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Old February 23, 2013, 10:53 AM   #1
natron20
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First trip to Bud's! Looking for 9mm suggestions.

Hi everyone. Been lurking here for several weeks trying to learn as much as I can and feel like I have learned quite a bit. So, I made an excursion to Bud's last night for the first time to shoot a few 9mm. A friend of mine loaned me a Springfield XD (4 inch barrel), a Para Ordanance that I have no idea a model, and a Kimber 1911. In addition, I rented a Glock 19 to shoot too. Also, a friend of mine went and he took his C-Z P01 and I put a few clips through it as well.

The Springfield XD was far and away my favorite. Before going I had really wanted to try a Beretta PX4 Storm but I did not have the opportunity this trip, ran out of time. So, can anyone offer some insight into how the PX4 and the Springfield are similar/different.

Curious to gather a few opinions before heading back to Bud's when I try out the PX4, and make my purchase.

Sorry, if I did not give enough info regarding models, etc. As I said, I am a simpleton for now trying to learn what I can.
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Old February 23, 2013, 11:13 AM   #2
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Put a few Mags... through it as well.

It's your gun man. Buy what's comfortable for you and your budget. Those are all respectable.
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Old February 23, 2013, 11:16 AM   #3
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Welcome to The Firing Line, natron20!

We don't mind newcomers asking questions. That's how you learn, and we were all newcomers to the world of firearms at one point or another.

With that said, I'm far from a 9mm expert. I don't own one myself, though I've been considering one for a long time. I'm something of an obsessive-compulsive researcher when it comes to big purchases, and a firearm is a big purchase for me. The first question, though, is: What's the purpose of this 9mm you seek? If it's for CC, you may need something different than if you're looking for a range gun. The second question will be: How well do you like it? There's a saying that says "the .22 that you'll carry beats the .45 that you leave at home." Whether or not you'll actually carry the gun depends, in part, on how well you like it. How it fits your hand, how heavy it is, what's the ammo capacity, does it jam on you . . . all of those factor into whether or not you'll actually carry. If it's a range gun, carry (obviously) isn't an issue.

With my caveat that I don't own a 9mm, I'll fill you in on the information that I have gathered about 9mm pistols. I wouldn't mind having any one of 1, 2 or 3, listed below, as an alternate carry gun. I only exclude the Beretta from that list because I know so little about them.

1) Glock 19 -- One of the most popular 9mms around. Reliable, sufficiently accurate, good capacity. The most common complaint seems to be either: (a) it feels like a 2x4 in the hand; or (b) it kicks brass into the shooter's face, at least initially. Eighty-seven bazillion of them out there on the market, and spare parts and upgrades galore, if you want or need to swap something out.

2) XD -- The whole XD series comes pretty highly recommended. Reliable, sufficiently accurate, good capacity. I've had the opportunity to shoot an XD9, and I like it.

3) Ruger SR9 and 9C -- This one wasn't on your list, but it might be worth a look. Reliable, sufficiently accurate, good capacity. I've held a couple of these, and they feel mighty good in my hand. I'm not thrilled with having a magazine disconnect safety, but that's not a deal-breaker for me. They haven't been on the market all that long, and there have been some reports of barrel peening and, umm, one other issue that I can't recall at the moment. I leave it to you to investigate the seriousness of those allegations.

4) Beretta PX4 Storm -- I've only held one of these at a gun show, but it felt good in the hand. Beyond that, I have little or no information, so I'll leave this one to folks that know better than I.
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Old February 23, 2013, 12:07 PM   #4
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All of those are good choices. After you fondle them more, and see how you shoot with them, I think the choice will be obvious.
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Old February 23, 2013, 02:05 PM   #5
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I didn't see where you listed a budget. If you can swing the price, you may want to look at an H&K USP Compact or P30. They are nice weapons.
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Old February 23, 2013, 02:26 PM   #6
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I agree with PatientWolf. You won't be disappointed.
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Old February 23, 2013, 02:42 PM   #7
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Agree on the H&K as well--- I'd also recommend looking at the P2000sk-- it's H&Ks smallest 9mm (holds 10+1) and more concealable if cc is in your future.
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Old February 23, 2013, 02:55 PM   #8
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Steel or plastic. If you want a accurate reliable steel 9mm at a reasonable price the CZ 75 SPO1 should be on your list 19 plus 1 cap. PS I would go for handgun originally designed for 9mm and not a 1911 9mm.
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Old February 23, 2013, 03:27 PM   #9
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If you like the XD, I'd definitely suggest checking out the M&P. To me it has superior ergonomics. It also has a lower bore axis, so it even has lower felt recoil.

The XD is indeed a fine choice if you choose to go that route. Springfield Armory and Smith & Wesson have the finest customer service in the industry.

