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Old April 1, 2013, 04:13 PM   #26
Gaerek
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If the brass is ejecting and a new round is feeding it is not malfunctioning. If you want a pretty pile of brass at 4 O'clock carry a tuned 1911 if you want a modern fighting gun carry a Glock.
QFT

I love 1911's, but for an EDC, defensive handgun, I'll go with a Glock every time, Gen 4 or not. People give Glock crap for BTF, but if it were an XD or an M&P, they'd be given a pass. "Oh, you must have a bad one. Send it back, they'll make it right."

Instead it's, "See, Glocks suck because every 100 rounds you get brass thrown right back at you! Pffftt, Perfection my derriere!" It's still a limited issue.

Most Gen 4s don't even have the issue, but there are some here who would (wrongly) say they do, just to prove a point. Mine did it for 500 rounds. I now can't remember the last time it did it, but it's been 1000's of rounds, and over a year. Oh, and I never had to change anything out.
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Old April 1, 2013, 05:06 PM   #27
Constantine
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+1 Gaerek.

Mine did though, I have had literally a dozen Glocks. I replaced my gen4 19 with a gen3 like the rest of mine. Excluding the gen2 G22.

Love them all. And the +1 is huge towards people with a chip on their shoulder towards Glock. Whatever the reason they have or think they have. You're right.
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Old April 1, 2013, 05:12 PM   #28
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tahats why I dont swap it in for another one. Its toooo accurate. I checked mail awhile ago, maybe tomorrow I'll get the ejector. And maybe that'll fix it. yes its too minor of a problem to complain about but if it gets better that will be even better. Sure I have other pistols but this one is by far my most accurate (for me) and my most chosen one. Ive prob shot around 2000-3000 rds and about every 1 out of 80 still hits me in the face. (very minor) But other guns all have flaws we'll see what happens after ejector comes in.
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Old April 1, 2013, 05:47 PM   #29
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My new 19 barrel and slide are in transit to its new frame
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Old April 1, 2013, 05:57 PM   #30
eviltravis
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I have a gen4 model 17. It's my fifth glock - I generally love these things. Unfortunately my new gen4 gave me the brass to the face treatment. I noticed what looked like a casting burr along the edge of the extractor hook, so I called Glock about it the first week I owned it. They referred me to my local Glock armorer, whom I went to visit. I showed him the pistol and explained what I thought the problem might be. I even compared the extractor to one he had in stock that did not have a burr, but sadly the man had no desire to repair my pistol under warranty. He said that casting burrs on the extractor were normal, and that my shooting technique was suspect! (Limp wristing, ammo choice, etc) He would replace it for me anyway, if I paid him for the part and the labor. I went home and called glock again - they offered to look the pistol over if I paid the freight. At this point I lost patience with the whole process and ordered an extractor from Glockmeister.com.

The pistol works great - Issue resolved. I've put a out 1200 rounds through it I the new extractor with no brass to the face.

Glock pistols = awesome (even the gen4 after some love)

Glock service left something to be desired.

I did go back to the glock armorer and tell him I solved the problem. He was jackass enough to mention that I voided my warranty by taking the slide apart and replacing the extractor myself. You can't beat that kind of customer service.
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Old April 2, 2013, 12:50 AM   #31
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And just to add another thing. BTF is annoying, for sure. And for sure, I'd prefer not to have it. But if you're in a shooting situation, I can pretty much guarantee you will never notice if a single piece of brass bounces off your nose. You will be target fixated, and be too worried about the other metal (copper jacketed lead) that's being thrown at your face by your threat.
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Old April 2, 2013, 04:02 AM   #32
ZIA
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Personally I've put thousands of rounds through Glocks and have never had that issue happen but I was at a range last year where a girl was shooting a Glock 19 (Gen 3 I think) & the casing flew at her face and got stuck between her safety glasses & the side of her face. It left a pretty bad little burn on her.
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Old April 2, 2013, 08:20 AM   #33
deckard
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I had no idea erratic brass ejection behavior was something to complain about.
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Old April 2, 2013, 09:12 AM   #34
Strafer Gott
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All of my Glocks flip the empties right back in the box to await reloading.
Obviously all those danged Colts,Smiths, etc. are sadly lacking in perfection.
I guess you better send them all back.
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Old April 2, 2013, 10:36 AM   #35
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Obviously all those danged Colts,Smiths, etc. are sadly lacking in perfection.
I guess you better send them all back.
etc?...lol.
This is not a hard fix. This isn't a sports team that dominated an era argument.
This brass to the face is down on my list of necessity.
Reliability is number one and this Glock is totally reliable.

