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View Poll Results: What do you think, I think its important to know?
They should be boycotted at the very least! 4 22.22%
We have to get the word out! 1 5.56%
Leave them alone! 8 44.44%
I just don't care! 8 44.44%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 18. You may not vote on this poll

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Old March 13, 2013, 12:57 PM   #1
kcinetguru
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Join Date: March 12, 2013
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A sad yet growing trend.....

PLEASE READ THIS AND IF YOU FEEL MOVED -LET OTHERS KNOW!

Here is a response directly from the folks at this outfit (cheaperthandirt). After informing them that myself and our entire club (we went back and forth with civilized communication until this arrived) have decided to discontinue our patronage of their site. It saddened me and all of us to get this vehemently thrown "We don't care now, nor did we ever" statement.

I hope millions see this and heed the statement "Caveat Emptor" when searching the Internet for a loyal and stalwart partner with which to spend your hard earned cash. Remember this posting and the others like it. Below is the response I spoke of. Notice what they call the small business gun shop owner struggling to make it......Very poor character.

Response directly from their product support department is below and all in italics: (the link referred to in the first sentence is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7qSBoHnSkA

"Thanks for the link. I fear; however, that you do not understand the basic economic principles capitalism is based upon. We did not raise prices because on “greed”. We raised prices due to the sharp increase in demand after President Obama announced his intentions to pursue a ban on so called “assault weapons”. If prices had stayed static, we would have completely sold out, much like other retailers. Because our prices rose, we were able to keep high demand products in stock. The worst case scenario for any retailer is to be “sold out” of a product. Customers who were willing to pay these prices were able to obtain the goods they desired. Despite the higher prices, PMAG sales remained steady throughout the initial panic, and continue to do well.

Also, the idea that we do not support the second amendment is not true at all. We halted gun sales temporarily due to the insane number of orders we were receiving. We were essentially getting (for example) 10 orders for every single gun we had in stock. Our system could not keep up with the demand and then crashed. We revamped the system and got it back online as soon as we could, this time offering free shipping on all firearms orders.

Since that time, CTD has made a $100,000 donation to the Second Amendment Foundation, making us the first ever Diamond Level Supporter. We have also partnered with the NRA, promoting their $300 NRA life memberships. The Second Amendment has and always will be extremely important to CTD.

Link to SAF donation announcement:

http://www.saf.org/viewpr-new.asp?id=422

Link to NRA memberships:
http://cheaperthandirt.com/blog/?p=40160

Firearms ownership is about defending and preserving your individual sovereignty from forces of coercion and violence. Many people, even the non political/non philosophical, understand this. Nobody wants to be a victim of theft or violence and ideally, nobody wants to be subject of any kind of authoritarian order that totally ordains the limits of personal freedom. Judging from the number of emails we have been getting, very few people understand that the reverse is also true: you are not entitled to enslave anyone else. As in, you are not entitled to anyone else’s labor or property. Your existence does not mean others are obligated to sacrifice themselves for you.

What doe this have to do with “price gouging”? There is no such thing as price gouging. There are only voluntary transactions between individuals. The cost of this transaction may change depending on the scarcity of goods in the market. If the scarcity of a product increase, it is reasonable that the price should increase. The small-time gun dealers that decided not to increase their prices were morons, however well-meaning they may be, because now they are going out of business or laying off workers because they never took economics 101 and don’t understand that they do not have the same volume of products available to sell to cover their overhead.

What made the $59 PMAG suddenly more immoral than the same PMAG at $12? Both, at each instance on the market, represented the price at which the seller was willing to voluntarily part with it. These prices represent a mutual interest in exchange. Whether at $12 or $59, the seller and the buyer both value each other’s property more than their own to the extent that they can voluntarily agree to trade.

Are you angry that prices are going up? I am too, but I am not directing my anger at firearm/ammunition traders. They are not responsible for this trend and they are only responding to economic incentives. If, however, you and the 309 members of your gun club feel that you are entitled to acquire a product at a certain price at the expense of the sovereignty of the person selling it (as in, they should consent to your demanded price) you are a tyrant. I do not care if you are a Republican, Democrat, Libertarian, etc. I can’t blame you for your twisted sense of morality. Just understand that you are the enemy and you are just as dangerous to the culture firearms freedom advocates are trying to defend- that is, the preservation of personal sovereignty- as any gun-control advocate in Washington.

