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Old March 19, 2013, 04:05 PM   #1
Skitter
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Bullet Types

So for my usage with the .30-30 and the .270 I am planning on using something along the lines of the Sierra Soft Point for simplicity sake.

For my .40 and 9mm:

Trouble I am having is bullet types and definitions, which I have found some help on. I noticed FMJ are really only for target shooting, while JHP are for more defensive type loads? Is the JHP round going to be as effective as the Hydrashocks I have for home defense, or is it recommended never to do home loads for personal defensive rounds? That being said, if I pretty much copy the bullet and powder weights from the hydrashocks, is this going to be pretty comparable training round for me to get used to at the range, so that I don't have to burn $30 per 20 rounds?

I am trying to use the less is better terms and I would like to only have to buy 1 set of bullets for each caliber until I find one I like. I don't necessarily want to have 2 different bullet types and loads for my .40, Other than the cost difference is it frowned upon to use JHP at the range?

Last edited by Skitter; March 19, 2013 at 04:47 PM.
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Old March 19, 2013, 04:46 PM   #2
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What does Hydrashocks have to do with the .270 winchester? I can't recommend Hydrashocks for your .270 win dude.
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Old March 19, 2013, 04:47 PM   #3
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Heh, opening post edited, I ment for my .40 and 9mm
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Old March 19, 2013, 06:58 PM   #4
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Here is how I look at it. I have all my xd 40 mags filled with factory home defense loads. When I go to the range I unload the clips with my reloads. I reload whatever 40 cal bullet I can get the best deal on; 150, 155, 180, 185, fmj, jhp, jft and go to the range with a good supply. Right now with the way things are going it is almost impossible to find bulk jacketed bullets to reload so i get what i can and keep shooting. Others may no agree, but while I hand load excellent rounds for all my guns, when it comes to life and death the nod just goes to the factory loads especially in a semi auto handgun. I have never had an issue with jhp at the range.
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Old March 19, 2013, 08:38 PM   #5
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Gundog5, I like how you specified xd40!! That is my edc.

Anyway, I reload 9 and 40 the most. I also have a lot of whatever I can find cheapest bullets. And I mean a lot... 155,165,180....115,124,125,147 grains. Hollow points, flat points, round nose, truncated cone, hollow base etc. some lead and jacketed. However most of them are plated. Usually rainier or Berrys. Now I have favorites that I have more of like rainier 165g fp in the 40 and 115g hp and 147g rn for the 9mm. I target shoot with everything and compete with hollow points 99% of the time. As far as carry goes I use hornady critical defense at the moment and that's because they were free. I don't know if any of that helps lol but that's what I'm doing at the moment.
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Old March 20, 2013, 10:28 AM   #6
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Skitter, your Hydrashocks are just one brand of JHP. They give it a cool name to help differentiate it from their competition, but it's still a jacketed hollow point.

To replicate commercial loads, while most of the time you can get an equivalent bullet, you'll have a tough time with the powder charge. You're not going to know what the exact powder is, because commercial ammo manufacturers don't use the cannister powders we do.

The best way to do it is to get a chronograph and measure how fast your commercial loads are out of your gun (average velocity of at least 10 shots). Then use your preferred powder to match that velocity.

If you don't want to buy a chronograph and can't borrow one, then try to match velocities using authoritative load data. By "authoritative" I mean data from Hodgdon, Alliant, etc, not data from Bubba's Shooting Blog.
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Old March 21, 2013, 07:41 AM   #7
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Cool, that's good info guys. I was planning on just buying either the Seirra's or the Hornady XTP (same 155gr bullet avail, hydrashock is 155gr bullet weight) and using those primarily as my load bullet. Like I said I don't want to have to buy multiple kinds of bullets until I figure out what I am doing. It looks like for reloading the JHP isn't mush more expensive than the FMJ boxes.
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Old March 21, 2013, 08:07 AM   #8
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Quote:
That being said, if I pretty much copy the bullet and powder weights from the hydrashocks, is this going to be pretty comparable training round for me to get used to at the range, so that I don't have to burn $30 per 20 rounds?
How do you know what powder is used in Hydrashocks? How will you be sure that you get the correct charge weight? You will need to pick a powder, start at the suggested starting load and work up.
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Old March 21, 2013, 08:16 AM   #9
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As stated, Hydrashocks are nothing more than a marketing tool used by Federal for a pretty average hollow point (at best).

I'm in the camp of not worrying about replicating powder charge if you are trying to use reloads to train with instead of factory. To me, point of impact is much more important than worrying about FPS.

Odds are, your recoil is going to be relatively similar across the board if your POI are nearly identical.

I also have no issue using handloads as SD rounds so long as you are using a quality and proven projectile (like an XTP, for example) and a load that puts that projectile in the velocity range that will optimize performance.
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Old March 21, 2013, 08:21 AM   #10
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As far as answering your other questions,

Typically FMJ are for range use. Obviously the military uses them for a couple of reasons (reliability of function, rules of engagement), but by in large we use FMJ for plinking loads.

HP's are typically for defensive use, although many competitive shooters use them because they tend to be more accurate (FMJ points are subject to a lot of abuse and distortion), and HP's don't ricochet off of steel like FMJ's do. I've never heard of a range that frowned on using HP's - most actually prefer them because they don't penetrate berms nearly to the degree that HP's do or ricochet like FMJ rounds can.

