The Caliber thing

TinyDee · February 17, 2013, 08:17 PM

I went to a revolver some time ago and now am thinking of adding a semi auto again. But in talking to some dealers I have been told the 9MM is the way to go today. They said the 45 was really out of date. I always had one before and wonder just what to think about this. Advice?

4runnerman · February 17, 2013, 08:21 PM

IMHO-- The dealers you are talking to are out of Date. The 45 ACP continues to be a very saught after caliber. Nothing against the 9MM either. They are also a very good caliber. Much cheaper to shoot than the 45 ACP is. In the end-Grab what you like. Me-- I stuck with the 45 just because.

SIGSHR · February 17, 2013, 08:23 PM

Starting the Caliber Wars is what pistoleros do on a Slow News Day.The 45-I presume you mean 45 ACP-is as out of date as the 30/06 or the 12 gauge.

BarryLee · February 17, 2013, 08:25 PM

The 9mm is probably the most common caliber, most available and least expensive of the three more mainstream calibers (9mm, .40S&W & .45ACP). Folks will argue the point for pages and pages, but really good quality ammo in any of the three will do very well. The trick is selecting the handgun and ammo that best fits your application. For a general use semi-auto I would probably start with a nice medium sized 9mm and go from there.

KMAX · February 17, 2013, 08:32 PM

Go for what you like, not what somebody else says is "out of date". Revolvers are out of date and 45Colt is out of date. I had a blast this morning with my out of date 45Colt single action revolver. I don't think 45acp will ever be out of date if you consider the popularity of the 1911 platform alone. Get what you like.

**James K** · February 17, 2013, 08:46 PM

I, too, am something of a .45 ACP fan, but the reality is that almost no professionals carry .45 any more, it is all 9mm. Nor, AFAIK, is the .45 any longer the service pistol of any nation. Barring Obama banning all guns by executive order, there will probably be .45 fans into the next century, but the fact of the matter is that by nearly any practical standard it is obsolete, just like the .45 Colt and the .45-70.

Jim

Groundhog34 · February 17, 2013, 09:32 PM

"I, too, am something of a .45 ACP fan, but the reality is that almost no professionals carry .45 any more, it is all 9mm. Nor, AFAIK, is the .45 any longer the service pistol of any nation. Barring Obama banning all guns by executive order, there will probably be .45 fans into the next century, but the fact of the matter is that by nearly any practical standard it is obsolete, just like the .45 Colt and the .45-70. "

The reason no "professionals" carry 45 is the result of affirmative action the "manning down" of law enforcement and the military. 45's have a good bit more recoil then the 9mm. Women and weaker males that affirmative action have forced into the "professional" field often cannot handle the cartridge helping increase the popularity of the 9mm. That said many "professionals" employed by agencies that allow a 45 to be carried by those proficient to handle it do.

Obsolete NEVER

ttarp · February 17, 2013, 10:09 PM

I doubt anyone who gets shot really cares too much if the caliber was obsolete or how its ballistics rank with 9mm, .40 or whatever. It has pro's and cons like every other caliber out there. It's not being phased out of production or anything if that's your concern.

**JohnKSa** · February 17, 2013, 10:15 PM

Quote:

But in talking to some dealers I have been told the 9MM is the way to go today. They said the 45 was really out of date.

The 9mm is actually an older cartridge than the .45ACP by a few years. Both are over 100 years old.

It is true that 9mm is the most popular centerfire pistol cartridge in the U.S. as far as civilian sales go. I believe that .40S&W is tops in the U.S. LE market.

Quote:

I, too, am something of a .45 ACP fan, but the reality is that almost no professionals carry .45 any more, it is all 9mm.

It has dropped in popularity, I think. The last data I have is from a December 2011 article indicating that the .45ACP was trailing the .357SIG in the LE market.