No one is trying to pick it apart, Easy fix for those that have the problem.
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Old April 2, 2013, 10:50 PM   #36
Constantine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deckard View Post
I had no idea erratic brass ejection behavior was something to complain about.
Can you see that slide move back and forth with your naked eye? It isn't as easy as chasing a blade of a fan on the "low" setting. When that gun ejects casings straight back at your face, even with eye protection. It doesn't tickle.
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Old April 3, 2013, 06:53 AM   #37
greyeyezz
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And just to add another thing. BTF is annoying, for sure. And for sure, I'd prefer not to have it. But if you're in a shooting situation, I can pretty much guarantee you will never notice if a single piece of brass bounces off your nose. You will be target fixated, and be too worried about the other metal (copper jacketed lead) that's being thrown at your face by your threat.
I'll play. Your in a shooting situation and a hot piece of brass nails you in the eye, now your down to one. Not good.

The whole point of this problem is not just BTF it's improper ejection which can lead to malfunctions.
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Old April 3, 2013, 10:20 AM   #38
Gaerek
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I'm not playing anything.

1) BTF is a limited issue on a limited number of guns.
2) Even guns that have the problem, we're talking a 1/50, tops, problem, most are running in the 1/100 range (as far as frequency of BTF is concerned).
3) It's an easy (usually free, or cheap) fix for almost all guns that have the problem. There are a very small number, that for some reason, no matter what you try the problem doesn't go away. I've only seen maybe 2 or 3 mentioned here, other forums, and anywhere online that simply couldn't be fixed (one of those has posted on this thread)
4) The chances that the piece of brass hit your eye is relatively small, compared to the relatively large target for the brass that we call your head
5) And of course, your chances of being in a gunfight are very small as it is

Put all those factors together, and we're talking about a problem (hitting eye with hot brass during an actual gun fight) that is nearly statistically insignificant.

Of course, we can play the "What If?" game all day. Show me some hard facts (this exact event actually occurring) and we'll talk. Until then, for most people it's just not a huge problem. It's annoying, but hardly life threatening in almost every circumstance. I could say you might have a chance at getting a double charged factory load in your defensive ammo. Wouldn't want to get that round in a gun fight. I'd imagine there's as much chance of that happening as a hot piece of brass bouncing off your eyeball in a gunfight. But of course, I'm playing "What If?" now...

I like to work with fact, not conjecture.

And before anyone calls me out for being a Glock fanboy, well maybe I am. But then again, I also see a trend. People report BTF in a Glock, and now Glocks must be bad guns.

Yet, early XDs had a problem with barrel lugs breaking. I've seen M&P's (2, in the same day, literally every other round) with a worse BTF problem than any Glock I've ever seen. I've seen a mag catch break on an SR9 (I think). That was a funny one. Guy reloaded hit the mag release, mag dropped, then he stuck a new mag in, fired a shot, and the mag dropped out. These are all far worse problems than what a Glock has...yet everytime I see these things get mentioned, the guns get a pass. "Oh, you must have a defective gun! XDs (or M&Ps, or SRs or whatever) are great guns, so you must have a lemon!" But a Glock throws brass at you every 2 boxes of ammo, and all Glocks must suck...

Last edited by Gaerek; April 3, 2013 at 11:49 AM.
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Old April 3, 2013, 12:38 PM   #39
sigxder
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It is not a few Glocks having the problems. I see more of the G19's made in the past few years that do it than don't. If it were a small problem why has Glock gone through 4-6 new RSA designs, a new ejector, and now going back to a straight extractor? Not to mention replacing guns which they cannot fix. Of which I have had several. Some didn't work out of the box. Some were good for a few hundred to a couple of thousand rounds before trouble showed up. A hot piece of brass in the eye during a gunfight will at least temporarily blind you in one eye. That is a problem!
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Old April 3, 2013, 02:58 PM   #40
Gaerek
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I see more of the G19's made in the past few years that do it than don't.
Allow me to fight anecdotal evidence with anecdotal evidence:

I see more of the G19's made in the past few years that don't do it, than do.