Precision Delta makes some good HP's for general shooting at a pretty decent price. I'm sure other manufacturers do as well, but if I'm going to buy JHP's for range time, I go with Precision Delta and hope I'm buying in the middle of a run.
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Old March 21, 2013, 08:33 AM   #11
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They do have a decent selection of HP's but not for .40 :P All they have for .40 is FMJ
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Old March 21, 2013, 08:34 AM   #12
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2nd Question...

Bigger bullet = less recoil?
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Old March 21, 2013, 08:52 AM   #13
Sure shot wv
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Skitter, I've noticed that powder choice makes the biggest difference in FELT recoil. For example I use autocomp the most and if I'm running a full power load the recoil is almost like a quick snap. Where other powders are more of a push. Now on some of my competition rounds in 9mm which are a lot lighter autocomp compared to 700x has less muzzle rise and feels completely different. I get very good velocity and super clean burns with autocomp and I like how it feels in MOST of my 40 loads. I do not like it with lead bullets though.

I guess what I'm saying is I've noticed powders have a sweet spot you could say. For me it's all been trial and error. The right powder and bullet weight vs charge weight is a fun game lol. I went through 16 different loads last week getting my magic one for a 115g hp from rainier. But that's the fun part right!
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Old March 21, 2013, 09:12 AM   #14
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Cool, I'm planning on starting with Ramshot True Blue or IMR SR4756 if I can find any...
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Old March 21, 2013, 09:28 AM   #15
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Quote:
2nd Question...

Bigger bullet = less recoil?
Generally, heavier bullets pushed to max loads will have more recoil than lighter bullets pushed to max loads but, in most handgun loads, the difference attributed to JUST bullet weight is minimal.

40SW as an example, 135gr and 180gr, using Hodgdons fastest data for both and a 32 ounce gun, recoil impulse is 1.06 versus 1.07, velocity is 17.11 versus 17.19 and free recoil energy is 9.10 versus 9.17.

The powder can make a HUGE difference though. The pressure at the muzzle contributes to "rocket effect" after the bullet exits and essentially uncorks a very high-pressure bottle. The above numbers don't account for that factor, at all.

Just to make sure one important point about velocity is clearly understood, it is VERY dangerous to go chasing a velocity with just any old powder just because you know that a certain bullet weight can reach it. It might be able to reach it, but maybe not with EVERY powder and quite possibly not with MOST powders. Make sure you're using a powder that has published data that reaches the velocity you want and STAY WITHIN that published data. I think that's implied by the previous posts but it's very important.
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Old March 21, 2013, 10:06 AM   #16
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So I'm starting to get a glimmering of the idea that especially with JHP's you need to have a certain velocity come in to play for them to perform correctly?
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Old March 21, 2013, 10:17 AM   #17
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Theoretically, that's true with HPs. In reality, most modern bullets will perform across the entire range of a cartridges abilities and, more importantly, the difference between a starting load and max load is often under 100 fps, which isn't going to effect the bullet's performance all that much.
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Old March 21, 2013, 10:18 AM   #18
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Understood.

I see alot of load data that says for instance 7.9 or 8.2gr of powder. Most powder scales I have seen, only go per grain and not to the tenths of grains? How would you measure that specific of a powder measurement?
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Old March 21, 2013, 10:27 AM   #19
Brian Pfleuger
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I think you misinterpret the scales abilities. All reloading scales read to 0.1 grain or, occasionally, better. The vast majority are 0.1 grain.
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Old March 21, 2013, 10:29 AM   #20
Skitter
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Oh, I was looking at this one as I was planning on buying the kit it comes in:

http://leeprecision.com/powder-handl...-powder-scale/

I couldn't figure out how it would read 1/10 grain
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Old March 21, 2013, 10:34 AM   #21
Brian Pfleuger
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"Sensitive and readable to 1/20th of a grain"

I assume it's marked in 1/10th grain increments and 1/20th is "between the lines".
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Old March 21, 2013, 10:36 AM   #22
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I guess that's something you have to see it in your hands and read the manual for
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Old March 21, 2013, 10:48 AM   #23
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Maybe. Here's an example.


50IIIIIIIII51
.....^.....

Those lines are on a scale and are 0.10 grain increments. 1/10th grain. 1/20th of a grain is 0.05gr, 1/2 as much as 0.10 grain.

The arrow is between the lines. It is therefore indicating an increment of 0.05, 1/20th, of a grain.

In this case, it reads 50.35gr

(At least at my screen resolution)
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Old March 21, 2013, 10:50 AM   #24
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Gotcha, I'll be yelling for help whenever I get my kit anyways I assume... I have 1 guy around here that was going to call me whenever he started reloading his .357, he does cowboy action shooting and casts his own bullets. Should be interesting to learn from him.

Having issues finding anybody else
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Old March 21, 2013, 09:50 PM   #25
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Skitter, I had one of the lee safety scales you are considering buying. It was the most aggravating powder scale I have ever used. Need a magnifying glass to adjust it. It bounces forever. It sticks. In general, red and black junk. Do yourself a favor and buy a good scale.
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