Regarding the HKs... everyone is different, but I have owned numerous USPs, USP Compacts, P2000s, and a P30. I like the way HKs look - and I like the way they feel. I generally think they have a sub-par factory trigger. The double action is heavy and usually has a lot of creep. not very smooth like a good(old) Sig. The single action is pretty good though. Usually breaks nice and crisp. My biggest problem with HKs is that I could never nail down how to shoot them well. They're really the only gun type that I'm just terribly inaccurate with. I can shoot circles around the HK with Glock, M&P, Sig, and XD pistols... I'm not blaming this on the gun. They're mechanical accuracy is good... but something about them just never shot well for me. Very irritating because I really like them!

These days I'm mostly sticking with Glocks and M&Ps. I have others, but for defensive/carry use, it's pretty much always one or the other.
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Old February 24, 2013, 12:42 AM   #10
natron20
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Thanks to everyone for the info.

Sorry, I forgot to mention a budget. Was looking to stay around $500, willing to push it to $600 if there is really that big of a difference in what I like. Also, I had originally planned to buy this weapon for CC, but after reading so much over the past few weeks I have decided I want this gun to be more of a range piece. At this point I want something reliable and that can help me simply reach a comfort level of owning, handling, and operating a handgun. I plan to take a couple of beginner courses soon after purchasing. Once I get through with those classes I will be ready to move on to CC. However, I plan to go with a revolver for CC.

Thanks again for all the opinions!

One last question, what is a what brand is M&P?
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Old February 24, 2013, 01:22 AM   #11
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new gun owners/shooters....

If you are new to firearms & the shooting sports, I suggest a new or NIB: new in box .38spl revolver or .357magnum medium frame or small size. Good models include the S&W model 64, the 686+(7 round), the Ruger GP100(the new Talo model is a great buy), the Ruger LCR or a S&W model 442 or 638 .38spl.
A DA only(no cocking or hammer spur) semi-auto pistol could do okay too but a 3"/4" barrel revolver would be better.
For top semi-auto pistols, see; the S&W SD9 or SD40, the Walther PPX in 9mm(9mm Luger) or a .40S&W. The SIG Sauer P224 DAK, the P290RS 9x19mm with SIG laser add-on or the P226R/P229R DAK(Double Action Kellerman) .357sig or .40S&W. The Beretta PX4 C(constant action) is a good value. It's available in 9x19mm & .40S&W.
For defense or home protection, I like the .40 or .357sig. The .357sig feeds well & it's fast(high vel).
Know & understand the firearm and use of force laws/ordinances. Get good skill training from a top rated program or teacher. New gun laws & the huge increase in concealed carry/firearm ownership many firearm & tactics schools have sprung up.
Keep your firearms clean & read the owners manual(s).
Use only factory made high quality brands for carry-defense ammunition.
No hand-loads or reloaded rounds for defense.
To have a plan or a legal(defense atty) system ready to go, is smart too.
For websites & firearm resources see;
www.nra.org www.gunsamerica.com www.jgsales.com www.natchezss.com www.brownells.com www.gunvideo.com www.safariland.com www.blackhawk.com www.galls.com www.uscav.com www.grafs.com www.shopcorbon.com www.handgunlaw.us www.gunlawguide.com www.boatmanbooks.com www.deltapress.com www.berettausa.com www.sigsauer.com www.smithandwesson.com www.midwayusa.com

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Old February 24, 2013, 08:54 AM   #12
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At $500 to $600, the H&Ks will be out of your budget. In that range, I would probably be looking at the XDs, the SR9c, Baretta 92FS or PX4 or a CZ such as the P01 or 75.

I know you had already listed, or had suggested to you, several of these. I think you are on the right track to find what you want by trying them and seeing what fits. As far as I know, most of these are not ammo-sensitive.
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Old February 24, 2013, 09:56 AM   #13
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One last question, what is a what brand is M&P?
The M&P is made by Smith & Wesson. Can't beat that, right?
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Old February 24, 2013, 10:40 AM   #14
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The M&P is made by Smith & Wesson.
Uncle,

I bought a Smith and Wesson 1911 Pro series 9mm last night. Will take it to the indoor range tomorrow. It is a slightly looser fit than my PM9 but I think it will work fine.

I bought a Ruger SR1911 CMD last week and have had no failures with it but it shoots 2 inches low and 1 inch right at 12.5 yards.

Two friends shot it Friday at the outdoor range and all experienced the same thing. I can fix the windage thing easy enough but will talk to the gunsmith over at Caswells about either lowering the front sight by about .022 in. or raising the rear sight. I will probably have to get a shorter front sight. Just taking some material off the sight won't work if you still want to use the three dots.

Funny thing is, I have the Ruger full size SR1911 and it shoots to point of aim.

