info...
Data developed by bullet manufacturers is specific to their bullets.
This is why Speer, Hornady, Sierra, Rainier, Berrys, and other's data can vary so widely. Bullets are not generic.

Accurate's data is excellent (note they list the specific bullet for load).
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Old May 8, 2013, 07:52 PM   #11
Geordieman
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Thanks guys for all your comments and help. I decide to go ahead and load the following:

Remington brass, Winchester large pistol primer, 6 grains of Unique and I seated the bullet to have an overall cartridge length of 1.225. I have loaded them into my Kimber Raptor and they feed individually from the magazine with no problems, whatsoever. Proof of the pudding will come when I next visit the range.
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Old May 8, 2013, 08:51 PM   #12
Misssissippi Dave
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It should cycle well. I'm not certain how well it will do on accuracy. This is one of the reasons I work up loads to find the sweet spot. There are cleaner burning powders you could use. The trouble now is finding any of them on the shelves.

If you come across some Winchester, RWS or Starline brass, you will probably find it seems to last forever with mild to mid-range loads. I have a few pieces of Winchester brass you will have trouble reading the headstamp on. Given the right light I can do it. This is because it has been loaded many times already. .45 brass seems to get lost before it wears out. I'm not a fan of Remington pistol brass. I do keep loading them until they wear out too. I have some Federal Champion brass which uses the small pistol primers that seem to last longer then the Remington brass does. I use both the large and small primer brass. I use the same load for both. You do need to keep them separated. Some people toss the small primer brass and I wish they would just toss them my way.

Once you find a load you like you are on your way. With time you will find things that just work better for you if you are like most re-loaders. This first range trip will probably set the hook for many years of reloading. Good luck and be safe.
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Old May 9, 2013, 03:00 PM   #13
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Thanks as always Dave. I am going to use this as starting point but with the shortages of components I do not have too many options at present. When things become easier and this mad hatters tea party subsides I will buy a range of powders to experiment with. What are your thoughts on using Bullseye and Winchester 231? Are they in your inventory of powders? A friend recently gave me a bucket of Blazer mixed 45 brass and there were quite a few of the small primer cases amongst them.
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Old May 9, 2013, 05:31 PM   #14
Misssissippi Dave
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W231 will work in .45 and I have a couple of pounds of it just for those times when I run out of my favorite. I like a clean, accurate soft shooting load for range use. I normally use WST for this. It also fills the case more than most other powders do so I can see it without much effort. WSF and AA5 work well when you are loading from mid range to the upper levels. Those are about the slowest powders I normally would use. I know I could use AA7 with a 230 grain jacketed bullet but I don't think there is anything to gain over AA5 and WSF. I know of some people using Pistol Powder. They like it, but I think there is way too much flash when you are shooting in low light including some indoor ranges.

If I were to shoot lead bullets I might even think about AA2 as a powder choice for soft shooting loads.

All these powders will measure well in most powder measures. I have yet to use Pistol Powder but have heard it measures well. I have a lot of WST on hand now and Powder Valley has it in stock again as of last night. I use it for .45 with Montana Gold 185 grain JHP bullets (also in stock last night). WST is also the powder I prefer to use with a 115 grain Jacketed bullet in 9 mm. Good luck trying to find load information with that combination. I use AA5 with 124/125 grain Jacketed bullets in 9 mm. AA7 is my prefered .357 Mag. powder. AA9 will allow you to get more speed in .357 Magnum if you are wanting a hunting load.

You can use a lot of different powders with .45. I like the ones that burn cleaner and measure well. Since I use progressive presses, the consistant powder drops are important to me.
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Old May 10, 2013, 05:54 AM   #15
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While I keep many powders in stiock, when loading 45 ACP I reach first for W231.
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Old May 10, 2013, 07:08 AM   #16
Geordieman
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Thanks again Dave for all of your advice. There really is no substitute for experience and I have much to research and contemplate.
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Old May 10, 2013, 08:37 PM   #17
Misssissippi Dave
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I like chasing after a good combination in pistol loads. I also like to know which powder/ bullet combinations will work for my interests. You never know when you will find shortages in powder/ primers/bullets. It is good to have a back up plan available when these things happen. While trying to get my back up plan down I found a few different loads I preferred to use over what was my standard load. I was quite happy with W231 and a MG 185 gr. JHP bullet. I found I like WST even better. I had help working on the load for 9 mm with WST. I don't have all the answers by any means. I do like to tinker and that normally means I might find a lot of different combinations others might not care to even try. There are some people here that seem to have tried more combinations than I have even dreamed of.

Just remember to keep good notes of what you have loaded from the beginning. This is even if you only use the same load all the time. You never know when you might need to look at it again. I wish I had done that a long time ago. I once had a great load for .38 special I don't remember what it was. I now have one book of notes by my presses and another one by my computer in the house. I think I have less chance of loosing both of them at the same time this way. I put my thoughts about how they work as well as the numbers. I also write in the one I keep by the computer while at the range as I test them. I transfer that information to the one by the presses later to try to keep them with the same information. These spiral note books don't cost much and you can get them almost anywhere. One day I will probably even put the information on a CD or computer file.

I always look at the load note book before I start loading. When I check the powder drop and OAL I don't go by memory. I know my memory can make errors with numbers. The amount of WST powder I use in 9 mm is not far off from the amount I use in .45. Reversing them would not be something I care to do. It sure would be easy if I went by memory alone.
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