TunnelRat · February 17, 2013, 10:38 PM

Quote:

Women and weaker males that affirmative action have forced into the "professional" field often cannot handle the cartridge helping increase the popularity of the 9mm.

Wow, that's rather ignorant IMO.

**hogdogs** · February 17, 2013, 11:10 PM

So many reasons for the .45 dropping from favor for other cartridge choices than the diatribe put forth by groundhog..

WOW is all I got for that...

Brent

**Art Eatman** · February 17, 2013, 11:13 PM

"The reason no "professionals" carry 45 is the result of affirmative action the "manning down" of law enforcement and the military."

Gigglesnort. I'd halfway expect to hear that when the Gunshop Commandos are all gathered around, pontificating on their version of the Real World.

Come to think of it, I have.

Dang near seventy years worth of it.

**Tom Servo** · February 17, 2013, 11:36 PM

Quote:

Gigglesnort. I'd halfway expect to hear that when the Gunshop Commandos are all gathered around, pontificating on their version of the Real World.

In Gushop Commando Real World, everyone has Viking chest hair and a beard like Chris Costa. Everyone. Square dance night is pretty awkward and quite alarming to witness.

Quote:

The last data I have is from a December 2011 article indicating that the .45ACP was trailing the .357SIG in the LE market.

That doesn't count for much, though. LE has never really embraced the .45 all that much. By the time automatics came into regular use, magazine capacity was a big consideration, and the 9mm (and later .40 S&W) won out on that front.

As long as there are guns for it, the loading will stay alive. As long as guns are still being produced for it, it will thrive. Most major manufacturers are making first-tier pistols in .45, and Springfield's new little polymer dealie is selling like hotcakes.

I don't see the .45 going away anytime soon. Now, if they were referring to .45 GAP, that's a whole other matter...

Constantine · February 18, 2013, 12:41 PM

Salesmen do and say salesmen things.

That's one of the stupidest things I've ever heard a salesmen posing as a weapons professional, every say. Almost as dumb as a shotgun blast will send the intruder flying.

I bet he was trying to sell you an expensive 9mm.

Take what almost everyone says with a grain of salt.

1-DAB · February 18, 2013, 12:48 PM

i should go into business selling grains of salt....then i could afford to buy as much 'out of favor' ammo as i want.

Constantine · February 18, 2013, 12:52 PM

Quote:

i should go into business selling grains of salt....then i could afford to buy as much 'out of favor' ammo as i want.

You know they seriously have "flavored salts".

tahunua001 · February 18, 2013, 02:36 PM

considering that 9mm has been around almost as long as 45ACP their argument is retarded. people have been trying to find a way to phase out the 45ACP for decades and the closest anyone came was the 10mm, how popular is that one?

45ACP may not have the best ammo capacity but aside from 10mm and 44 automag it is still the hardest hitting semi cartridge around. guys working behind the counter have too much time on their hands and generally talk out the wrong end to try and justify why something's not in stock or to point you towards a newer, more expensive model.

I have stopped going to certain LGS for just that reason. too much opinions floating around and being passed off as the gospel. heck one of them is wearing a springfield shirt every time I walk in there but the only guns he recomends are glocks, glocks, the fn 5.7 in the corner for $1100 and more glocks...

**Tom Servo** · February 18, 2013, 03:07 PM

Quote:

That's one of the stupidest things I've ever heard a salesmen posing as a weapons professional, every say. Almost as dumb as a shotgun blast will send the intruder flying.

That's untrue. According to Gun Shop logic, the sound of the action being cycled will cause any would-be intruder to wet his pants and run to the nearest clergyperson to repent his sins.

peacefulgary · February 18, 2013, 03:36 PM

The .45 ACP certainly isn't "out of date", but it has lost lost some of its appeal, mostly due to the popularity of "high capacity" pistols.
One can have a full sized 9mm pistol with 17 rounds and still have a slim enough grip for the average Joe.
High capacity .45 pistols usually have a fat grip that is too large for average size hands.
And the .40 S&W has chipped away at the .45 following since it offers the supposed compromise between bullet size and capacity vs the 9mm and the .45 ACP.