I have a Springfield loaded M1911-A1 in 9mm on order from Buds and have paid for that one to get their guaranteed price. I have had one on order at Caswells since December and was surprised to get a call from them yesterday telling me they noticed I had a long standing order for the Springer and they were still not sure when they would be able to get one. That is when the guy told me they had just received the Smith and asked me if I might want to look at it and they gave me first right of refusal.

I just paid off the CC and like a dummy I went over there and looked at it and the rest is history.

I have it all cleaned up and will shoot it tomorrow. I have been dry firing the gun and the trigger is about the same as the Dan Wesson. It is pretty good.

The gun came with two Wilson Combat mags and I like that a lot. I ordered two more from Midway Shooting supplies and should be able to use those mags on the DW and the Springer. . .if it ever comes in.

I like .45 a lot but 9mm is a real fun caliber to shoot and I did get 2000 rounds of 9mm for $450 bucks just before the crap hit the fan so I can have some fun for a while.

Hope all is well with you!
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Old February 24, 2013, 11:05 AM   #15
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Nice! Congrats geetarman!

Wish I had that much 9mm!
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Old February 24, 2013, 11:55 AM   #16
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You said that you really like shooting the Springfield XD. It is in your price range so I say go for it unless you try and like something else better. If you get a chance try the SIG SP2022 also which is within your price range and is a hammer fired DA/SA pistol.

Good luck!
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Old February 24, 2013, 12:15 PM   #17
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Quote:
If you like the XD, I'd definitely suggest checking out the M&P. To me it has superior ergonomics. It also has a lower bore axis, so it even has lower felt recoil.
To me the XDm fits my hand way better than the M&P. The XD is a blocky gun though. If I had to rate it I'd go XD < M&P < XDm. I honestly don't notice much difference in recoil between the XD/XDm and M&P in 9mm, but I think part of that is that the XD/XDm are noticeably heavier guns.
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Old February 24, 2013, 05:42 PM   #18
Uncle Malice
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To me the XDm fits my hand way better than the M&P. The XD is a blocky gun though. If I had to rate it I'd go XD < M&P < XDm.
To each his own, TR

I admit that I really do like the XDM, but I still think the M&P has it beat in the ergos dept. For my hands, the only thing that trumps the M&P as far as comfort goes is the HK P30... it's a shame I can't shoot it worth a crap!

Then again, I really like the ergos on the Gen4 Glocks too... so whaddew eye no?
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Old February 24, 2013, 06:51 PM   #19
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I still think the M&P has it beat in the ergos dept
I don't like the backstraps on the M&P. I wish they just added length front to back instead of swelling in the palm. Oh wells.
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Old February 25, 2013, 12:03 PM   #20
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new gun

2 1/2 years back I rented a glock26, xd9 and a M+P9 compact on 2 different Saturdays. For me ,I shot the M+P 9c the best,liked the grip better. I been reloading and I stop counting # of rounds shot threw the M+P9c at 3000. never a problem,always fires,no jams.... In my opion,get the M+P......
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Old March 2, 2013, 04:38 AM   #21
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Uncle Malice, no offense, but you are quite the S&W fanboy, aren't you

I got rid of my M&P, but they are a nice gun to shoot, recoil was very low.
And it (M&P9C) was a really great carry gun, the size is just perfect. But I hated the trigger, (yes I know that can be fixed) and the gosh darn thing was just not that accurate.....it really aggravated me. It shot low and.....I forget if it was left or right, but it shot low and one direction or the other.....

Last edited by tristar viper; March 2, 2013 at 04:45 AM.
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Old March 2, 2013, 09:10 AM   #22
Uncle Malice
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Uncle Malice, no offense, but you are quite the S&W fanboy, aren't you
Actually, I'm primarily a Glock fanboy. But I also have grown to greatly appreciate the M&P design as well. I will say that I really like Smith & Wesson as a company (today).

They did a lot of unsavory things back in the old ban days... and lost a lot of people's respect. I think they've done a tremendous job of regaining their reputation and today - they are sticking to their guns, so to speak. If they fail us a second time, there will be no third chance, I can guarantee you that. For the time being, I wholeheartedly support S&W - both their products, their customer service, and the company philosophies.

Hrmph... that kinda sounds like a fanboy rant, I guess.
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Old March 3, 2013, 04:16 AM   #23
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I had trouble disengaging the grip safety on my XD. The grip was rather small and my long fingers made the issue worse.
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Old March 3, 2013, 09:37 AM   #24
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I've never shot a S&W M&P, but I have a S&W 5903TSW and have been surprised at how much I like it and how accurate it is. I only mention this because S&W semi-automatic pistols seem to have a bad reputation with a lot of folks, but I've been impressed with mine.
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Old March 3, 2013, 12:47 PM   #25
swfan
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i love my
m&p 9 for its comfortable shooting
it does hit low but ive gotten used to that

might be sacrilage to say but the internals are like the glock g17
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