The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Hide > The Art of the Rifle: Semi-automatics

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old February 28, 2013, 07:12 AM   #51
zincwarrior
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 1, 2011
Location: Texas, land of Tex-Mex
Posts: 1,232
They look rickety and stupid.

Where are you going to shoot it? No range is going to allow it.
How accurate is it?
Are buyers envisioning taking on the cartels (who have machine guns, rockets, and mortars) or the government (who have machine guns, rockets, and mortars)?

Although I wouldn't make them illegal, I see no need for me to spend precious dollars on them whatsoever.
zincwarrior is offline  
Old February 28, 2013, 08:39 AM   #52
spacecoast
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 14, 2009
Location: Sunshine and Keystone States
Posts: 4,121
Quote:
Where are you going to shoot it? No range is going to allow it.
A lot of folks have access to private areas and don't need a commercial or govt.-sponsored range.
spacecoast is offline  
Old February 28, 2013, 09:09 AM   #53
Willie Sutton
Junior member
 
Join Date: January 26, 2012
Posts: 1,066
Anyone see the demonstration of one that Diane Feinstein put up in a video in her hearings?

This is just the sort of stupid toy that can cause us all to lose more than any possible benefit for these things.


Willie

.
Willie Sutton is offline  
Old February 28, 2013, 10:02 AM   #54
Skans
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 20, 2008
Posts: 7,865
Quote:
This is just the sort of stupid toy that can cause us all to lose more than any possible benefit for these things.
Ever see one of those 120 round drums - that's a stupid toy that can cause us all to lose more....

And, 50 round magazines? - More stupid toys

And, bayonet lugs? - dumb stupid toys

And, folding stocks? - senseless stupid toys

And, pistol grips? - who needs those for hunting - more stupid toys

And, rail systems where you can mount high powered LASERS and NIGHT VISION SCOPES? - Really stupid toys. Who needs a high powered laser that can burn someone's eye out anyway

And, HAIR TRIGGER systems - gotta ban those dangerous, stupid toys too! No one needs anything less than a 5 pound trigger on a rifle or handgun. In fact, anyone caught altering triggers to less than 5 pounds should go to prison for 10 years and pay $250,000.

And, Tannerite - nothing but stupid explosive toy - ban it!

And, flare launchers that look like grenade launchers - stupid toy that can be made to fire ROCKETS!!!!

And double-barreled shotguns............
Skans is offline  
Old February 28, 2013, 10:12 AM   #55
Willie Sutton
Junior member
 
Join Date: January 26, 2012
Posts: 1,066
The public impression of Modern Sporting Rifles is one of first impressions, and they are indisputedly confused with machine guns.

The video shown in Senate hearings, and then trotted out by every anti, showing a AR-15 being fired "full auto" with a Slidefire stock with Feinstein saying in the narration "and this is perfectly legal today" causes more harm that can ever be caused by a scary looking bayonet lug.

This is a war of perception. We can win the battle but lose the war... with the greatest of ease if we're not smart enough to be wise men and not smart asses.

I like full auto, BTW. I live where we own them and shoot them. I do, in fact, own and shoot them. I also contribute 5 figures a year to the ILA and the SAF. I am an activist. And I think that this particular device can cause us to lose more points in the war of impressions than any single other accessory sold today.


Maturity means making mature choices. This is not a mature choice.



Willie

.
Willie Sutton is offline  
Old February 28, 2013, 10:34 AM   #56
Skans
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 20, 2008
Posts: 7,865
Quote:
This is a war of perception. We can win the battle but lose the war...
We've lost the war - lost it big time in November. So, buy what you want - it's all for sale, but just for a limited time. Slide-fire stocks won't be the reason we lose our rights. There have been gat triggers, double-pull trigger "staples", gattling guns, and other things that simulate full-auto fire, legally. This is just one of many.

The argument to be made is that machineguns are legal, and should be legal to manufacture so that people don't need to come up with innovative ways to make them fire more rounds faster in semi-auto.

You and I both know that you can make even a revolver appear to be a machine gun, with enough tweaking of the action and lots of practice. 1911's with trigger jobs can be emptied at near-full-auto rates of fire, and are known for going full-auto, due to sloppy trigger work or worn fire control parts. You don't have any problem with them taking away your 1911's do you?

I suppose when the antis put Feinstine on TV to show that ANYONE can buy an 80% AR receiver and complete it so that it is exactly like an M16 full-auto assault machine gun, you will be for banning 80% receivers as well? What about grandfathered open-bolt guns that can be made into a machine gun with a simple piece of cardboard?