Interestingly enough, if "high capacity" magazines are banned and folks are limited to 10 rounds, I suspect the .45 ACP will become more popular than it is right now.
If you can only carry 10 rounds then there's really not much incentive to go with the weaker caliber.

zeke4351 · February 18, 2013, 03:42 PM

I think I will drag out my 10mm. I guess that will be better than all those extra bullets.

BillyJack3 · February 18, 2013, 04:02 PM

I love both calibers. My 9 holds 15 rounds and my .45 holds 8 (Sig 1911). Right now, I shoot my .45 all the time. Because so many people have run out and purchased hi cap 9mm pistols, 9mm ammo is no where to be found around here. I can still find .45 on the shelves if I time it right though.

KMAX · February 18, 2013, 04:12 PM

Gotta agree with BillyJack3 on this. I have a lot of 45acp. I have to be more conservative with my 9mm. I found 45 at Walmart this morning, but no other pistol ammo.

zeke4351 · February 18, 2013, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by James K

I, too, am something of a .45 ACP fan, but the reality is that almost no professionals carry .45 any more, it is all 9mm. Nor, AFAIK, is the .45 any longer the service pistol of any nation. Barring Obama banning all guns by executive order, there will probably be .45 fans into the next century, but the fact of the matter is that by nearly any practical standard it is obsolete, just like the .45 Colt and the .45-70.

Jim

I don't know what part of the country you are in but all the pros around here carry .40 S&W and I thought that was the going caliber for this day and time. The state police went from 10mm to 40 and in doing so sold off a bunch of 45's unfired. They changed their mind to the 40 before ever putting the 45 in service. I don't know how or why all that came about but it seems all other police around here carry the 40 also. Seems to me the only place the 40 is not popular is on the gun forums. The majority of people that carry a pistol with their life depending on it in my world carry a 40. It does kick too much for a lot of target practice.

rem44m · February 18, 2013, 05:37 PM

I love the .45 fat and slow. Like my first girlfriend.

shootniron · February 18, 2013, 05:46 PM

Quote:

That doesn't count for much, though. LE has never really embraced the .45 all that much. By the time automatics came into regular use, magazine capacity was a big consideration, and the 9mm (and later .40 S&W) won out on that front.

Very true...and the .40 was helped along considerably by Glock and it's relationship with law enforcement.

February 17, 2013, 08:17 PM	#1
TinyDee Senior Member Join Date: February 27, 2009 Location: Tennessee Posts: 341	The Caliber thing I went to a revolver some time ago and now am thinking of adding a semi auto again. But in talking to some dealers I have been told the 9MM is the way to go today. They said the 45 was really out of date. I always had one before and wonder just what to think about this. Advice?

February 17, 2013, 08:21 PM	#2
4runnerman Senior Member Join Date: January 16, 2010 Location: Minnsota Posts: 1,840	IMHO-- The dealers you are talking to are out of Date. The 45 ACP continues to be a very saught after caliber. Nothing against the 9MM either. They are also a very good caliber. Much cheaper to shoot than the 45 ACP is. In the end-Grab what you like. Me-- I stuck with the 45 just because. __________________ NRA Certified RSO NwCP- Performance Isn't Optional

February 17, 2013, 08:25 PM	#4
BarryLee Senior Member Join Date: July 29, 2010 Location: The ATL (OTP) Posts: 2,108	The 9mm is probably the most common caliber, most available and least expensive of the three more mainstream calibers (9mm, .40S&W & .45ACP). Folks will argue the point for pages and pages, but really good quality ammo in any of the three will do very well. The trick is selecting the handgun and ammo that best fits your application. For a general use semi-auto I would probably start with a nice medium sized 9mm and go from there. __________________ A major source of objection to a free economy is precisely that it ... gives people what they want instead of what a particular group thinks they ought to want. Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. - Milton Friedman

