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Old April 4, 2013, 12:40 PM   #1
Eppie
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Pro-Gun Laws Gain Ground

Hi Everyone,
Today's Wall Street Journal has an excellent article on the current state of affairs in the gun control battle.

You can read it by clicking here

Highly recommended.
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Old April 4, 2013, 01:12 PM   #2
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I get to a page, but there's no story there. Do I have to log in?
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Old April 4, 2013, 01:19 PM   #3
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There is a summary here. http://politicalwire.com/archives/20...Political+Wire)

Or you have to subscribe.
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Old April 4, 2013, 02:13 PM   #4
Eppie
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OK,
Here's what you do. Go to Google and do a search on "Pro-Gun Laws Gain Ground"

Then click on the Wall Street Journal link and you'll be able to see the whole article.
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Old April 4, 2013, 02:14 PM   #5
Glenn E. Meyer
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I read the article. My analysis is that we are seeing a polarization effect. Fundamentally progun states will enhance and anti states will ban.

Thus, it isn't like a win or loss situation in a classic sense. It is a solidification of existing attitudes.

A win would be an anti state being positive.

We might see progun folks and firms move out of anti states and then we will lock in stone the state by state differences.

The great positive would be if the SCOTUS void the CT, NY, CO type laws with a clearer statement on weapons type, background checks, etc.
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Old April 4, 2013, 02:39 PM   #6
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A polarization effect for sure, and it has been amplified by these nut job shootings. This is polarization for the sake of some political feel good measures and that is what I find the most damnable. In the worst case it leads to civil war, and civil unrest is already with us. The lack of compliance with ill conceived laws magnifies disrespect for the law. 2014 ! I think the grabbers and grabettes are really outdoing themselves this time. They are fully exposed.
Let's get ready to give the ballot box another chance.
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Old April 4, 2013, 03:41 PM   #7
Tom Servo
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Quote:
Let's get ready to give the ballot box another chance.
I'm not sure about that. After all, we gave it a chance in 2008, and the results were less than ideal. There was a great deal of hand-wringing and screaming, but the 2010 midterms didn't do much for us either. 2012 was supposed to be the "take back America" landslide, but that never materialized. In fact, it backfired in a few areas. In all three elections, voter turnout was shamefully low, and well below what pundits and analysts expected.

Will the gun issue get some folks to the polls? Perhaps, but they didn't get too fired up the last few rounds.

I really think this is going to have to be resolved through the courts.
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Old April 4, 2013, 04:18 PM   #8
Glenn E. Meyer
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I think you are correct, Tom. You see much activist involvement in so many causes - the gun folks aren't that much out there as compared to others.

The resolution will have to be in the SCOTUS with more precise definitions than the Heller and McDonald dance did. Reasonable restrictions, common usage, intrusive mental health decisions without due process, registration or schemes to establish such - should be dealt with clearly.

Not holding my breath though.
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Old April 5, 2013, 05:35 PM   #9
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Good for those states though
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Old April 5, 2013, 10:08 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenn E. Meyer
I think you are correct, Tom. You see much activist involvement in so many causes - the gun folks aren't that much out there as compared to others.
We are still our own worst enemies. There is no unified pro-gun faction. It's difficult to comprehend, but there are still "gun people" who seriously don't care about handguns or self defense or assault weapon bans because they can still have their hunting rifle.

Yes, seriously.

I'm a Vietnam veteran. I am blessed at my current work situation to be with several like-minded pro-2A, pro-gun types. But ... one of the recent hires is a former Marine, a Vietnam veteran not much younger than I am, and he shocked me a couple of weeks ago. I was in the office he shares with two other, younger guys. The Marine was out, and the three of us were discussiing pending anti-gun legislation and how terrible we thought it was, and how we all agreed that AWBs and such are contrary to the Constitution.

Mr. USMC came in part-way through the discussion, and immediately sounded off (VERY authoritatively, as only a USMC can do) to inform us that "Nobody need all those bullets. If you need a high-capacity magazine you can't shoot. Two shots, that's the most anybody should need. I hunt. I've been huntng all my life. I've never needed more than two shots."

So there's one example of someone who should be on our side, but isn't. IMHO it's orders of magnitude worse coming from a veteran, because he swore an oath to protect and to defend the Constitution, and that oath doesn't mean a thing to him. And he is very vocally and forcefully not interested in learning what the Constitution is all about.

I'll bet almost everyone on this forum knows at least one shooter or hunter who is just like that. As long as they can still have their hunting rifle or their trap and skeet guns, they'll cheerfully throw us and the 2nd Amendment under the bus.
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Old April 7, 2013, 09:05 PM   #11
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Quote:
We are still our own worst enemies. There is no unified pro-gun faction. It's difficult to comprehend, but there are still "gun people" who seriously don't care about handguns or self defense or assault weapon bans because they can still have their hunting rifle.
This is so true and will eventually spell doom for all of us.
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Old April 7, 2013, 09:41 PM   #12
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Quote:
We are still our own worst enemies. There is no unified pro-gun faction.
I disagree with this self pithy. The NRA is a unifying force. La Pierre response was totally right on. Only a good guy with a gun can stop a bad guy with a gun was a masterful response. It is a call to arms that many people have in fact responded to. People are arming themselves. That's why prices of guns have skyrocketed and ammo is in short supply.

What better confirmation could you want?
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Old April 7, 2013, 11:32 PM   #13
Aguila Blanca
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eppie
I disagree with this self pithy. The NRA is a unifying force. La Pierre response was totally right on. Only a good guy with a gun can stop a bad guy with a gun was a masterful response. It is a call to arms that many people have in fact responded to. People are arming themselves. That's why prices of guns have skyrocketed and ammo is in short supply.

What better confirmation could you want?
Did you mean "self pity"?

No self pity intended or expressed, only a realistic assessment of where we stand. LaPierre's position on armed guards in schools is complete unrelated to the core issue of gun owners who are willing to throw those of us who own guns for self defense under the bus as long as they can keep their hunting rifles and sporting shotguns. Many of these people are members of the NRA, and they would still throw us other NRA members under the bus.

I don't think my "two shots is enough for anyone" Marine co-worker is an NRA member, but I have met other NRA members who fall into the same mindset. If you don't believe they are out there, you're just not looking.
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Old April 8, 2013, 09:38 AM   #14
Eppie
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Aguila Blanca

Your Marine co-worker is entitled to his opinion, he is young and naïve. He may not realize that by surrendering his right to own hi-cap mags now would make it difficult for him later if he changes his mind.

Many young people have narrow focus or short term mind frame. It is up to older more experienced folks to offer different perspective in a constructive manner, so that they don't feel like they are being attacked. Depending on your approach, you may be able to show him that he may want to keep his options open and not give up his right in willy-nilly kind of way.
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