The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Hide > The Art of the Rifle: Semi-automatics

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old March 20, 2013, 03:49 PM   #1
SC4006
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 27, 2012
Location: New Hampshire
Posts: 328
Question about "CMP" Garands

Hello, it seems that whenever someone talks about buying an M1 Garand, someone mentions CMP, so I checked them out. I have a question about this, how are they able to sell Garands for about $500-$600 when everytime i've seen one in a gunshop its been $900+? Also, how long would you guys say they will have service grade M1's available? For $625 i'd be really interested in getting one, but now is not really a good time for me to buy any guns, so how long could I wait to get one?
__________________
Army National Guard Infantry Nov. 2013 - Pesent

They say 5 out of 4 people are bad at math, but what do I know?
SC4006 is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 04:06 PM   #2
NWPilgrim
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 29, 2008
Location: Oregon
Posts: 2,150
These are direct govt surplus, and CMP is non-profit org set up to sell them as well as run the Camp Perry shooting and the overall Civilian Marksmanship Program. What see at gun shows are ones that were at some time bought from CMP and now are being re-sold.

No telling about how long they will keep selling. Their newsletter says they have a backlog of 12,000 rifles and only filling mail order sales for now.
__________________
"The ultimate authority ... resides in the people alone. ... The advantage of being armed, which the Americans possess over the people of almost every other nation ... forms a barrier against the enterprises of ambition."
- James Madison
NWPilgrim is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 05:31 PM   #3
tahunua001
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 21, 2011
Location: Idaho
Posts: 6,101
what NW pilgrim said^^^
__________________
ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar.
I never said half the crap people said I did-Albert Einstein
You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin
Bean counters told me I couldn't fire a man for being in a wheelchair, did it anyway. Ramps are expensive.-Cave Johnson.
tahunua001 is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 05:44 PM   #4
kraigwy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 16, 2008
Location: Wyoming
Posts: 9,447
The federal law enacted in 1996 (Title 36 U. S. Code, 0701-40733) that created the Corporation for the Promotion of Rifle Practice and Firearms Safety, Inc. (CPRPFS, the formal legal name of the CMP) mandates these key “functions for the corporation:

(1) To instruct citizens of the United States in marksmanship;

(2) To promote practice and safety in the use of firearms;

(3) To conduct competitions in the use of firearms and to award trophies, prizes, badges, and other insignia to competitors.

The law specifically states: In carrying out the Civilian Marksmanship Program, the corporation shall give priority to activities that benefit firearms safety, training, and competition for youth and that reach as many youth participants as possible.

This program has been in existence since 1903, Started by President T. Roosevelt. Prior to 1996 it was run by the Army under the Division of Civilian Marksmanship. It was then "National Board for the Promotion of Civilian Marksmanship".

The program was funded by the Taxpayer although sales did provide some funds. Under the carter to the CMP, all funding comes from the sales of surplus rifles and other equipment. The CMP Gets no funds.

The Army turns over surplus equipment to the CMP, which is actually cheaper then storing or destroying the equipment.

It's a win win for everyone concerned.
__________________
Kraig Stuart
CPT USAR Ret
USAMU Sniper School Oct '78
Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071
kraigwy is online now  
Old March 20, 2013, 08:16 PM   #5
SC4006
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 27, 2012
Location: New Hampshire
Posts: 328
oh interesting, didn't know anything about the CMP before this. Hopefully i'll be able to get an M1 Garand from them sometime.
__________________
Army National Guard Infantry Nov. 2013 - Pesent

They say 5 out of 4 people are bad at math, but what do I know?
SC4006 is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 08:19 PM   #6
Hawkeye146
Member
 
Join Date: March 8, 2013
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 28
Plus no import marks. I've got a CMP "field grade" and it is a great shooter, stay away from gun show "deals", they are trying to make a profit.
__________________
Smooth is fast, PRESS the trigger
Hawkeye146 is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 08:22 PM   #7
tahunua001
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 21, 2011
Location: Idaho
Posts: 6,101
you kindof have to jump through a lot of hoops to buy from them. they need proof of citizenship, proof of membership in an associated firearms related club, proof of firearms training(score sheet signed by CMP certified instructor or proof of military service) and then you have to wait for them to file it all before you can actually make an order...


but on the bright side they can mail the gun right to your door.

Quote:
Plus no import marks. I've got a CMP "field grade" and it is a great shooter, stay away from gun show "deals", they are trying to make a profit.
seriously what percentage of US service rifles have importer marks?
there are the ocassional M1917s that went to Britain and the 1903s that went to french resistance but really?
I doubt many people buy a M1 and expect it to have a importers mark...
one thing they do do is remove all the proofs and cartouches from the stock... that's a real bummer for collectors.
__________________
ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar.
I never said half the crap people said I did-Albert Einstein
You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin
Bean counters told me I couldn't fire a man for being in a wheelchair, did it anyway. Ramps are expensive.-Cave Johnson.
tahunua001 is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 08:30 PM   #8
SC4006
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 27, 2012
Location: New Hampshire
Posts: 328
Wow didn't know you had to do all of that, do they pretty much just want to make sure you know what you're doing when it comes to firearms? I should have what it takes to buy from them by the time I can get one.

