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Old March 17, 2013, 05:23 PM   #26
manta49
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Lol I find it humorous when foreigners watch the news and think America is a horrible place. I could make assumptions of ireland as well.
The first mistake is to call it Ireland as if its one jurisdiction. There is N Ireland and The Republic of Ireland. N Ireland is part of the UK and has different laws police force- army- education system -health care -firearms laws etc. In NI police are armed the ROI police are not. And of course crime rates and ways of recording crimes are different. Its a bit like people talking about American gun laws as if all the states have the same laws. PS American tourists are in Belfast all the time and crime or fear of crime would not prevent me from visiting America.

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Old March 17, 2013, 08:41 PM   #27
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Manta, I'm currently in transition location wise but I'm sure I speak for a lot of us here when I say if you ever end up across the pond come on out and visit us out west. We will be happy to show you why we call it "God's country" out here, then you can reassure roadrocket.
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Old March 18, 2013, 10:04 AM   #28
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don't get me wrong i love shooting been shooting over 50 years i just find it disturbing that so many people feel the need to have a gun for home defence i find it sad to have to think that way. i worked for the american goverment for 8 years and got on well with every one.
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Old March 18, 2013, 10:23 AM   #29
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While you think we "need" these for home defense, most of us see it as having the right to be able to defend our own life rather than be at the mercy of predators, cops and the clock.

Many of us Americans find it very disturbing that there are societies that find it acceptable to have limited rights to self defense.

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Old March 18, 2013, 10:37 AM   #30
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roadrocket wrote:
Quote:
i just find it disturbing that so many people feel the need to have a gun for home defence i find it sad to have to think that way.
And yet you don't find it disturbing/sad that most in your country feel the need have locks on the doors of your homes and your cars in order to feel secure?
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I think that one of the notions common to the anti-gunner is the idea that being a victim is 'noble'; as if it is better to be noble in your suffering than disruptive in your own defense.
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Old March 18, 2013, 11:26 AM   #31
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this is getting away from the question i asked which was how many people have had to use their shotgun in a home defense situation which i thought was a straight forward question.
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Old March 18, 2013, 11:39 AM   #32
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The why make a statement like that?
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I think that one of the notions common to the anti-gunner is the idea that being a victim is 'noble'; as if it is better to be noble in your suffering than disruptive in your own defense.
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Old March 18, 2013, 11:49 AM   #33
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And you got off topic when you brought up vacation plans after folks replied to your thread. What does my having two shotguns for home defense against burglars have to do with you vacationing as a tourist?

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Old March 18, 2013, 12:34 PM   #34
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I use a HD shotgun and I've never had to fire it. I also have a generator in case the lights go out and a fire extinguisher next to my wood stove, just in case. Oh yeah I wear a seat belt in the car and so does my family. My home defense shotgun is a great backup firearm in case my deer gun goes down in season.

I'm a police officer and I can tell you that a majority of violent crime in this great land is confined to the criminal element, they rob and murder each other in the inner city. Then there are the junkies who rob and break into the homes of every day people. The junkies are the zombies of our society and are driven by narcotics. Aside from the prescription pill addictions and meth, most narcotics are imported from foreign lands. Making it legal won't change anything because right now heroin is cheaper then a six pack of beer. The third category are the criminally insane acts that make headlines but are very rare.
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Old March 18, 2013, 12:55 PM   #35
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Quote:
shotgun in a home defense situation.
Why shotgun.

Quote:
We will be happy to show you why we call it "God's country" out here, then you can reassure roadrocket.
Appreciate that.
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Old March 18, 2013, 01:23 PM   #36
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I think some of the issues you have mentioned is that many of us would rather have it and not need it, than need it and not have it.

With a country of 330 million you have responses from less than 30 who may or may not have used their shotgun in defense.

Come on over, you will enjoy the visit.

(I prefer to shoot 'em with my 45 )
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Old March 18, 2013, 03:32 PM   #37
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i just find it disturbing that so many people feel the need to have a gun for home defence i find it sad to have to think that way. i worked for the american goverment for 8 years and got on well with every one.
Most of the time people in government positions must undergo thorough background checks, so I am not too worried about them... However, there are criminals in every population, and I would prefer to be prepared than simply hope that nothing will happen. Do I feel like I will ever need to use a firearm for defense? No, I don't think I will. But I feel much more comfortable knowing that I have the means to defend myself.

