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Old March 12, 2013, 08:26 PM   #1
BillyJack3
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Will the ammo shortage lead to accelerated handgun innovation?

I'm still having trouble getting the ammo I need even though I see things slowly letting up. I have a decent reserve but I do unfortunately, shoot less these days. So besides being prepared for the next ammo rush, I was thinking of other ways to stay out of this situation.

One way is to do away with ammo. So, does anyone know if any of the large manufacturers have a double top secret laser gun development program in progress? I'd be interested if they did and would likely hold off purchasing a .17 since that's the only ammo I see plenty of. Come on, it's 2013 already...
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Old March 12, 2013, 08:39 PM   #2
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Don't hold your breath, I'm still waiting for the flying cars they promised back in the 1950's...
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Old March 12, 2013, 08:52 PM   #3
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Much like gasoline, gunpowder is pretty impressive in its ability to store large amounts of chemical energy in a small space, and to release that energy quickly.

Battery storage technology is getting better all the time, but we're still a ways away from handheld "blaster" weapons.
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Old March 12, 2013, 08:54 PM   #4
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Just buy the 17 Buzz Lightyear.
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Old March 12, 2013, 08:57 PM   #5
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All right, people, set your M1911's on "stun".
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Old March 12, 2013, 09:09 PM   #6
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No but I bet some more factories will pop up that will make ammo.

Maybe more companies making primers and powder to.

After all, the market is there.

Just hope some of them refuse to sell to the government so they can't hog the ammo as the are now.

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Old March 12, 2013, 09:14 PM   #7
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Wait a minute, I remember long, long, ago when I was A kid, maybe I need to add another long. But any way, I remember the movie shorts about outer space, and space men. Didn't their ray guns look just like a Beretta Neos?
Maybe their on to something.
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Old March 12, 2013, 09:49 PM   #8
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I like the way that Stargate had the aliens being out gunned by Earth men who used modern day automatic rifles with AP ammo. The aliens having skipped that level of weapons development when they stole energy weapons from advanced races they had conquered thousands of years ago.
On Startrek Deep Space Nine they once had an insane Vulcan sniper with a updated cartridge firing rifle, developed for use when a security force field interfered with energy weapons. The cartridges looked like a .30-06. The rifle resembled an FG42 or chopped and channeled M60. The magazine looked like a detachable spool type.

The main drawback to conventional firearms in outer space is recoil. In zero gee recoil could send a shooter hurtling away from a space craft.
With a bit of R&D on the Gyro-jet rocket cartridge that design would work fine in zero gee.

You can build a Gauss rifle as powerfull as a red ryder BB gun with the coil from a disposable flash camera.
These pack quite a whallop I'm told. A friend tried building a motion picture prop pistol that would light up a room as if with a strong mussle flash, which CGI muzzle flash can't do, on a plastic airsoft pistol frame I gave him. When he failed to insulate the trigger properly the first attempt resulted in him finding himself on the floor as if Tasered.

PS
I'm betting on the spring piston deisel gun. These were developed in Germany after WW2 as a more powerful conversion of existing spring piston air rifles.
Practically any liquid that will burn can be used in a deisel gun. Even WD 40 or sewing machine oil.
The Germans used wood alcohol. A small add on fuel injector spraying the alcohol into the cylinder as the piston was driven forwards. After the first shot these could be self cocking if the load were hot enough.
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Old March 12, 2013, 09:57 PM   #9
Prof Young
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Air guns!

Maybe the time for more powerful air guns has arrived.
Live well, be safe
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Old March 12, 2013, 10:25 PM   #10
tipoc
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Quote:
Maybe the time for more powerful air guns has arrived.
Already here...

http://www.crosman.com/hunting/

http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=mc...r+with+airguns

and they can be used even with a felony conviction I believe.

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Old March 12, 2013, 11:33 PM   #11
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How about a cartridge that uses a 209 shotshell primer? About the only ones on the shelf. Maybe a .45 or .44-209?
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Old March 12, 2013, 11:45 PM   #12
jolly1
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Look Back!!

Why to waste time by looking for a laser gun 100 years or more ahead?

Better, take a look at past, and start thinking about Black powder traditional or in line guns. Muzzle loader, cap and ball revolvers, cartridge black powder?

The trick is:
BP you can make at home, bullet casting easily doable at home, cap can be home made as well, shells reusable.