Markings don't matter as much to me anyways, I just want an M1 Garand that I can shoot and to say I have one.
__________________
Army National Guard Infantry Nov. 2013 - Pesent

They say 5 out of 4 people are bad at math, but what do I know?
SC4006 is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 08:43 PM   #9
Mike in Va.
Member
 
Join Date: November 2, 2009
Location: Hurt,Virginia
Posts: 17
You have to belong to a gun club, or an organization that is affilated with
The CMP, in order to purchase a firearm from them.
You can join The Garand Collectors Association ( www.thegca.org ), for
about $25.00 a year, ( you don't have to own one).
They will send your name to the CMP, which will qualify you to purchase
an M1.
If I remember correctly, you have to answer the same questions, that are
on the FFL forms, like at a gunshow or dealer.
If you go to The CMP site they have tne info. you will need.
Mike in Va. is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 08:51 PM   #10
TXAZ
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 5, 2010
Location: TEXAS!
Posts: 1,390
So I'm guessing TFL doesn't count?

Is there a list of organizations affiliated with them?
__________________
!أنا لست إرهابي
TXAZ is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 08:54 PM   #11
tahunua001
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 21, 2011
Location: Idaho
Posts: 6,101
somewhere on their website there is a list of affiliated clubs/groups. for instance becoming a member at my local rifle range(just 2 miles from my house) and faxing them a copy of my membership card was sufficient. a lot of clubs will not go out of their way to inform CMP of your membership, that responsibility lies with the member.

and yes the order form for CMP includes the same questions and even has to be sworn before a notary.
__________________
ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar.
I never said half the crap people said I did-Albert Einstein
You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin
Bean counters told me I couldn't fire a man for being in a wheelchair, did it anyway. Ramps are expensive.-Cave Johnson.
tahunua001 is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 09:09 PM   #12
stu925
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2010
Location: New York
Posts: 945
If you're planning on ordering from the CMP I wouldn't wait too long. They are backlogged about 60 days right now, I have no idea how many orders that may be but I'm going to say it's a lot and I have no idea how many rifles they have left. I'm waiting for mine currently, had Vicky in customer service call me last week and verify my FFL of choice (NY appears to be the only state in the union that they can't ship to your door) so at least I know my order has made it to her desk, I figure another month before I see my rifle. I'm chomping at the bit to get out and shoot it, whish it would hurry up and get here already.

Stu
stu925 is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 10:43 PM   #13
sprouticus
Member
 
Join Date: September 17, 2011
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 20
I have been reading trough the forms on the CMP web site for quite a while.
Before everything got crazy the consensus was that there was about two years worth of M1’s left.

There is a backlog now because the CMP has only have so many rifles ready to be shipped out (and lots of orders coming in).
They still have many crates of rifles that need to be sorted and graded, before they can sell them.

Now the supply may increase again if more rifles back from the countries that were involved in the MAP’s program. Most have already sent them back, but every once in a while some more will turn up.
(There is a rumor that Turkey may be ending back some rifles.)

These rifles are technically still U.S. property so when they come back they are sent to the army (no import marks) and then they make their way eventually to the CMP.


Quote:
one thing they do do is remove all the proofs and cartouches from the stock... that's a real bummer for collectors.
The CMP does not remove any cartoches, they often will use new CMP stocks because the orginals are in just too bad of shape to be sold with the rilfe.
sprouticus is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 10:51 PM   #14
tahunua001
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 21, 2011
Location: Idaho
Posts: 6,101
my service grade that I just received had all of the cartouches and proofs gouged out with a circular impliment...
__________________
ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar.
I never said half the crap people said I did-Albert Einstein
You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin
Bean counters told me I couldn't fire a man for being in a wheelchair, did it anyway. Ramps are expensive.-Cave Johnson.
tahunua001 is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 11:05 PM   #15
sprouticus
Member
 
Join Date: September 17, 2011
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 20
Many of the rifles they are sorting through right now came back from Greece.

The carving in your stock was most likely done by a Greek soldier or the Greek government.

That is why quite a few rifles come with a new CMP stock set.
sprouticus is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 11:17 PM   #16
ChrisTx
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 1, 2006
Posts: 147
I don't know if you can still do it, but when I ordered mine about 8 years ago, I requested a WWII serial number. Mine is dated March 1944. The only thing guaranteed to match is the receiver. Most all of these rifles have been rebuilt at one point or another. Mine was a field grade in really good shape for $425 to my door. They will continue to go up in value.
ChrisTx is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 11:33 PM   #17
tahunua001
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 21, 2011
Location: Idaho
Posts: 6,101
nope, now you can select what grade and manufacturer. I asked for springfield service and got an august 44 receiver and all the parts appear correct except the barrel which is a 52 springfield.

now they are down to H&Rs unless you get a 308 or special grade with new stock and barrel... no more wartime springfields for the time being I'm afraid.
__________________
ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar.
I never said half the crap people said I did-Albert Einstein
You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin
Bean counters told me I couldn't fire a man for being in a wheelchair, did it anyway. Ramps are expensive.-Cave Johnson.
tahunua001 is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 11:35 PM   #18
medalguy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 31, 2009
Location: New Mexico
Posts: 1,017
I received a very nice service grade Springfield Armory M1 this very morning. I ordered it in mid December, cost $625. I unpacked it and was very pleasantly surprised at how good it looked. Throat erosion was 1.0, muzzle 2.5 and it should make a great shooter.