February 17, 2013, 08:32 PM	#5
KMAX Senior Member Join Date: June 20, 2011 Location: Texas Posts: 778	Go for what you like, not what somebody else says is "out of date". Revolvers are out of date and 45Colt is out of date. I had a blast this morning with my out of date 45Colt single action revolver. I don't think 45acp will ever be out of date if you consider the popularity of the 1911 platform alone. Get what you like. __________________ This is my gun. There are many like her, but this one is mine. With Freedom Comes Responsibility!

February 17, 2013, 08:46 PM	#6
James K Staff Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 16,439	I, too, am something of a .45 ACP fan, but the reality is that almost no professionals carry .45 any more, it is all 9mm. Nor, AFAIK, is the .45 any longer the service pistol of any nation. Barring Obama banning all guns by executive order, there will probably be .45 fans into the next century, but the fact of the matter is that by nearly any practical standard it is obsolete, just like the .45 Colt and the .45-70. Jim __________________ Jim K

February 17, 2013, 08:23 PM	#3
SIGSHR Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2005 Posts: 2,594	Starting the Caliber Wars is what pistoleros do on a Slow News Day.The 45-I presume you mean 45 ACP-is as out of date as the 30/06 or the 12 gauge.

February 17, 2013, 09:32 PM	#7
Groundhog34 Member Join Date: December 15, 2007 Location: Alabama Posts: 86	"I, too, am something of a .45 ACP fan, but the reality is that almost no professionals carry .45 any more, it is all 9mm. Nor, AFAIK, is the .45 any longer the service pistol of any nation. Barring Obama banning all guns by executive order, there will probably be .45 fans into the next century, but the fact of the matter is that by nearly any practical standard it is obsolete, just like the .45 Colt and the .45-70. " The reason no "professionals" carry 45 is the result of affirmative action the "manning down" of law enforcement and the military. 45's have a good bit more recoil then the 9mm. Women and weaker males that affirmative action have forced into the "professional" field often cannot handle the cartridge helping increase the popularity of the 9mm. That said many "professionals" employed by agencies that allow a 45 to be carried by those proficient to handle it do. Obsolete NEVER

February 17, 2013, 10:09 PM	#8
ttarp Member Join Date: January 4, 2013 Posts: 48	I doubt anyone who gets shot really cares too much if the caliber was obsolete or how its ballistics rank with 9mm, .40 or whatever. It has pro's and cons like every other caliber out there. It's not being phased out of production or anything if that's your concern.

February 17, 2013, 11:10 PM	#11
hogdogs Staff Join Date: October 31, 2007 Location: Western Florida panhandle Posts: 10,691	So many reasons for the .45 dropping from favor for other cartridge choices than the diatribe put forth by groundhog.. WOW is all I got for that... Brent __________________ Finally have designs going up in the Hogdogs Outdoor Apparel online store. http://www.cafepress.com/hogdogsoutdoorapparel Thanks for lookin'...

February 17, 2013, 11:13 PM	#12
Art Eatman Staff Lead Join Date: November 13, 1998 Location: Terlingua, TX, USA Posts: 20,947	"The reason no "professionals" carry 45 is the result of affirmative action the "manning down" of law enforcement and the military." Gigglesnort. I'd halfway expect to hear that when the Gunshop Commandos are all gathered around, pontificating on their version of the Real World. Come to think of it, I have. Dang near seventy years worth of it. __________________ You're from BATFE? Come right in! I use all your fine products!

