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Old April 21, 2013, 12:45 AM   #26
dalegribble
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what a country we live in! it is the only country i know that both republicans and democrats cry fowl cry fowl when they fall short of the amount of votes needed to pass their mearsures. why the hell don't we just STFU and let our govt work. if you don't like the new gun measures that have FAILED then go back and enforce the gun laws that are on the books! if you're ACTUALLY looking for new measures to make us safer you don't you adding new health laws and enforcing old ones, that is where the real problem is. or is your next measure to outlaw cooking pots?
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Old April 21, 2013, 01:34 AM   #27
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^ good post Rusty Shackleford.
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Old April 21, 2013, 06:11 AM   #28
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Who does he want to intern? Bostonians?

Chechnyans?

Russians?

Kyrgistanis? (sp?)

Muslims?

Boxers?

Furriners?

People who wear baseball caps backwards?
"Them"

It's always 'The Other'...

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Old April 22, 2013, 12:10 AM   #29
44 AMP
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Here's a novel thought, and one that if it even occurs to the anti-gunners, will never see the light of day....

Perhaps. just perhaps, those Senators didn't vote for the gun control bills because despite their high and noble sounding titles, the actual laws proposed were absolute crap.

For once, in recent history, it seems that our lawmakers not only listened to the majority of us (despite all kinds of bogus "polls"), and looked beyond what the bills were called, to what was actually in them. And what was in them not only would not have have had any effect on the recent shootings, but would have infringed on our rights, making criminals of citizens doing nothing more than what we have always done, and what it is our right to do.
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Old April 22, 2013, 11:35 AM   #30
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Perhaps. just perhaps, those Senators didn't vote for the gun control bills because despite their high and noble sounding titles, the actual laws proposed were absolute crap.
This is something I have emphasized in conversations. A false dichotomy has been created that if you don't support every bill that is proposed you are in favor of shooting up elementary schools. This was a really bad bill. I saw very little publicized about what was in the actual bill; I doubt that was an oversight.

I remember when Representative Giffords was shot, there were numerous testimonials of how she reached across the aisle, listened to, and respected other people's opinions. It seems to me that either those testimonies were false or she has abandoned her previous virtues in that regard.
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Old April 22, 2013, 11:53 AM   #31
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I remember when Representative Giffords was shot, there were numerous testimonials of how she reached across the aisle, listened to, and respected other people's opinions. It seems to me that either those testimonies were false or she has abandoned her previous virtues in that regard.
I would really love to be wrong on this, . . . but my guess is that both she and her husband (in greater or lesser degrees) are angry about what the shooting has stolen from them individually and as a couple.

Their reaction is simply to use the event as a stage from which to exact penance from those who failed in the first place to prevent these events.

In other words, . . . gun control has become a cash cow for them, . . . and they are going to run with it. No, . . . no one will ever admit or confess to that end, . . . but in the end, . . . money talks, . . . ________ walks.

May God bless,
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Old April 22, 2013, 12:12 PM   #32
lcpiper
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And I don't buy the argument that her cognitive functions are unimpaired,
I don't either.


She was shot in the head, almost died. Her friends died as did supporters.

She was traumatized, she has also been turned into a puppet by her "friends" and from what I have seen, a husband who is more then willing to throw his hat into the same ring.

I would no more rely on this women's judgment then I would allow her to sit as an impartial witness in a shooting trial. I don't doubt she had a hand in the writing of that article and her ability to think logically is at least, on this subject, seriously impaired by her emotions regarding the same.

No one should be putting any thought into what Gabby Giffords has to say about guns.

And I too am very sorry about what happened to her and the others just 70 miles from my home.


Quote:
Perhaps. just perhaps, those Senators didn't vote for the gun control bills because despite their high and noble sounding titles, the actual laws proposed were absolute crap.
Further more, I think you'll find some of the Senators who opposed this bill also oppose it on a 10th Amendment level as well. But they'll take the favors of 2A supports just as well even if that isn't why they oppose the legislation.
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Old April 22, 2013, 12:49 PM   #33
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A false dichotomy has been created that if you don't support every bill that is proposed you are in favor of shooting up elementary schools.
That's a huge part of the anti-gun playbook. If I don't support their proposals, I'm a bad person and I want blood to run in the streets.

Sandy Hook was a bonanza for them, because it gave them plenty of sock puppets to bolster that allegation.
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Old April 22, 2013, 04:29 PM   #34
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Quote:
A false dichotomy has been created that if you don't support every bill that is proposed you are in favor of shooting up elementary schools.

That's a huge part of the anti-gun playbook. If I don't support their proposals, I'm a bad person and I want blood to run in the streets.