We are losing the war because we keep losing our rights due to those in our ranks that want to cave in every time an Anti figures out how to make guns look more evil. Today it's the slide-fire......."stupid gun-clown toy". Next it will be 1911's with hair triggers. Where do you want to draw the line?

Last edited by Skans; February 28, 2013 at 10:44 AM.
Skans is offline  
Old February 28, 2013, 10:58 AM   #57
Aberration
Member
 
Join Date: July 14, 2012
Posts: 35
The perception was lost back with the NFA.

I find pandering to peoples irrational insecurities to be rather retarded.

I don't moderate my speech either, so that those who are offended do not try to take away my right to say it.

The mature choice is not to cower. The mature choice would is to be honest about the 2nd Amendment, not hide behind a pretense of Sporting.
Aberration is offline  
Old February 28, 2013, 03:57 PM   #58
AGENT TIKKI
Member
 
Join Date: September 18, 2010
Posts: 49
They look like a lot of fun.

They sure look like they would eat a lot of ammo.

I'd play with it, but they are illegal here in California.

But I'd never buy one....I'd rather get a 3G trigger, and be almost as fast, and way more accurate.

Last edited by Art Eatman; March 20, 2013 at 09:42 AM. Reason: Corrected misspelled state name.
AGENT TIKKI is offline  
Old February 28, 2013, 04:04 PM   #59
Microgunner
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 6, 2006
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 2,939
I love mine, a lot of fun to shoot.

To save money I installed a CMMG Sierra .22lr upper and Timney 3# trigger (necessary for .22lr function).

It can still run through $50 worth of ammo very quickly but at least I can get some full auto trigger time.
__________________
Proud NRA Patron Member
Microgunner is offline  
Old February 28, 2013, 04:16 PM   #60
Microgunner
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 6, 2006
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 2,939
I noticed several people saying the Slide Fire stock is too wobbly and too expensive to shoot with an improper reach.
You guys do know that the slide fire feature can be turned off returning the rifle to a normal semi-auto statis, don't you?
You don't have to fire in full auto mode, you have a choice.
__________________
Proud NRA Patron Member
Microgunner is offline  
Old February 28, 2013, 08:04 PM   #61
HKFan9
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 3, 2008
Posts: 2,718
Maturity means making mature choices. This is not a mature choice.

Can you please explain why it is not a mature choice. I don't see owning something for pure enjoyment is any less mature. Most of us don't NEED a sailboat... or a $600 Fly Rod.... however they are the same function... a toy for an adult with a decent income. The speed limit is 65 on the highway so why does anyone need a car that can go faster? Is that also immature?

Next we won't need 5 round tubes on a shotgun to kill a squirrel so those will be considered high capacity and scary too.

I don't own a Slidefire but I have shot them on friends guns. They are FUN, and a lot less expensive and hassle free than buying a true NFA item. Truth is they are less controllable than a standard m16... however they are still plenty controllable. 3 round bursts on a standard target are fairly easy to accomplish when even first messing with the stock.
HKFan9 is offline  
Old March 18, 2013, 05:21 PM   #62
lcpiper
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 15, 2011
Posts: 1,405
I have no interest in them. It was fun shooting up the Army's ammo and man, with the A1s and the 60s we did burn some up on occasion in Korea. But on my own dime, no way. Besides, the best in the business spend most of their time(combat), shooting semi so I think that's all I need.
__________________
Colt M1911, AR-15 | S&W Model 19, Model 27| SIG P238 | Berreta 85B Cheetah | Ruger Blackhawk .357MAG, Bearcat "Shopkeeper" .22LR| Remington Marine Magnum SP 12GA., Model 700 SPS .223
lcpiper is offline  
Old March 19, 2013, 03:02 AM   #63
kozak6
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 16, 2005
Location: AZ
Posts: 2,322
This seems like an idea that might have made more sense 10 years ago.

I'd like to try one, but ammo costs are prohibitive.

