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Old April 14, 2013, 03:35 PM   #1
VolusiaJ
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Noob Reloading Question (9mm)

Hello All,

I've have just recently got into reloading and I have a couple reloading questions for the more experienced out there. I have been able to scrape together all of my components for reloading and this is what I ended up with:

Lee Classic Turret Kit
1 lb of Powder: IMR SR-4756
1000 Cartridges: WCC (Western Cartridge Company) brass
2000 Primers: CCI Small Pistol Primers
1000 Projectiles: 9mm (.356) 124 grain hollow base flat point

On the Hodgdon website when I input Pistol/9mm/IMR/SR 4756 it gave me the following listing:

9mm Luger
Cartridge Load Data Starting Loads
Maximum Loads
Bullet Weight (Gr.) Powder Bullet Diam. C.O.L. Grs. Vel. (ft/s) Pressure Grs. Vel. (ft/s) Pressure
115 GR. LRN SR 4756 .356" 1.100" 4.5 1027 25,000 PSI 5.2 1145 31,600 PSI
125 GR. LCN SR 4756 .356" 1.125" 4.2 972 24,400 PSI 4.8 1071 30,200 PSI
125 GR. SIE FMJ SR 4756 .355" 1.090" 4.5 973 25,700 PSI 4.9 1037 28,700 PSI
147 GR. HDY XTP SR 4756 .355" 1.100" 3.0 668 21,800 PSI 3.6 834 29,900 PSI

I down loaded the IMR Handloaders Guide and it stated:

9 MM LUGER
REM. CASE; CCI 500 PR.
REM. 124 GR. MC; .354" DIA.;
4.0" PISTOL BBL.; 1.125" C.O.L.
SR 7625 4.9 1040 32300
SR 4756 6.3C 1160 32400

Further, I downloaded a Pistol grain guide but it just stated the following for 9mm:
Starting Loads Max. Loads
Bullet Weight (Grain) Powder Bullet Diam. C.O.L. Grains Vel. (FPS) Pressure Grains Vel. (FPS) Pressure
124 Grain FMJ WSF 0.355 1.169 4.7 1015 27,700 5.3 1115 32,700
124 Grain Lead RN WSF 0.355 1.169 4 945 22,200 4.7 1055 27,300

So after all of that, here are my questions:
Why isn't 124 grain listed in some of the documents?
Why is there such a variation in these docs. Even the bullet diameter varies from .354 to .356!
The IMR Handloaders Guide at least mentions SR 4576. Should I use that as my guide? If so, why is there a "C" after 6.3?
I wanted to get a second opinion since I am a complete noob at reloading but long and short, How many grains should I use for the powder?
Thanks! I appreciate your insight!

Jason
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Old April 14, 2013, 04:38 PM   #2
Misssissippi Dave
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The c after a given load normally indicates it is a compressed load.

There is a great difference in the amount of powder used depending on how deep you seat the bullet and the type of bullet it is. Generally you use less powder for lead and plated bullets compared to jacketed bullets. The profile of the bullet also makes a difference how much resistance is experienced as it goes down the barrel. The length of the barrel used also will make differences.

You always should work a load up you are using. You start making at least 5 rounds at the lowest data level and increase up to but never exceeding the maximum level in your data. This allows you to find the point that works best for your gun. What works for me in my gun might not work all that well in your.

I prefer to use Winchester, Hodgdon and AA powders in 9 mm.
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Old April 14, 2013, 04:49 PM   #3
Shootest
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124g or 125g it don’t make much difference.
The variation is because different testers use different components and equipment, thus they get different results.
The C indicates a compressed charge.
Start low with as long a COL as you can and work up.
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Old April 14, 2013, 07:07 PM   #4
VolusiaJ
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I appreciate your input but I am still confused due to the differing data from different sources. What I am hoping for is someone to point me in a direction (like the Hodgden website etc.) and say, "see the number located ..." that is what you should use and here's why. I really need someone to teach me how to fish (and not just give me the fish.) Thanks!
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Old April 14, 2013, 07:59 PM   #5
Misssissippi Dave
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Go to the IMR web site. The difference between 124 grain bullet and 125 grain bullet is not going to change things in pistol loads. What does change things is how deep you seat the bullet and the type of bullet you are loading. Lead bullets and plated bullets normally use the same starting and maximum load data. Jacketed bullets need more powder to get the bullet out the barrel at the same speed as lead. The heavy jacket has more resistance. Load 5 rounds up at the minimum data and 5 more with .1 grains more until you are .1 grains under the max level. These you are going to test to see if they cycle the pistol and once you can do that which load is more accurate than the others. I suggest shooting from a rest, sandbags or some stable surface to reduce the human factor. The overall length is determined by your magazines and the rifling of the barrel. You need to preform the experiment with each load to determine which formula is right for your pistol. This will keep you safer than just trying something I or someone else might type up. You never know if the person is on their second six pack at the time of posting or just hits the wrong key.

