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Old May 2, 2013, 08:53 PM   #1
ffs1942
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M1 lubrication?

My new SG SA M1 from CMP is quite nice, but sometimes the bolt retracts enough to eject , but not enough to chamber the next rd. An old WW2 vet, competitive shooter and multiple M1 daddy advised the prob was likely due to incorrect lubrication.

This strikes me as a bit odd for a rifle that had to function in Iwo Jima sand to Korean ice, but I'm willing to try this out. I know M16's worked better in the desert if Top brought us lots of Break-Free.

I've been using light oils like Wd40. My friend says the M1 is lubed with grease, like Lubriplate and in many more places than the manual says to. I do note that M1 cleaning kits had containers for grease and not for oil.

He recommends the operating rod be heavily greased and this will likely fix the prob.

What say you?

Brian
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Old May 2, 2013, 09:00 PM   #2
plouffedaddy
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Quote:
I've been using light oils like Wd40


Quote:
What say you?
I say again. Oil (not water displacement household items) can be used in an emergency on the M1 (says so in the manual FWIW) but it does run best with a lithium based greased.
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Old May 2, 2013, 09:35 PM   #3
farnorthdan
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I use a heavy grease on mine, like high temp axle grease, you might also want to check your gas plug to make sure its tight, there are many reasons its short stroking, lubrication is one of if not they most common problem. Also op rod may be rubbing the stock somewhere but this is more common with new stocks not older ones. What type of ammo are you using, reloads, M2ball??
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Old May 2, 2013, 10:28 PM   #4
Fishbed77
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Quote:
I've been using light oils like Wd40.
Do not use WD40 on firearms. Period. Now, I'm sure someone will post here saying they've used WD40 for years on their guns and it's OK for the purpose. But guess what. They're wrong.

Now that we've cleared that up, here is the best and most thorough guide I've seen for how to properly lubricate your Garand for maximum life and performance:

http://www.garandgear.com/how-to-grease-your-m1-garand
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Old May 3, 2013, 04:52 AM   #5
Orlando
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Garand will not run on WD40
You need to apply grease to all the proper points. No need for so called high tech gun grease. Any quality wheel bearing grease is more than adequate
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Old May 3, 2013, 05:38 AM   #6
lmccrock
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Grease, yes, light coat along contact surfaces. I use Tetra. One tube lasts a long time. Also, "heavily greased" may get in the way. You can experiment, but a light coat is better.

That said, be sure you use the right ammo, M2 ball or equivalent.
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Old May 3, 2013, 06:09 AM   #7
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You can't beat good old Lubriplate!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old May 3, 2013, 06:20 AM   #8
mehavey
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Go down to the local autoparts store and get some plain old axle bearing grease. Use it sparingly in the operating rod channel. (applied into/along the channel surfaces with a Q-tip is fine), and in the opposite bearing channel inside the receiver itself.

There are some other areas while you're in there, so take as look at pics 1-5 here:
http://www.garandgear.com/how-to-grease-your-m1-garand

Again, not a glop... just a relatively thin smear.



BREAK BREAK:
What ammunition are you using?
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Old May 3, 2013, 09:12 AM   #9
kraigwy
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Clean the gun. Then examine it. Every were you see shinny spots is where the metal is rubbing on metal.

Grease the shinny spots.
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Old May 3, 2013, 09:12 AM   #10
JR_Roosa
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Quote:
Do not use WD40 on firearms. Period. Now, I'm sure someone will post here saying they've used WD40 for years on their guns and it's OK for the purpose. But guess what. They're wrong.
But-but-but...

How else can I make that spectacularly sticky glaze inside of every little crevice that is almost impossible to get out without a cutting torch or some kind of thermonuclear device?

My dad is a die-hard WD40 fan. He said they would spray it into their 1911 mags on the firing line to prevent misfeeds at matches. All of his guns are beautiful on the outside 60 years later, but holy crap, the goo that forms inside of things is unbelievable. My gunsmith had to use a reamer on one of his 1911s to get the extractor channel clean.

Back to OP: grease is good, but also you need something better to protect the metal where you don't grease it. CLP or Eezox is good. Gun oil is probably OK too if you don't live someplace that eats guns (near the ocean, high humidity, lots of rain, etc.).

-J.
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Old May 3, 2013, 10:16 AM   #11
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Do not use WD40 on your rifle!!

As for short stroking, clean off all that WD40 first. Rifle grease was meant for hot, wet conditions, oil was used for most environments. I use a lot of 10W-30 Mobil 1, works great. So clean up rifle and then use an oily patch on the metal surfaces.

If the WD40 was not gumming up the action, evidenced after the removal of WD40, and improper function, then you have an insufficient gas issue. Either the gas piston is worn or the gas cylinder is too big. A situation analogous to worn piston rings in a combustion engine.

If the rifle does not cycle after being properly cleaned and oiled, call the CMP . They should have gaged the gas cylinder and piston but if they did not, they will fix things for you.
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Old May 3, 2013, 05:50 PM   #12
ffs1942
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Bike axle grease?

I have a big tube of Phil Wood(a racer) bike axle grease. I also have a small tub of moly. I have sealed bearings on my bike and only have to replace the spring on my Beeman R9 every 3-5 yrs, so its a shame to waste this stuff. Will either be OK?

How thick should I grease the operating rod? Light and smooth or like Tammy Bakker's make-up?
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Old May 3, 2013, 05:53 PM   #13
ffs1942
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OOPS!

I copy lightly. My ammo has been HXP from CMP, some older Lake City from the LGS and some 150 gr American Eagle. The HXP has been most reliable, but the Lake City most accurate. The Lake City and the civvie American Eagle aeem a but slower than the HXP.
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Old May 3, 2013, 05:55 PM   #14
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That grease will be fine, light coat. I use a model paintbrush to apply
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Old May 3, 2013, 05:57 PM   #15
ffs1942
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OABTW!