My gun safe is in my room, and I unlock it and leave the door closed at night when I go to bed. 3 of the 4 firearms that are stored in the door are left "cruiser ready" in case I need them. I also have a handgun with a loaded chamber on my bedside table. (Remember, a handgun is there to help you fight your way to a real gun )



I have only once grabbed a gun with the thought that I would have to defend my home. There were two people sneaking around my house, I saw them peeking through my brother's bedroom window as I checked in on him one night. I immediately called the police and grabbed my pistol, but I believe they saw me as I saw them and they were gone when the police arrived.

I have used that shotgun to kill a couple of coyotes around the house recently, though.
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Old March 18, 2013, 03:36 PM   #38
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I've looked back through the responses and have noted some things.
Only one shot fired in anger at a human being (pistol), no damage to said human.
Several successful shows of force, shotgun in hand, no shots fired because, using good judgement, it wasn't needed. With our laws likely many of the show of force situations could have been justification for firing at and killing the BG's. Multiple instances where humans were protected from animals, shots fired, and effective.

IMHO this show's two things.
One, HD weapons, especially shot guns are an effective deterrent, even without creating holes in humans.
Two, even when given the opportunity of firing on a human within the law's boundaries the folks who have responded have shown good judgement and restraint in not pulling the trigger.
This pretty clearly shows the firearms making the situation safer in every circumstance.
I guess I don't understand how this makes you more worried to be here.
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Old March 18, 2013, 05:35 PM   #39
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I think this guy is stringing us along. He can't answer what part of Ireland he is from it matters because talking about the crime figures in Ireland doesn't make sense. I still don't know why he is talking about a shotgun you can use any firearm for self defence.
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Old March 19, 2013, 07:50 AM   #40
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i am stringing nobody along and its no secret i live in co cork as regards shotguns its because i mainly read the shotgun forum and the home defense subject comes up regularly i suppose its just horses for courses i did not set out to upset anybody with this thread.we are all shooting folk after all.
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Old March 19, 2013, 08:23 AM   #41
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I was not at all upset, offended or surprised by this thread. I have an old friend that is from Ireland and he was, unlike you, very against anyone owning or using a weapon. I had the worst time trying to understand his position, especially considering the history of Ireland being subjugated at times by their nearest neighbors. I certainly would not have to explain to you the abuses that occurred during some of these "occupations" or even colonializations. He also seemed perfectly comfortable with the state or government having all the power and being responsible for protecting him. He felt safe that way, I absolutely would not. I don't find either position sad really, just different. My conclusion was it was the difference in culture that was mostly responsible. We don't have the same feudal background as Ireland, so we are not as comfortable with the "lords" or the chosen few having all he power over a normal, everyday citizen. We tend to feel safer with less dependence on a central power while some other cultures feel safer with power being concentrated in the hands of the few.

*edit* I just read this and found that it sounded sort of insulting, which was not my intent. What I am trying to say is some people feel safer when they know most of the power and responsibility is held by those they trust in government or the police or military because they think their fellow citizens being armed is not worth the risk that those fellow citizens might irresponsibly use their weapons.
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Old March 19, 2013, 02:14 PM   #42
manta49
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i am stringing nobody along and its no secret i live in co cork as regards shotguns its because i mainly read the shotgun forum and the home defense subject comes up regularly i suppose its just horses for courses i did not set out to upset anybody with this thread.we are all shooting folk after all
No problem i know were you are coming from. I have asked similar questions on the forum. It seems to be a American thing i don't feel the need to have a firearm for self defence even with the troubled history of N Ireland. Different cultures different ways of looking at things.
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Old March 19, 2013, 08:26 PM   #43
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I went to a donnybrook and a football game broke out.

or was that? I went to a fight and a hockey game broke out?
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Old March 19, 2013, 09:14 PM   #44
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Good summary Scrubcedar.
I'd add, regarding shotguns vs. lighter weapons:

1) A shotgun is (IMHO) more intimidating than a rifle because you CAN see down the barrel when its a couple inches from your face (first hand experience
2) A shotgun's physical size and weight also make it a non-lethal albeit formidable club type weapon - be it a whop-up-side-the-head or as a quick jab extender
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Old March 20, 2013, 10:25 AM   #45
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I was poked straight in the sternum by a carbine once. Nearly lost control of my legs it hurt so bad.
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I think that one of the notions common to the anti-gunner is the idea that being a victim is 'noble'; as if it is better to be noble in your suffering than disruptive in your own defense.
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Old March 20, 2013, 10:49 AM   #46
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just to finish i am sure you have a wonderful country if i do visit i will just remember not to knock on anyone's door unexpected peace and goodwill to everyone.
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Old March 20, 2013, 12:55 PM   #47
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Looks like a perfect "And with that..." moment...

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