I suggest reading a manual on reloading to get the best understanding why you are doing these things. Many things needed to load rifle ammo also apply to loading pistol ammo. A lot of the prep work needed for rifle ammo isn't needed for pistol. Keeping things safe is always best.
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Old April 14, 2013, 08:35 PM   #6
Mobuck
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That powder would not be my first shoice for the 9x19 but if it's listed in a reputable manual go for it.
You need to buy and READ a hardcopy reloading manual. There's a lot of information and most of the answers you'll need to safely reload. One or two grains in bullet weight is less important than bullet shape and OAL.
The others have answered your other questions well enough.
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Old April 14, 2013, 09:20 PM   #7
57K
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SR 4756 wouldn't be my first choice, either, but there's nothing wrong with it and I know some reloaders who have had good accuracy using it. You didn't state what pressure standard was used in the IMR data. Either way, it would be under the max. standard pressure for 9mm at 35,000 PSI or 33,000 CUP. I would use the IMR data and the MAX. charge of 6.3 grs. will be a compressed powder charge. It is safe to use a 90% load for a START charge in the absence of a START charge recommendation. That would give you a START charge of 5.7 grs. I would not load any shorter than their 1.125" OACL recommendation. You didn't mention which pistol you're using, but that shouldn't be much of an issue with the 1.125" OACL recommendation. You can, however, determine what OACL you should be using for YOUR 9mm. Take a fired case that has a spent primer in it and NO powder. Start the bullet into the fired case to where the case just gets a bite on the bullet and will hold it in place. With the barrel removed from your pistol, insert this "dummy" round into the chamber and push on the case rim until the case stops forward movement at the front of the chamber. If you can't push it in by hand, use a plastic mallet or a block of wood and very lightly tap the case rim until it stops forward movement. In all likelihood, you will be able to push the case forward until it stops with thumb pressure. Remove the "dummy" cartridge from the chamber and measure its OACL without applying too much pressure with your dial caliper. You don't want to seat the bullet any further into the case while measuring. Make up 4 more "dummies" and repeat the process to make sure you're getting a consistent OACL measurement. This will be the MAX. allowable OACL and when you start actual loading, you need to set the seating stem in the seating die so that your loaded rounds have an OACL that is .005 - .010" shorter than what you measured with the "dummies". Just as an example, say your 5 "dummies" averaged 1.160" for the MAX. allowable OACL. You would want to seat your bullets to get an OACL of 1.155" or 1.150" depending on how consistent you can get OACL with your press. If your OACLs vary as much as +/- .005", then you'll want to seat .010" deeper than the "dummies" at 1.150". You do not want to seat bullets for an OACL shorter than IMR's recommendation of 1.125" There is not enough difference, between your bullet and the Rem. 124 gr. MC that IMR used, to make much if any measurable difference.

Once you burn up the SR 4756, or when you find it available, I would change to a different powder and particularly to one that has plenty of data for loading it. Personally, I use Ramshot Silhouette because it is treated to have very low muzzle-Flash and it has excellent pressure stability so you can work up to higher powder charges with confidence, but I would do that .1 gr. at a time and follow the data provided by www.ramshot.com if there's no data in your load manual for Silhouette in the 9mm. True Blue is also a very good choice for 9mm and just about any handgun cartridge in common use. But there is no need to feel handicapped by using SR 4756 for now.
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Old April 14, 2013, 10:16 PM   #8
WESHOOT2
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what to do? fish!

What I actually do:

I find as much published data as I can (I've been collecting data since 1975).
I find the lowest START load published.
I find the highest MAX load published.
I make up start loads somewhere in the middle.

Like your example; I'd start at 5.0g, your primer and case and bullet, OAL (this is based on both the specific bullet chosen, and the specific launch platform) of 1.120--1.145".
I can't offer an exact OAL without more info on the specific bullet.

I make ten test ten. Work? Make and test twenty.
Blew up the gun? Back off your charge.
Didn't function reliably? Confirm a functioning OAL, and then work upward in .2g increments.
Change ANY component? Start over.
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Old April 15, 2013, 07:57 PM   #9
VolusiaJ
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Join Date: April 13, 2013
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Going fishing!

Thanks everyone for the time and insight. I am on a business trip though Friday but I plan on getting started on Saturday. I will probably post more questions then since I would rather keep all my digits! BTW, to answer the questions posed, I shoot a XDM 9 and the projectile that I was able to scrounge was Berry's 9mm 124gr HBFP (http://www.berrysmfg.com/product-i14...FP_1000ct.aspx.) Thanks again!
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