This has all been invented earlier, and proven reliable.
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Old March 13, 2013, 02:15 AM   #13
Rainbow Demon
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Making a primer safe and suitable for modern cartridges can be a difficult process, but a simple percussion cap suitable for a cap&ball gun should pose no real difficulty.

The Wheel lock was not in use long enough to be properly developed. A French gunsmith built some advanced wheel lock designs in the mid 19th century. More as a challenge than for practical purposes.
He found that ignition with his wheel locks was as fast as with most cartridge arms, with little or no vibration to affect accuracy.

There have been spring piston ignition systems, where rapid compression of air produced heat that could be used to ignite a sensitive charge. The Daisy .22 Rocket ball rifle used this system.
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Old March 13, 2013, 01:06 PM   #14
tipoc
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Black powder guns can be quite inexpensive as well.

There are some very good ones available these days, both replicas and new designs.

I agree designs for these was bypassed by smokeless powder but in no way is BP useless.

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Old March 13, 2013, 01:20 PM   #15
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how about my junker old flintlock I bought that has ferocerium on the frizen... throws fire like crazy to light the pan, with a small piece of steel where the flint would go...

I bought this rifle back 5-10 years ago... hmmm.... which primer shortage was that now

the fero stuff is cool... I got some sticks of it, & had actually planned on developing a "home made" back then, but of coarse then primers became available, & I tabled those expiriments...

necessity is the mother of invention...
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Old March 13, 2013, 03:14 PM   #16
Gaerek
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Short Answer: No

Long Answer: No. The shortage is temporary, and everyone knows this except for the people dropped $100 for a brick of .22LR. When people aren't in panic mode, guns and ammo are really fairly inexpensive. Anything that innovates beyond what we have right now will be very expensive. There's no need to pay for an innovation in this type of situation.

It's like gasoline. There are alternative vehicles that don't run off gasoline. But they are usually more expensive, and are prone to more failures, and things like that. Even with gas at almost record highs, it's still not enough for most people to pay for innovations that have been around for 15 years even.
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Old March 13, 2013, 03:26 PM   #17
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awl can have your lazer guns & flying cars.

I'll have a Rocket Belt and fly over to Debbie's house.
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Old March 13, 2013, 05:29 PM   #18
jad0110
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Quote:
So, does anyone know if any of the large manufacturers have a double top secret laser gun development program in progress? I'd be interested if they did and would likely hold off purchasing a .17 since that's the only ammo I see plenty of. Come on, it's 2013 already...
And one day, if and when hand held laser weapons do become available, what are the odds that our benevolent federal government would permit us serfs to own them?

What you are more likely to see, if ammo demand remains high, is in increase in production capacity of ammunition. If not from the big manufacturers, then from commercial reloaders such as George Arms.
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Old March 14, 2013, 06:11 PM   #19
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As mentioned before in this post, the ammo shortage should end by June.

This happened because the federal government bought a huge amount to save money and sent some people panicking and they went out and bought as much as possible and the factories haven't caught up yet.

Save your money if you can and it will come down.
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Old March 14, 2013, 07:03 PM   #20
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Quote:
Will the ammo shortage lead to accelerated handgun innovation?
Hopefully, the innovation will be how to increase ammo production to meet demand.

Even if they invented a laser blaster today, there are still millions of guns that would continue to use, and need, "standard" ammo.
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Old March 14, 2013, 09:15 PM   #21
peacefulgary
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Will the ammo shortage lead to accelerated handgun innovation?

Maybe, but I'm certain that it will lead to less handgun wear.
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Old March 15, 2013, 03:02 PM   #22
TxFlyFish
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gas tank capacity:magazine capacity :: miles per gallon: _________
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Old March 16, 2013, 03:12 AM   #23
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Gaerek is right.


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Old March 16, 2013, 11:20 AM   #24
Jim Watson
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If I ran a gun, ammunition, or accessory company, I would put on overtime and simplify my lineup to the most popular items to fill the present panicked demand. In fact, some companies are doing that.
I would not hire new employees or buy new equipment. It is going to be tough enough to get by when the panickers run out of money and quit buying.

I also think we are going to have a ban of some sort and if your main product is on the naughty list, you will be out of luck.

Innovation to catch the attention of consumers with hoarded gear and depleted budgets and to get by government restrictions will be difficult but necessary if you want to stay in business.
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Old March 16, 2013, 10:36 PM   #25
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The solution I heard at the LGS yesterday was this, put all the unemployed people out there to work making ammo..... Got a laugh but there might be something to it.
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