If I had a suitable rifle, I'd rather dremel up a cheap stock and try to make my own than blow several hundred dollars on one.
kozak6 is offline  
Old March 19, 2013, 05:15 PM   #64
Dragline45
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 30, 2010
Posts: 2,485
It would be cool to put on something like the S&W or Ruger .22 AR's, otherwise it is just too expensive to burn through ammo like that, for me at least.
Dragline45 is offline  
Old March 19, 2013, 07:00 PM   #65
Mausermolt
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 16, 2007
Location: Ory-gun
Posts: 502
ive got one for my AK-74. when i first bought it i had a blast! but now it mostly sits in the safe. whenever my friends ask if ive shot one i say "yup come to the desert with me and we will go shoot some jack rabbits with mine" you should see the look on their faces when they lite off that first mag. i keep it to watch peoples reactions now. BTW shooting at running jacks with it is really entertaining but mostly unsuccessful :P i dont like how short they are is the only drawback i see in them. but its a cool toy. just like my 1911 and my Hi-Power. am i ever going to to carry them concealed? no. am i ever going to have to storm the beaches of Normandy with them? 99% sure im not. so whats the point? because i enjoy shooting them. case in point
__________________
Molon Labe
Mausermolt is offline  
Old March 19, 2013, 08:27 PM   #66
mrvco
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 1, 2011
Posts: 214
bump-firing = meh
mrvco is offline  
Old March 19, 2013, 08:29 PM   #67
FALshootist
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 24, 2002
Posts: 589
I agree with Willie Sutton. Its not like a magazine. Its a lot of fun, I'm sure, if you can find ammo.

But when politicians bring it out, it's not an accessory, its the gun. And its the kind of scary machine gun that politicians, liberals and progressives believe should be banned.

The truth of the matter is that the pro gun folks have been pushing the "mil spec" guns. And I'll be the first to admit that that's the AR I would buy if I'm buying. And contrary to our public statements, the only difference between a true M4 and a 6920 is the fire control group and the auto sear. So I am not surprised when liberals don't see the difference. For them, a slide fire stock seals the deal.

As was previously inferred, perception in many cases wins the argument, not fact.
__________________
"Iwoke up this morning and got myself a beer. The future is uncertain and the end is always near."
FALshootist is offline  
Old March 19, 2013, 10:39 PM   #68
tahunua001
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 21, 2011
Location: Idaho
Posts: 6,144
it's a great way to burn through $25 in 2 seconds flat...

I don't have much else to add.
__________________
ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar.
I never said half the crap people said I did-Albert Einstein
You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin
Bean counters told me I couldn't fire a man for being in a wheelchair, did it anyway. Ramps are expensive.-Cave Johnson.
tahunua001 is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 08:56 AM   #69
psychopuppy1
Member
 
Join Date: December 28, 2011
Location: weedsport,N.Y.
Posts: 64
My friend has one on his AK. I heard him shooting at friend#2s house ,went over to see! Along came friend #4, so we all got to shoot this toy, a couple of times each! So that was 7, 30 round mags gone in seconds each! A lot of fun, for sure! Friend #1 went thru a lot of ammo!!
I have to say, after the second time around, when the gun wasnt given enough time to cool, it would start to jam, and only do one or two shots. We let it cool, and it would shoot well for a mag, then get slow again!




But, damn, it was fun!!!!!!

I also have played with full auto when uncle sam was paying, but they wont let me back in! So to play full auto, this worked great! Just cuase I played with it back then dosent mean I dont wanna play with it anymore!!!
psychopuppy1 is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 09:38 PM   #70
btmj
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 1, 2011
Location: Near St. Louis, Missouri
Posts: 766
Well it will come as no surprise that I am in 100% agreement with Willie Sutton. Very early in this thread I said that slide fire stocks are for gun-clowns, and I took a fair bit of push back over that comment.

There are some activities which are legal, and should remain legal, but which are also dumb, socially unacceptable, and which result in ridicule and ostracization. Publishing a racist newsletter would be one example. Using profanity around other peoples children is another. Failing to bathe regularly and use deodorant would be another. None of these activities should be illegal. But none of them are desirable either. If I do these activities I can expect to be ridiculed, avoided, and eventually ostracized. Positive peer pressure works, and it serves a positive social function.

Bump firing and slide fire stocks should remain legal. But this falls into the same category as farting in an elevator, or getting drunk at your daughters wedding... legal? yes. Good idea? no.

By using the term "gun clown" I was trying to promote a standard of behavior. Some things which are legal under the 2nd amendment should, nonetheless, be frowned upon and discouraged.

Jim
btmj is offline  
Old March 20, 2013, 10:45 PM   #71
Ludwig Von Mises
Member
 
Join Date: September 24, 2012
Location: Nowhere in particular
Posts: 52
Quote:
Well it will come as no surprise that I am in 100% agreement with Willie Sutton. Very early in this thread I said that slide fire stocks are for gun-clowns, and I took a fair bit of push back over that comment.