You have some facts to back it up? I know I don't. I can only go with what I see. Online, I see approximately an equal number of people saying they have a problem than saying they don't have a problem. Considering that people are FAR more likely to complain about a problem they do have than talk about a problem they don't have, I'd say we're still looking at a fairly small percentage of guns with the problem. I'm aware of the design changes. I'm aware that there is a problem. My Gen 4 G19 did it for about 500 rounds, but it's been thousands of rounds since I've seen one. One of the big points I've been making is that people will immediately point to this particular problem as the reason why Glock is no good. But they'll give other manufacturers a pass for any problems, even documented problems with a relatively significant percentage of guns that have it.

For some reason, people hate Glocks, and THIS is the problem they always go to. It's relatively minor, all things considered. I really hope Glock fixes it, but this is one issue that wouldn't sway me from buying a gun.

Quote:
A hot piece of brass in the eye during a gunfight will at least temporarily blind you in one eye.
I already commented on this:

Quote:
Put all those factors together, and we're talking about a problem (hitting eye with hot brass during an actual gun fight) that is nearly statistically insignificant.
Could it happen? Certainly, but the chances are very slim. I'd say there are other problems that could occur, with Glocks or other guns, that are just as, if not more, likely to occur.
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Old April 3, 2013, 07:12 PM   #41
greyeyezz
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If it was such a limited problem do you think a company like Apex Tactical would risk designing and manufacturing an extractor specifically for Gen 3 and Gen 4 Glocks to address the issue?

And no I'm not a Glock hater my G32 is my favorite handgun.
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Old April 3, 2013, 07:32 PM   #42
Constantine
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Pump the brakes there buddy. Nothing was ever wrong with the gen3 nation wide.
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Old April 3, 2013, 07:57 PM   #43
Wreck-n-Crew
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We need to stop all this gun calling around here it's gonna get you no-where!

It's one of those things that get's too touchy, call my wife what you want but don't talk about my gun!

Now settle down before someone from the ATF comes knocking at your door and you have to call the martians to come bail you out!
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Old April 3, 2013, 09:04 PM   #44
Constantine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wreck-n-Crew View Post
We need to stop all this gun calling around here it's gonna get you no-where!

It's one of those things that get's too touchy, call my wife what you want but don't talk about my gun!

Now settle down before someone from the ATF comes knocking at your door and you have to call the martians to come bail you out!
Pump the brakes buddy. No ones getting serious here. Don't be so dramatic.

You mad bro?

Here's my Glock 19.



God I love those HD's.
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Old April 4, 2013, 10:03 AM   #45
Strafer Gott
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They sure look great for contrast. Is this the normal sight picture with the ball in the middle?
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Old April 4, 2013, 01:20 PM   #46
BuckRub
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UPDATE- just got my ejector and put it in and took about 100 bullets outside and couldn't be happier. Everyone of them go out about three feet to the right at about 3 o'clock. No more hard scrapes either on the front of the brass which use to they all had after being shot. Tried about 5 different commercial brands and two different kinds of reloads. All shot flawlessly. If you're having problems I would suggest you change recoil spring and ejector. Just a shame when you have to argue, pay out of pocket and wait an eternity to get if right.
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Old April 4, 2013, 01:39 PM   #47
zincwarrior
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Interestingly, when I first acquired my M&P it did the same thing, with nearly every round (bouncing off the top of my hat's bill). It was like a game. Watch this!

However, after about two hundred rounds it quit doing it.
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Old April 4, 2013, 01:47 PM   #48
BuckRub
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mine never ended until after installing the ejector. Like I said earlier I shot about 2000-3000 rounds earlier maybe more. Now it puts brass in a single pile basically about 3 foot away in the 3 oclock position. Really happy now
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Old April 4, 2013, 02:29 PM   #49
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Glad it worked out.
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Old April 4, 2013, 03:27 PM   #50
Constantine
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They sure look great for contrast. Is this the normal sight picture with the ball in the middle?
Yes sir! They're nice!

Buckrub, congrats man. Sorry you had to go through that. I sold off my G19 gen4 for the same issue. I just didn't want to tinker with it. Also, a card of honesty. I got over the stippling on it too.

I wouldn't hesitate to get another gen4 and tinker with it too. I liked the feel of it, recoil of it, and it's mag release.

Here I am shooting my gen 4.
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