Kip Staton
Product Technician

Cheaper Than Dirt, Inc.
2524 NE Loop 820
Fort Worth, TX 76106

Last edited by kcinetguru; March 13, 2013 at 01:09 PM.
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Old March 13, 2013, 01:05 PM   #2
ScottRiqui
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Meh - if you strip out the personal insults (morons, tyrant, etc), I actually agree with pretty much everything he wrote.

I don't think you'll find much sympathy around here if you cry "price gouging" - like the CTD tech said, they're voluntary transactions - no one is forcing anyone to pay a certain price.
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Old March 13, 2013, 01:15 PM   #3
kcinetguru
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What has happened to us?

I am simply trying to find out if everyone shares in this obvious "Hooray for me, Screw you" mentality. I feel that we owe each other (In this case the consumer and vendor relationship) at the very least, simple courtesies. Like loyalty and knowing you as a consumer are appreciated and not just looked at as if you were a mindless pillow full of cash.

I am trying to find what I believe is the true human spirit and see if people still believe in what we almost jokingly refer to today as the "American Way", i take it very seriously and believe freedom comes with part of its price tag reading: We are our Brother's keeper".

Thank you for your response and I look forward to seeing what all of the rest of you have to say on this important issue.
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Old March 13, 2013, 01:44 PM   #4
ScottRiqui
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Do you deny the truth of what he was saying when he pointed out that a small business is courting bankruptcy when it sells all of its remaining stock at "regular" price, knowing full well that it may be *months* before they get anything from their distributor to take its place?

A company like Wal-Mart can afford to keep prices at "normal" levels, even if it means their stock will be gone in a day, because gun & ammo sales are a small portion of their bottom line. If they need to subsidize the lost revenues with their other sales for the next few months, they can afford to do it. Smaller specialty businesses can't do that.
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Old March 13, 2013, 01:49 PM   #5
Unspoken
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The fact they carried an ongoing communication with you shows they do care about the mindset of their customers, even if you don't agree with their message.

I'm not sure what you expected to accomplish, though. Do you think they would just acquiesce to your gripes, and let you establish the price of their products? Did you expect their apology? Or were you just happy to vent your frustrations?
I mean, really, I like to consider myself a humanist. I care about my community and the general welfare of mankind. But it should not be deemed an affront to humanity or decency, when a business doubles or triples the price charged for product x, if people are willing to pay it.
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Old March 13, 2013, 02:02 PM   #6
REDBULL600
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YEP, they didn't need the moron comment but agree with it. The LGS I visit are not large by any means and they didn't raise their prices, actually have hired more staff (I think family and close friends) and aside from 9mm handguns and ARs they are very well stocked. And this weekend they had ARs and Glock 17s.

I've never bought from CTD nor do I intend to. Support local business. I like to look at all the cool stuff though.
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Old March 13, 2013, 02:18 PM   #7
scrubcedar
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This is nothing but a regular businessman's mentality. When demand goes up and supply shrinks then prices go up. It's called capitalism.
Let me ask the OP a question. If demand went down, but wholesale prices stayed steady, would you investigate whether Bud's was losing money on your particular purpose so that you could pay a higher price because it was only fair? You wouldn't even look into it. It's just his bad luck, and that's okay, you wouldn't be in the wrong.
We're supposed to be the ones supporting the Constitutional system as it sits folks, even when it hurts a little.
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Old March 13, 2013, 02:54 PM   #8
SauerGrapes
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Location: S.E.PA.
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I don't like it anymore than you do but......they have to run their business the way they see fit.
I never thought their prices were all that good anyway. I don't buy from them and never will.
They had 2 choices I guess, raise prices and anger their customers or run out of inventory and close up shop.

You don't have to worry about getting the word out, it's already out there.
BTW, I vote, ''I don't care''.
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Old March 13, 2013, 05:42 PM   #9
Willie Sutton
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Sounds like the writer read Atlas Shrugged, and took it to heart.

He's actually 100% right.

And if you don't like it, shop at your LGS. They are either selling for the same price, or are out of stock... and going out of business.


Willie


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Old March 13, 2013, 05:54 PM   #10
arch308
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It's called capitalism. If you don't like the prices, don't buy.
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Old March 13, 2013, 06:07 PM   #11
Brian Pfleuger
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There are specific rules for the "Retail Deals and Feedback" forum, and generic replies from folks who do not or have not dealt with the company do not meet those rules.

Second, we have had more than our fill of "Price Gouging" threads and we really don't need to beat that poor, old, dead horse anymore.

Search the forum for "gouging" and you'll find all the opinions you want, and more.

For those reasons...

Closed
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