There are some activities which are legal, and should remain legal, but which are also dumb, socially unacceptable, and which result in ridicule and ostracization. Publishing a racist newsletter would be one example. Using profanity around other peoples children is another. Failing to bathe regularly and use deodorant would be another. None of these activities should be illegal. But none of them are desirable either. If I do these activities I can expect to be ridiculed, avoided, and eventually ostracized. Positive peer pressure works, and it serves a positive social function.

Bump firing and slide fire stocks should remain legal. But this falls into the same category as farting in an elevator, or getting drunk at your daughters wedding... legal? yes. Good idea? no.

By using the term "gun clown" I was trying to promote a standard of behavior. Some things which are legal under the 2nd amendment should, nonetheless, be frowned upon and discouraged.

Jim
Most sensible argument in thread. +1

Also, even though it isn't illegal, nor do I have anything to hide per se, I'd rather not have my neighbors wondering whats making those bursts and calling the authorities. I know class 3's who won't bring their toys outside, even with federal law behind them, for the exact same reason. Underground or indoors. Besides, most outdoor ranges I've been to, and every single DNR range, prohibits more than a few shots bursted at a time, and state ranges prohibit trigger devices altogether. Rubber bands included.

Not to mention the thirty minute wait when some yahoo with a slidefire hit the ceiling and bent two target channels out of shape completely. Guy cost himself like 500 dollars because he wanted to have fun, but hey, isn't this the story of everyones life at one point or another?

As someone else said, a decade or two ago, this would have been awesome. But with the price of .223 and .308 approaching sell-your-blood-plasma levels, its prohibitively expensive for Joe Everyman the Plumber and if you're rich enough to rip through perfectly good ammo like that, with the shortage going on right now, karma will probably bite you in the ass.

With the publics stereotyping of gun owners in general as militant and impulsive anti-government maniacs, we don't need to give them any more ammo. Ha.
Ludwig Von Mises is offline  
Old March 21, 2013, 03:27 AM   #72
Justice06RR
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 21, 2010
Location: Central FL
Posts: 1,267
The only cons I see is that it costs too much for the bump fire stock.

I think it can be a fun tool if you have the ammo/funds to back it up. Its definitely better than going the ATF route, applying for a stamp, waiting, getting registered into the ATF system, then paying for the full-auto weapon of your choice.

I would say it is not so bad on a 22lr platform.
Justice06RR is offline  
Old March 21, 2013, 07:45 AM   #73
Skans
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 20, 2008
Posts: 7,865
If the ammo shortage keep up the way it is, I bet AK and AR slide-fire stocks will come down in price a little. Do I need one? No. Would I buy one at some "acceptable" price point? Yes.
Skans is offline  
Old March 21, 2013, 08:44 AM   #74
psychopuppy1
Member
 
Join Date: December 28, 2011
Location: weedsport,N.Y.
Posts: 64
By using the term "gun clown" I was trying to promote a standard of behavior. Some things which are legal under the 2nd amendment should, nonetheless, be frowned upon and discouraged.

Jim


You have the constitutional right to call people "gun clowns" It isnt very mature of you, so it kinda negates your whole Mature argument!
I dont consider myself a "gun-clown" by any means!
Was it fun to shoot the slider? By all means, YES!
Would I buy one? NOPE!

I also have a problem with you trying to change the perception of ,,,,,I dont need it,nor do I want it! Who died and left you in charge? Obamma and his liberal cronneys are trying to change the perception of the peopls minds in all kinds of ways, and I wont/dont stand for it! Shall I put you on my list of people to swamp with e-mails and phone calls to uphold the second amendment?

I ignored the first Gun-clown statement, but you want to push it, I'll speak my peice! Many have died for my right to do so!
psychopuppy1 is offline  
Old March 21, 2013, 10:12 AM   #75
btmj
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 1, 2011
Location: Near St. Louis, Missouri
Posts: 766
Yeah, meanwhile Sen Ted Cruz is trying to explain to the Senate and the World that a semi-automatic firearm is fundementally different than a military weapon because each pull of the trigger results in just one cartridge being fired....

..... Oh but wait !!! Cooter and Uncle Jesse have a youtube video of an AR-15 going full-auto-equivalent with their stupid slide fire stock... then Fatboy Marvin bump-fires his glock and throws that up on youtube also... all accompanied by adolescent guffaws and snorting giggles... yuk-yuk...

Thanks a lot clowns...
btmj is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:18 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.14078 seconds with 7 queries