My rifle had been arsenal furbed, as have nearly all of them, and had a proof mark on the grip, but no inspector stamps. OK by me.
medalguy is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 11:36 PM   #19
sprouticus
Member
 
Join Date: September 17, 2011
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 20
Lots of people will put a "sticky note" on their order forms requesting a WWII serial number or a USGI walnut stock, etc.

When the employees are filling the orders they will have a few boxes of the various grades of rifles in front of them.

If they happen to see something that matches your request they will usually pluck it from the pile and send it your way.
sprouticus is offline  
Old March 21, 2013, 11:06 AM   #20
James K
Staff
 
Join Date: March 17, 1999
Posts: 19,482
It is my understanding that the seven-round limit on semi-autos imposed by NY state was specifically to impose a ban on sale of M1 rifles in that state. And part of the earlier Feinstein AWB would have closed CMP and required that all government surplus arms, ammunition, and accessories be completely destroyed.

AFAIK that did not get into the actual bill, but I am pretty sure it is not dead, as destroying surplus military and police weapons is part of the UN arms control treaty that the president and the attorney general support.

Jim
__________________
Jim K
James K is offline  
Old March 22, 2013, 09:28 PM   #21
stu925
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2010
Location: New York
Posts: 945
Quote:
It is my understanding that the seven-round limit on semi-autos imposed by NY state was specifically to impose a ban on sale of M1 rifles in that state. And part of the earlier Feinstein AWB would have closed CMP and required that all government surplus arms, ammunition, and accessories be completely destroyed.

AFAIK that did not get into the actual bill, but I am pretty sure it is not dead, as destroying surplus military and police weapons is part of the UN arms control treaty that the president and the attorney general support.

Jim
I doubt that's the case. Probably more to do away with semi-autos not covered by the ban with 10 round magazine. The magazine ban doesn't go into effect until next year anyway so anything ordered between now and next January may be kept. In addition, any feeding device 50 years old or older is exempt from the magazine ban under the C&R clause of the SAFE Act. Doesn't much matter King Andrew (Gov. Cuomo) is now saying that they are going to amend the law to allow magazines up to 10 rounds but you won't be able to put more than 7 rounds in them. Looks like he's scared of the federal lawsuits.

Stu
stu925 is offline  
Old March 22, 2013, 11:33 PM   #22
Marquezj16
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 3, 2011
Posts: 2,088
I sure hope they still have some in stock at the Anniston Store come September-October time frame. that's when I will get a chance to visit the store and buy one.
Marquezj16 is offline  
Old March 24, 2013, 10:43 AM   #23
lmccrock
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 23, 2007
Location: Red Rock. TX
Posts: 800
Quote:
seriously what percentage of US service rifles have importer marks?
I have 2 M1 rifles, 1 03A3, and 1 GI M1 carbine. 1 M1 rifle and the carbine are re-imports, at least they are stamped so. So, in my safe, 50% have import marks. The rifle was probably from Korea, which was not "loaned" rifles so they were not returned and sold thru CMP. Korea sold them commercially.

If you are thinking about buying one, get in the queue now, do not wait for them to open up the retail stores again. While some turn up at clubs or overseas, there are no warehouses full of rifles anywhere other than CMP; when they are gone, that's it.

You do not have to shoot a highpower or NRA match; any shooting activity qualifies. There is a form you can get from CMP (or the website) that lists the requirements.
lmccrock is offline  
Old March 25, 2013, 11:39 AM   #24
NWPilgrim
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 29, 2008
Location: Oregon
Posts: 2,150
The premium charged by shops re-selling Garands is (besides profit) that you get it today and you can inspect it in person before purchase. Unless you live near, or travel to, one of the CMP stores you get whatever they send you. They do check to make sure it is a decent functioning rifle and safe. My first Service Grade Garand from CMP was pretty average all around and was well worth the money. My second SG was more on the beater side. My third SG I picked out at the Camp Perry store and it is close to pristine.
__________________
"The ultimate authority ... resides in the people alone. ... The advantage of being armed, which the Americans possess over the people of almost every other nation ... forms a barrier against the enterprises of ambition."
- James Madison
NWPilgrim is offline  
Old March 25, 2013, 11:50 AM   #25
Dr Big Bird PhD
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 26, 2012
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 778
Do CMP M1 Garands conflict with California law at all?

I've been planning on investing in one more rifle before the 2014 Long Gun registration goes into effect and the low prices on a 30-06 SA piqued my interest.
__________________
I told the new me,
"Meet me at the bus station and hold a sign that reads: 'Today is the first day of the rest of your life.'"
But the old me met me with a sign that read: "Welcome back."
Who you are is not a function of where you are. -Off Minor
Dr Big Bird PhD is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:21 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.14739 seconds with 9 queries