February 18, 2013, 12:41 PM	#14
Constantine Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2010 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 4,052	Salesmen do and say salesmen things. That's one of the stupidest things I've ever heard a salesmen posing as a weapons professional, every say. Almost as dumb as a shotgun blast will send the intruder flying. I bet he was trying to sell you an expensive 9mm. Take what almost everyone says with a grain of salt. __________________ Sáncte Míchael Archángele, defénde nos in proélio, cóntra nequítiam et insídias diáboli ésto præsídium. Ímperet ílli Déus, súpplices deprecámur: tuque, prínceps milítiæ cæléstis, Sátanam aliósque spíritus malígnos, qui ad perditiónem animárum pervagántur in múndo, divína virtúte, in inférnum detrúde. Ámen

February 18, 2013, 12:48 PM	#15
1-DAB Member Join Date: May 5, 2010 Location: Santa Fe, NM Posts: 86	i should go into business selling grains of salt....then i could afford to buy as much 'out of favor' ammo as i want.

February 18, 2013, 02:36 PM	#17
tahunua001 Senior Member Join Date: July 21, 2011 Location: Idaho Posts: 3,631	considering that 9mm has been around almost as long as 45ACP their argument is retarded. people have been trying to find a way to phase out the 45ACP for decades and the closest anyone came was the 10mm, how popular is that one? 45ACP may not have the best ammo capacity but aside from 10mm and 44 automag it is still the hardest hitting semi cartridge around. guys working behind the counter have too much time on their hands and generally talk out the wrong end to try and justify why something's not in stock or to point you towards a newer, more expensive model. I have stopped going to certain LGS for just that reason. too much opinions floating around and being passed off as the gospel. heck one of them is wearing a springfield shirt every time I walk in there but the only guns he recomends are glocks, glocks, the fn 5.7 in the corner for $1100 and more glocks... __________________ all guns lost in a tragic smelting accident. I never said half the crap people said I did-Albert Einstein You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin Bean counters told me I couldn't fire a man for being in a wheelchair, did it anyway. Ramps are expensive.-Cave Johnson.

February 18, 2013, 03:36 PM	#19
peacefulgary Senior Member Join Date: January 26, 2011 Location: USA Posts: 395	The .45 ACP certainly isn't "out of date", but it has lost lost some of its appeal, mostly due to the popularity of "high capacity" pistols. One can have a full sized 9mm pistol with 17 rounds and still have a slim enough grip for the average Joe. High capacity .45 pistols usually have a fat grip that is too large for average size hands. And the .40 S&W has chipped away at the .45 following since it offers the supposed compromise between bullet size and capacity vs the 9mm and the .45 ACP. Interestingly enough, if "high capacity" magazines are banned and folks are limited to 10 rounds, I suspect the .45 ACP will become more popular than it is right now. If you can only carry 10 rounds then there's really not much incentive to go with the weaker caliber.

February 18, 2013, 03:42 PM	#20
zeke4351 Member Join Date: February 13, 2013 Posts: 32	The Caliber thing I think I will drag out my 10mm. I guess that will be better than all those extra bullets.

February 18, 2013, 04:02 PM	#21
BillyJack3 Senior Member Join Date: May 2, 2012 Posts: 261	I love both calibers. My 9 holds 15 rounds and my .45 holds 8 (Sig 1911). Right now, I shoot my .45 all the time. Because so many people have run out and purchased hi cap 9mm pistols, 9mm ammo is no where to be found around here. I can still find .45 on the shelves if I time it right though.

February 18, 2013, 04:12 PM	#22
KMAX Senior Member Join Date: June 20, 2011 Location: Texas Posts: 778	Gotta agree with BillyJack3 on this. I have a lot of 45acp. I have to be more conservative with my 9mm. I found 45 at Walmart this morning, but no other pistol ammo. __________________ This is my gun. There are many like her, but this one is mine. With Freedom Comes Responsibility!

February 18, 2013, 05:37 PM	#24
rem44m Senior Member Join Date: August 18, 2011 Location: Utah Posts: 157	I love the .45 fat and slow. Like my first girlfriend. __________________ I'd rather have it and not need it then need it and not have it. "If gun owners are as violent as anti-gunners said we are, there wouldn't be any anti's left"