Sandy Hook was a bonanza for them, because it gave them plenty of sock puppets to bolster that allegation.
Politics 101. I had a guy running for state rep come to my door looking for votes back in the eighties. He wanted to talk so I invited him in and offered him a beverage and a seat. After some banter about some issues I really did not care about at the time, I asked him how he felt about repealing the 55 speed limit.
He went off on some tirade about how I wanted to go speeding through school zones running over kindergartners and he would ever support a bill like that. If he had said that he didn't support it for economical, ecological or even safety reasons on the interstate that my question referred to I would have voted for him. But his illogical response lost this vote.
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Old April 22, 2013, 05:18 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by Aguila Blanca
And I don't buy the argument that her cognitive functions are unimpaired
I don't either. The bullet path, from above her left eyebrow to the back left of her skull, while not fatal or catastrophic in this case, clearly changed her personality.

WebMD has an article on her injury, which includes this:
Quote:
Nina Zeldis, PhD, taught rehabilitation medicine at Israel's Tel Aviv University for more than 20 years. She notes that people who, like Giffords, have suffered damage to the left side of the brain tend to have:

difficulty speaking and understanding speech
difficulty reading
increased impulsivity
lack of emotional control
decreased problem-solving ability
diminished long-term planning
problems with hand/eye coordination
Observing her January 2013 statement to Congress, compared to earlier videos, I can't help but think that they are showing different people.

The legal system may not recognize this as a murder, but I think that this was murder. The current Gabrielle Giffords has little interest in anything political other than gun control. Whether the anti-gun crusade is her own (a result of the executive function damage she sustained), or whether she is so mentally compromised that the gun control statement she read to Congress was fed to her by her husband or handlers, who can say.
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Old April 22, 2013, 06:40 PM   #36
Glenn E. Meyer
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Not to go off topic, but after the shooting, I recall the pundits babbling about her remarkable recovery. From school, I said to my wife that she will have serious decrements. I'm fairly sure that her stuff is being composed. Probably read to her and she approves. Terrible thing to happen to anyone.
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Old April 22, 2013, 07:05 PM   #37
L2R
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amazing

Those on the gun control side keep saying how powerful the NRA is.
They keep saying that politicians are scared of the NRA.

Has anyone ever mentioned to them in public that maybe, just maybe, they actually voted their conscience?
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Old April 22, 2013, 07:22 PM   #38
Tom Servo
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Has anyone ever mentioned to them in public that maybe, just maybe, they actually voted their conscience?
That, or fear of a backlash from their constituents. I'll take it either way.

The funny thing is, back in January we were hearing that the gun-control lobby was stomping the NRA. The NRA didn't have the juice to withstand this one, they said.

Then the gun-control lobby lost. Suddenly, the NRA is an unstoppable juggernaut again in their eyes. What they fail to realize is that when they're badmouthing the NRA, they're badmouthing an organization to which a very diverse bunch of America belongs.
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Old April 22, 2013, 07:42 PM   #39
L2R
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you may be right.

Giffords views are shared by a good friend of mine. He thinks that we are limiting progress. I believe the B of Rights is timeless. He believes laws should be made by commitee. I believe more laws creates more problems.

This was a good read. I enjoy trying to understand the other side but how is it that we cannot simply believe that the Bill of Rights trumps emotional tidalwaves. Why must we be unenlightened or unsympathetic?

I am still waiting for a voice who can deliver our message and a vehicle that carries it to the masses.
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Old April 22, 2013, 07:54 PM   #40
Armybrat
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Jack Riccardi should be hired by the NRA as a PR replacement for LaPierre - Radio talk show host on KTSA in San Antonio:

http://ktsa.com/pages/6064858.php?

This guy is the best I've heard - great credentials - not a "bomb-thrower - very reasoned and civil.
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Old April 22, 2013, 07:58 PM   #41
spaniel
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"And I don't buy the argument that her cognitive functions are unimpaired, not as a rebuttal to "Who really wrote it?". My grandmother was left in a condition much like Ms. Gifford's by a stroke. My grandmother's cognitive functions were sufficiently functional that she understood what we said to her. For her to try to express any sort of meaningful idea in words, either spoken or written, was quite another story. In fact, it never happened. She lived ten more years after the stroke, ten years that had to have been incredibly frustrating to her because my grandmother was a highly intelligent and well-educated woman who loved discussing history and philosophy. To see her sitting in her living room, unable to form ideas into words in any medium, was heart-breaking.

I don't believe for a single nanosecond that Gabby Giffords wrote that. I think her husband wrote it and she signed it."

Sorry about your grandmother.

But have you ever seen Stephen Hawking? The human brain is a mysterious thing. Injuries affect it different. You can't compare your grandmother to Giffords, way too simplistic. You don't even know that their brain injuries occurred in the same area. I have seen people completely lose the ability to speak from a stroke, but totally retain their cognitive abilities.
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Old April 23, 2013, 03:11 PM   #42
tyme
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Originally Posted by spaniel
But have you ever seen Stephen Hawking? The human brain is a mysterious thing. Injuries affect it different. You can't compare your grandmother to Giffords, way too simplistic. You don't even know that their brain injuries occurred in the same area. I have seen people completely lose the ability to speak from a stroke, but totally retain their cognitive abilities.
You realize that Hawking has ALS, which is a motor neuron disease?

A bullet traversing one hemisphere of the brain, from front to back, is going to pass through, and damage, a bunch of different areas.
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