I've been using WD40 for years on all my other guns, especially my carry pieces. No probs and I don't see the residue you guys are reporting.
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Old May 3, 2013, 06:13 PM   #16
nate45
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Lubriplate SFL-0 Gun Grease 14 oz Can

$11.99

Because Lubriplate SFL-0 was originally designed for lubricating food manufacturing machines, it's non-toxic, odorless and will not stain clothing. Similar to other Lubriplate products, SFL-0 is not susceptible to temperature fluctuations and is water resistant. Great for use on handguns or rifles. Can be applied using the included brush attached to the lid of the can, your fingers or using a 15cc syringe. Apply a light coat in accordance with the maintenance instructions found in your firearm owner's manual.

I used to use bearing grease for my Garand, 1911s, etc, but SFL-0 is much better.
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Old May 3, 2013, 06:17 PM   #17
mehavey
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WD-40's great as a solvent, water-displacer, and (very) light lubricant. It will, however,
dry to a varnish-like surface if slopped on and then left that way. Your use on a carry piece
should be OK as you probably spray on/then wipe off.

What WD-40 is not, ...is a bearing surface lubricant.

On that note, Phil Wood bicycle grease would do just fine





BREAK BREAK: We deal with deadly weapons, at 55,000+ psi operating conditions,
using explosive components, emitting toxic smoke & deadly mercury fumes... and we're
worried about using food-quality grease ?

Ya gotta love this place.

Last edited by mehavey; May 3, 2013 at 06:25 PM.
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Old May 4, 2013, 07:19 AM   #18
Bart B.
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One of the military units match conditioning Garands sprayed them down with WD40 prior to shipment to an area command for issue. The guy at the district supply center just about pooped his pants after opening the crates and seeing a thin film of rust on all 24 of those M1's metal parts. The guy at the unit that sprayed them got reprimanded.

The match conditioning unit would also take away anyone's Garand that had been lubed with Lubriplate, then instructed to only use Plastilube. If it happened the second time with that person, they would never be issued another Garand.

Best lube ever for Garands is called Plastilube; a brown medium thick grease. It's often available in surplus stores usually packaged in tiny plastic clear jars with a yellow cap on it. Or get it new:

http://www.loctite.co.uk/fullproduct...32Plasti236528

Here's where it should be applied to M1's:

Bolt locking lugs, bolt bottom (very thin) where it slides over cartridges and follower, round part at the back end and the op rod lug and flats that ride in the receiver rails.

Stock ferrule where the lower band fits around it.

Op rod channel where it rubs the bottom of the barrel.

Op rod cutout where the bolt lug fits.

Op rod's front 5 inches or so with a very thin coat to make cleaning powder residue off easier.

Op rod spring as well as the inside of the op rod (small long wire [coat hangar wire?] with a loop at one end holding a cleaning patch coated with Plastilube).

Op rod's claw at its end where it fits on the follower parts.

Bottom of the barrel where the op rod rubs.

Trigger guard's locking lugs.

Receiver's rails where the bolt lugs rub.

Receiver's groove under its hump where the bolt rubs.

Receivers notches for the trigger guard's lugs.

Receiver's rear sight elevation knob side grooves.

Receiver's grooves where the follower guides ride up and down.

Rear sight's elevation slide and base groove.

Rear sight's knobs' threaded and areas bearing on the receiver.

Hammer's top groove where the bolt rides against it.

In other words, every place where there is metal to metal contact except the trigger sear and hammer engagement parts that must be dry.
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Last edited by Bart B.; May 4, 2013 at 08:09 AM.
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Old May 4, 2013, 08:35 AM   #19
madcratebuilder
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^^^^^^^^^^^^

Bart nailed it.

I use Plastilube or lubriplate, depends on the season of the year. I like lubtiplate for cooler temps.
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Old May 4, 2013, 09:08 AM   #20
Chuck Dye
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The manual may be downloaded at

http://stevespages.com/pdf/cmp_m1_garand.pdf
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Old May 4, 2013, 04:45 PM   #21
Tuzo
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WD 40 works for its intended purpose

My brother's firearms were damaged by saltwater when his home was flooded by hurricane Sandy. Aside from immediate assistance to stabilize the damage to his home, we bought a bottle of WD 40 and sprayed every surface and seam on his firearms as soon as possible. This was done to displace saltwater and halt corrosion.

After a few months I was able begin cleaning and repairing his firearms. WD 40 worked as advertised. The WD 40 residue is waxy and protective but not a lubricant applicable to firearms. Cleaning has been easy and, despite some corrosion. the rescued firearms are slowly recovering. The remediated firearms are properly lubricated with white lithium, Mobil 1, and Breakfree CLP. WD 40 did its job.
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Old May 5, 2013, 08:11 AM   #22
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Old May 5, 2013, 02:16 PM   #23
sailskidrive
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Quote:
I've been using light oils like Wd40.


Water Displacement #40. The only oil in WD40 is Mineral Oil.

I use Brian Enos's Slide Glide... ANY grease will be better than WD40.
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Old May 5, 2013, 09:50 PM   #24
Fishbed77
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Quote:
I've been using WD40 for years on all my other guns, especially my carry pieces. No probs and I don't see the residue you guys are reporting.
I told you someone would post saying it's OK!

But it's still not. A Garand deserves much, much better.
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Old May 6, 2013, 05:49 PM   #25
P5 Guy
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There is a big difference between a lubricant and a penetrating oil.
WD-40, Kano Kroil, and the others are fine for cleaning but will do nothing to lubricate or protect from oxidation.
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